Quote Originally Posted by Ggwppino View Post
I think the smn is incomplete because it only has one base rotation and nothing else. Not because it has no other summons, or rather, it's not the main point.
The problem with smn is that it currently only has one basic rotation and that's it. It is the simplest gcd rotation of drg. Stop, done. It has nothing else that makes the class deep.

The point is not whether the class is easy or difficult, but its accessibility.
If you add depth to the smn gameplay, however it will be the most accessible and most digestible class. This is because it was thought out, well in my opinion, to be clear: You have elementals that have Rite and Flow and every minute you have Bahamut/phoenix. It's the easiest class to understand and that's the important thing. But simpler not because it is stupid but because conceptually it is well done and easy to interpret.

Now it's not that easy to play, now you really don't play with this class. You're playing to do the right raid mechanics. If in HC2 the boss could be attacked, for the smn, it would make no difference.

And that's why it's preferred over the other casters. Not because it's nice to play, but because the only thing you do is follow the raid mechanics without being distracted by your rotation without having any penalties in terms of damage. Why do I have to play the rdm if with a non-existent effort I perform better with the smn?
i can't really disagree with this either. SMN is in that odd rut of feeling "incomplete" and yet the most readily accessible magic DPS in a meta catering to Melee from my own time playing and gathering everyone else's thoughts on playing it. which is still why i think that adding more summons with different kits aside from "deal all the damage" would probably be a good first step. granted a part of the optimization also for the singular rotation is knowing which elemental summon to use at what time, which...is still pretty bare bones as well admittedly, it's mainly just "do you use Garuda first to get Slipstream out asap, or do you use titan/ifrit instead because the boss' first mechanic involves it moving around a lot?"

Let's bring Demi-Phoenix back up as an example. do you think making it a separate button from Demi-Bahamut would make the rotation more complex, or at least more "open" in terms of choosing between damage and support? would putting Ramuh, Leviathan, and Shiva on it with their own kits designed for a more supportive playstyle (while still having good damage options mind you) give at least an illusion of minor complexity by having to choose which sets of summons to use at specific points in time? how about having the Demis on their own separate oGCD's, but it's short enough (maybe something like 40-45 seconds, maybe even 30s) so that if you have to use a different set of summons before your current one is used up, you can readily do so?