What's the point with that quite lackluster story in Endwalker?

[kpxmanifesto]

To this day I still cant wrap my mind around this statement. It makes him look so out of touch.

Yeah it's like he's checked out of FFXIV, and the game isn't that important to him anymore.

[Absurdity]

Yeah it's like he's checked out of FFXIV, and the game isn't that important to him anymore.

Maybe, but it could also simply be a case of priorities.

His focus is entirely on 16 and why wouldn't it be? It's a singleplayer mainline FF game, there isn't going to be a "we'll do better next expansion", it's either a hit on release or a disappointing meh forever.
14 is just going to keep trucking along anyway, people have already shown that they gladly eat up mediocrity when it comes to this game and defend it like it's their child.

[Striker44]

Maybe, but it could also simply be a case of priorities.

His focus is entirely on 16 and why wouldn't it be? It's a singleplayer mainline FF game, there isn't going to be a "we'll do better next expansion", it's either a hit on release or a disappointing meh forever.
14 is just going to keep trucking along anyway, people have already shown that they gladly eat up mediocrity when it comes to this game and defend it like it's their child.

Perhaps because "mediocrity" is simply your opinion and their own opinion is that it's excellent...

There's also a point in there somewhere about people playing a video game and expecting it to be the next Lord of the Rings in terms of quality. I don't expect an absolute masterpiece when I play a video game, so I'm very much satisfied and have a lot of fun playing something that's simply very good. A common thread I seem to find running through the complaints are people taking a video game way too seriously imo.

[Melorie]

There's also a point in there somewhere about people playing a video game and expecting it to be the next Lord of the Rings in terms of quality. I don't expect an absolute masterpiece when I play a video game, so I'm very much satisfied and have a lot of fun playing something that's simply very good. A common thread I seem to find running through the complaints are people taking a video game way too seriously imo.

Uh. Disco Elysium, Planescape Torment, Night in the Woods, Outer Wilds, Pathologic 2, Spiritfarer, and I would say even Mass Effect, Dragon Age, Divinity II, Pillars of Eternity, Pentiment, etc, are all video-games with amazing stories, better than some books I've read. Acting like you can't criticize the plot of something because it is a "game" is such a narrow vision of what games can offer. This whole "you shouldn't take games seriously" are simply excuses to not think critically about stuff, which if it works for you... Wonderful, but that doesn't mean that they shouldn't be taken seriously at all. They're pieces of art and entertainment with a lot of possibilities. I'm sorry for you if you're not able to see this, you're honestly missing out.

Like, people have dedicated hours and hours to read the story, if you start the game now it'll take you MONTHS to catch up with the current story if you decide to read it and you can't think critically of this? The expansion biggest selling point is literally the story and you can't... take it seriously? LOL I'm literally reading a biggest amount of text than the entire Wheel of Time series combined and I should not think too much because it's just a game?

As of Endwalker: did I enjoy it? Yeah, but, at the same time, I can't think deeply about it. I have to enjoy it in a very superficial level otherwise the plot holes pop up constantly and I feel like most people find it the most amazing thing ever because they have no baggage. It's like the crowd that only reads Harry Potter and think it's the most amazing fantasy ever, because they haven't even touched Ursula Le K. Guin, Diana Wynne Jones, etc.

[Striker44]

Uh. Disco Elysium, Planescape Torment, Night in the Woods, Outer Wilds, Pathologic 2, Spiritfarer, and I would say even Mass Effect, Dragon Age, Divinity II, Pillars of Eternity, Pentiment, etc, are all video-games with amazing stories, better than some books I've read. Acting like you can't criticize the plot of something because it is a "game" is such a narrow vision of what games can offer. This whole "you shouldn't take games seriously" are simply excuses to not think critically about stuff, which if it works for you... Wonderful, but that doesn't mean that they shouldn't be taken seriously at all. They're pieces of art and entertainment with a lot of possibilities. I'm sorry for you if you're not able to see this, you're honestly missing out.

