Can something be done about alliance raids?

[TaleraRistain]

The old Story Roulette was a prime example of it's not as simple as just balancing the reward. In the old-old one, people would avoid Preato in favor of Castrum, but when Castrum was buffed, people actually dropped Castrum for another chance at getting Preato. Speaking for myself, Ivalice is at a point where you can't give me enough reward to queue into it, unless the reward for it is large enough that it would actually obsolete CT the same Preato obsoleted Castrum.


Another problem with the various suggestion of somehow exclude CT seem to have this assumption that the players will just let themselves goad into whatever direction you want to push them. For example, do you think removing CT from Alliance roulette will make someone like me go "oh, guess I have to go unlock the other raid I hate so much now"? No, the most likely outcome would be I just decide to ignore Alliance roulette altogether.

Or it becomes Void Ark roulette and people come here to complain about always getting that.

[Imora]

I never unlocked puppets bunker nor tower at paradigms breach.

And I never will if I can help it.

The bosses are HP sponges and the people that run them have the fewest braincells I swear.

[NekoMataMata]

Sometimes people host glam farms of it. That's how I got my original clear for it actually. I spent most of a day afk on and off on Aether and it never popped.

[NekoMataMata]

Or it becomes Void Ark roulette and people come here to complain about always getting that.

Also this. People would be relieved for maybe a year at the most, and then they'd start complaining about getting Void Ark constantly.

[Ath192]

The old Story Roulette was a prime example of it's not as simple as just balancing the reward. In the old-old one, people would avoid Preato in favor of Castrum, but when Castrum was buffed, people actually dropped Castrum for another chance at getting Preato. Speaking for myself, Ivalice is at a point where you can't give me enough reward to queue into it, unless the reward for it is large enough that it would actually obsolete CT the same Preato obsoleted Castrum.


Another problem with the various suggestion of somehow exclude CT seem to have this assumption that the players will just let themselves goad into whatever direction you want to push them. For example, do you think removing CT from Alliance roulette will make someone like me go "oh, guess I have to go unlock the other raid I hate so much now"? No, the most likely outcome would be I just decide to ignore Alliance roulette altogether.

This is exactly why if you drop out if you get Ivalice you lose your rewards for the day. There's no issue in dropping if you have to, but if you sign up for a roulette, you need to be ready to get anything in that roulette. If you try to dodge, then you also lose the rewards from the roulette. Sometimes people do need the stick. I def think a good portion of the playerbase would put up with it TBH. Maybe not you, but enough, since theyre gonna want the rewards for that day.

[Imora]

This is exactly why if you drop out if you get Ivalice you lose your rewards for the day. There's no issue in dropping if you have to, but if you sign up for a roulette, you need to be ready to get anything in that roulette. If you try to dodge, then you also lose the rewards from the roulette. Sometimes people do need the stick. I def think a good portion of the playerbase would put up with it TBH. Maybe not you, but enough, since theyre gonna want the rewards for that day.

Doesn't solve the people that just don't unlock them.

And a LOT of people would just stop unlocking them.

[Ath192]

Doesn't solve the people that just don't unlock them.

And a LOT of people would just stop unlocking them.

LOL no, thats a stretch. Imagine not doing content at all for fear of getting it in a roulette?? Like, why are they playing a game if they dont wanna play it? At best this would be someone with a lot of alts but this is a fraction of the playerbase that would take this "option" if you can call it that.

[Jojoya]

As stated before, remove CT from Alliance Raid roulette and place it into its own roulette. It removes the single common denominator among players that have at least one Alliance raid unlocked that tends to block the others from appearing more often. Players who enjoy doing roulettes aren't likely to complain about having one more roulette option to do each day. It would also be very popular with the players that enjoy doing the Alliance Raids in general.

To prevent item level cheese, add a Bozja style item level/stat sync to Alliance raids from past expansions (normal gear rules would apply to the current expansion Alliance raid). All characters get synced to a preset level and stats while in the raid regardless of job level or what gear is worn.

So as an example:

The Void Ark - everyone synced to level 60, ilvl 200
The Weeping City of Mhach - everyone synced to level 60, ilvl 230
Dun Scaith - everyone synced to level 60, ilvl 260

Theoretically, relative difficulty ends up the same regardless of which raid you get in the roulette. ilvl sync is equal to the ilvl the raid drops instead of the minimum ilvl as a passive nerf.

