Endwalker is the most controversial expansion

[Celine_Aurora]

they just point out that in the grand scheme of things most people think like them. They generally know how to present opinions as opinions.

Is "Everyone and Metacritic thinks it's great so I must be right" what you'd call presenting an opinion as an opinion?

[TowaIsBestGirl]

Except that it primarily is. Look around and most of the pro-EW crowd doesn't try to force their beliefs on the naysayers, they just point out that in the grand scheme of things most people think like them. They generally know how to present opinions as opinions. The same sadly can't be said for the bitter doom crew.

It's not that those who are approving of Endwalker's story aren't trying to assert their views as correct. It's much more so that they utilize less aggressive methods and words, and dare I say it deceptive framing to present their stance in a more positive light. Your particular chosen method, for instance? Assuming that due to some vague majority you can never fully define is supportive of your views is a known psychological method of manipulation.

The layman's terms define it as thus:

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dict...wn%20advantage

[AwesomeJr44]

Look around and most of the pro-EW crowd doesn't try to force their beliefs on the naysayers

And yet this is you in literally every thread:

[Lunaxia]

I think you misunderstood what the person was saying then...

What I don't get is people who don't like the story, if you think opinions truly matter, why do you all gotta be "I don't like the story, so I'm going to tell YOU why YOU shouldn't like it either and continue to bash your head against my opinion about it until you accept that the story isn't good because I say it isn't!"

I'll be the first to admit that the vitriol that occasionally comes from the disappointed-with-EW-camp can be excessive (typically aimed at certain characters), but there is some strong projection going on here that feels a little manipulative.

Ever since a certain thread gained traction as a safe space to harbour views outside of hailing Endwalker as a masterpiece of storytelling, it's been fans of the story who have done their level best to insist that any other opinion is categorically wrong because "look how many people liked it!" with such scarcely-concealed seething fury I'm often surprised they're able to type properly. From continually haunting these threads and derailing rational discussions with open hostility to calling "naysayers" everything under the sun including deluded, bitter, stupid, illiterate, in denial or even "trolls", because a contrary point of view is simply so unfathomable it couldn't possibly be genuine, it's as if some of them are incapable of accepting there's a reasonable population that found Endwalker to be sorely lacking in quite a lot of respects and won't be happy until they've scoured the boards of their dissenting opinion.

Trying to pretend fans have been bothering to join these discussions in good faith only to be spurned away by the Endwalker-hating meanies is not only misleading but bordering on oblique gaslighting at this point, because very rarely does anyone who liked the story actually come in good faith and say "wow, that's crazy, I enjoyed the story because XYZ, what's the deal?" It's usually a single post amidst an ongoing topic along the lines of "well, I for one loved the story and I am shocked this thread even exists, everyone else loved it and I think you're all just sad and pathetic and bitter!" and then taking umbrage when no one has any desire to engage with them.

Except that it primarily is. Look around and most of the pro-EW crowd doesn't try to force their beliefs on the naysayers, they just point out that in the grand scheme of things most people think like them. They generally know how to present opinions as opinions. The same sadly can't be said for the bitter doom crew.

There should be an award for the absolute rock-bottom level of self-awareness displayed in this post. It's almost impressive.

[Rithy255]

Except that it primarily is. Look around and most of the pro-EW crowd doesn't try to force their beliefs on the naysayers, they just point out that in the grand scheme of things most people think like them. They generally know how to present opinions as opinions. The same sadly can't be said for the bitter doom crew.

As someone who likes EW's story (at least I find it acceptable), I find it's really the people who get mad that someone doesn't like the story for what it is, then again i do see both sides arguing about it all the time. Honestly we all need to accept that people have different tastes and preferences.

The point is the story was Controversial, People wouldn't argue so much if it was either widely regarded as bad or good.

[Atelier-Bagur]

As someone who likes EW's story (at least I find it acceptable), I find it's really the people who get mad that someone doesn't like the story for what it is, then again i do see both sides arguing about it all the time. Honestly we all need to accept that people have different tastes and preferences.

The point is the story was Controversial, People wouldn't argue so much if it was either widely regarded as bad or good.

Its as much controversial as the Pro-Stormblood vs Anti-Stormblood crowd so honestly I guess from this perspective this isnt anything new with this game.

[RyuDragnier]

Its as much controversial as the Pro-Stormblood vs Anti-Stormblood crowd so honestly I guess from this perspective this isnt anything new with this game.

To give Stormblood credit, the Doman side was fairly well written, with beautiful locales and interesting characters. The Ala Mhigan side in comparison...not so much. The curse of having different writers for both sides, and it's notable because you can see signs of Lyse having character development, feeling like it's building up to a good finish. Then you go back to Ala Mhigo and...nothing. The character development ends abruptly, the regions were fairly boring, and overall it feels like a waste. Basically the only problem with Stormblood is that it didn't have a single writer for the entire story. Imagine if the same writer for Doma did Ala Mhigo, it'd probably have turned out a lot better.

[Absimiliard]

The Ala Mhigans were honestly probably worse than the Garleans. They would just go out and put towns to the torch for no reason other than the fact they wanted to. Their whole shtick was causing as much destruction as possible. Bit of an odd way to write a faction they wanted people to view as sympathetic.

[Xuled]

Imagine thinking Heavensward was better than Stormblood LOL what made it so great besides hotfart getting owned? Btw he wasn’t a very good npc and they really should off more of them

[Dikatis]

The Ala Mhigans were honestly probably worse than the Garleans. They would just go out and put towns to the torch for no reason other than the fact they wanted to. Their whole shtick was causing as much destruction as possible. Bit of an odd way to write a faction they wanted people to view as sympathetic.

Genuinely curious. When did this happen? The only instance of this I recall is when Theodoric the Mad King, a notoriously unpopular and evil ruler, set fire to Rhalgr's Reach while persecuting his city-state's own religion. This helped spark a rebellion that ousted him before Garlemald came swooping in, colonized Ala Mhigo, stripped it of its natural resources, attempted to destroy its culture, performed grievous war crimes, and conducted horrific human experimentation.

Garlemald also firebombed Dalmasca while putting it under siege, killing or starving 70,000 people. Garlean forces also burnt most of Doma to the ground and was prepared to do the same to Eorzea with the Agrius before Midgardsormr brought it down. Menenius is also all too happy to bomb Zadnor constantly, and even the reformist Gabranth has no qualms with Sicibous' experiments or deploying a primal against the Resistance.

I don't think any nation on the planet has committed worse atrocities than Garlemald sans the Allag.