Like, people have dedicated hours and hours to read the story, if you start the game now it'll take you MONTHS to catch up with the current story if you decide to read it and you can't think critically of this? The expansion biggest selling point is literally the story and you can't... take it seriously? LOL I'm literally reading a biggest amount of text than the entire Wheel of Time series combined and I should not think too much because it's just a game?

As of Endwalker: did I enjoy it? Yeah, but, at the same time, I can't think deeply about it. I have to enjoy it in a very superficial level otherwise the plot holes pop up constantly and I feel like most people find it the most amazing thing ever because they have no baggage. It's like the crowd that only reads Harry Potter and think it's the most amazing fantasy ever, because they haven't even touched Ursula Le K. Guin, Diana Wynne Jones, etc.

When you reach the point of putting words in someone's mouth in an attempt to have an argument, you only serve to admit that you have none. Nowhere did I say someone can't take a video game story "seriously" - I said there's such a thing as expecting a masterpiece when there's no practical or realistic reason to expect one. Personally, I would put FFXIV's story (EW included) right up there with Dragon Age, Homeworld, and the like. I think the story is amazing, and it's obvious why it's a selling point for the game. Again, though - "amazing" for a video game doesn't mean "one of the greatest works of lore and literature ever produced by humanity." When you set such unrealistic expectations, the only natural end result is disappointment.

[Vyrerus]

When you reach the point of putting words in someone's mouth in an attempt to have an argument, you only serve to admit that you have none..

When you deny what you clearly imply, it only serves to show just how disingenuous you are with discussion you bring to the table.

Ok, so you didn't verbatim say, "You shouldn't take a video game story seriously." But you derided anybody who, in your opinion, is way too serious about games, implying that taking a video game's story seriously at all is negative. As if how good a story is or is not, isn't subjective to its beholder. Same goes for how seriously someone takes it. Regardless of its medium.

[Melorie]

When you reach the point of putting words in someone's mouth in an attempt to have an argument, you only serve to admit that you have none. Nowhere did I say someone can't take a video game story "seriously" - I said there's such a thing as expecting a masterpiece when there's no practical or realistic reason to expect one. Personally, I would put FFXIV's story (EW included) right up there with Dragon Age, Homeworld, and the like. I think the story is amazing, and it's obvious why it's a selling point for the game. Again, though - "amazing" for a video game doesn't mean "one of the greatest works of lore and literature ever produced by humanity." When you set such unrealistic expectations, the only natural end result is disappointment.

You were the one that said, and I quote:

A common thread I seem to find running through the complaints are people taking a video game way too seriously imo.

Not me. So maybe think twice if you really meant that.

Besides, I haven't even seen people comparing the game writing to other literature nor making giant, impossible requests regarding what the story should have been.

800 pages of discussion and I doubt you had a good amount of people comparing it to LOTR, or Dostoiévski or any other reverencied work. The game sells huge expensive encyclopedias and market itself around it's lore and you're surprised people are discussing it deeply? They are reading a story for years and just because they have certain expectations in how it would end or want the answer for certain plot hole doesn't really means that they are putting insuferable expectations upon it. Besides, you keep talking about how "they shouldn't expect it from a game", so your point regarding how the quality of gaming writing shouldn't be looked with the same respect and thus expectation that other media does keeps repeating itself, and *probably* because you can't understand why people would consume a history with critical lenses. You're literally telling people they shouldn't complain because this is a video-game, that makes no sense.

Also, Disco Elysium is a treasure to the humanity when it comes to writing and so is Planescape Torment so, yeah. Are you from the same crowd that are impressed when cartoons/animation deals with deep, "adult" problems as well? Because it's the same discourse.

Why? Why did you have to remind me those movies existed? Dammit. I need brain bleach now.

LMAO At least it made a eternal impression on you.

[AwesomeJr44]

When you reach the point of putting words in someone's mouth in an attempt to have an argument, you only serve to admit that you have none.

Aren't you the guy who thinks "muh majoritah" is an argument worth listening to?