Doesn't solve the people that just don't unlock them.

And a LOT of people would just stop unlocking them.

But enough people do unlock them all that removing CT from the mix will allow all the other Alliance raids to appear a reasonable amount of the time.

[Raven2014]

This is exactly why if you drop out if you get Ivalice you lose your rewards for the day. There's no issue in dropping if you have to, but if you sign up for a roulette, you need to be ready to get anything in that roulette. If you try to dodge, then you also lose the rewards from the roulette.

I can assure you, that will not be anywhere enough to stop me from dropping it.

Sometimes people do need the stick. I def think a good portion of the playerbase would put up with it TBH. Maybe not you, but enough, since theyre gonna want the rewards for that day.

First, try to force your player to play the content they don't want to is never a smart idea. Goad them and incite them to is one thing, but try to beat them into it with a stick is a recipe for disaster, many had tried that route, none had succeed. People avoid other raids already because they hate it, force people into it just gonna make it boil over.

Secondly, I can tell you right now your estimation of a "good portion of playerbase would put up with it" is unfounded. For once, like I said, you don't want to make the player to put up with it. But more importantly, your assumption would only work if the game offer few alternative. Fortunately (or unfortunately for you) FF14 offers more option than most people can exhaust, be it EXP or tome. Unless you're in a rush to level or cap something asap + playing religiously for 3-5 hours a day, you won't be able to cycle through the complete set anyway.

The reason the Alliance roulette is popular is because it's currently one of the better option, and the only reason it's the better option is because you can reliably avoid the longer raid. Do something to that just mean it will be relegate to a lower order, and with limited time a day, it would just become an option not many would touch. Like ... I think I use like 2-3 things to level a day on average, and I would already max every class not even half way through the expack.


I keep saying this: you can not "force" people to play content they don't want to, especially when the game is chokeful of alternative options.

LOL no, thats a stretch. Imagine not doing content at all for fear of getting it in a roulette?? Like, why are they playing a game if they dont wanna play it? At best this would be someone with a lot of alts but this is a fraction of the playerbase that would take this "option" if you can call it that.

It's not a stretch, and why you would need to imagine something that actually happening?

Also, you conflate it with playing something once or twice for the experience (or farm until you have the glam) with something people ok with playing day after day as a routine. I, like many others don't use Alliance roullete on our main that have them unlock exactly for that reason. And it will be no different with new players.

For whatever reason behind it doesn't matter, the reality CT is popular because it's something people don't mind doing days after day. If you try to force people into Nier/Ivalice every days - again, I don't care what method you will use to achieve that - the result will simply mean the roulette itself will simply become a much less attractive option.

[Ath192]

I can assure you, that will not be anywhere enough to stop me from dropping it.



First, try to force your player to play the content they don't want to is never a smart idea. Goad them and incite them to is one thing, but try to beat them into it with a stick is a recipe for disaster, many had tried that route, none had succeed. People avoid other raids already because they hate it, force people into it just gonna make it boil over.

Secondly, I can tell you right now your estimation of a "good portion of playerbase would put up with it" is unfounded. For once, like I said, you don't want to make the player to put up with it. But more importantly, your assumption would only work if the game offer few alternative. Fortunately (or unfortunately for you) FF14 offers more option than most people can exhaust, be it EXP or tome. Unless you're in a rush to level or cap something asap + playing religiously for 3-5 hours a day, you won't be able to cycle through the complete set anyway.

The reason the Alliance roulette is popular is because it's currently the better option, and the only reason it's the better option is because you can reliably avoid it. Do something to that just mean it will be relegate to a lower order, and with limited time a day, it would just become an option not many would touch. Like ... I think I use like 2-3 things to level a day on average, and I would already max every class not even half way through the expack.


I keep saying this: you can not "force" people to play content they don't want to, especially when the game is chokeful of alternative options.

Yeah this a bit where you and I are never going to see eye to eye. You can drop all you want. If all you can be moved to do is brainless 10 minute instances where all people do is watch YouTube and mob the boss I can’t help you. No one can.

I think the punishment will encourage those who still want to do things to stay in the roulette. I want to remind you the purpose of the roulette was to fill instances that people may need, not feed bored vets rewards. That’s just the byproduct to get you to join. It should be punished if you are doing something unethical like dodging because you didn’t get the easy one.