Ungendered sit poses, please?

[Padudu]

Based on the fact that they give you a sample pool of emotes during character customization to show off the race/gender's personalities. If you went through that whole process and clicked accept then you were drawn to that race/gender as they were presented. Deciding after the fact that they somehow don't conform to how you want to play them in your head is wholey on you.
The same could be said for your anecdotal "many more players" you've allegedly spoken to about this. At least the forums are a somewhat measurable metric, unlike your hearsay. I could just as easily say I've talked to many people who think the idea of allowing each gender to use the other's emotes is dumb.

Idk why I missed this, oops.

Lmao you can't preview the sits or anything like that. They added *more* options to how you can sit, so not sure why picking male/females means you're determined to forever not want the male positions.

Dude you realize we're doing the same amount of conjecture right?? Also, your friend absolutely sucks at searching for these things. Tell them to do better. Let's look exclusively at the swaps:

The forbidden mod to add emotes to everyone sits at 4.9K downloads, 25.3k views. Male Miqote Squat to Female Miqo Squat: 13.1k views, 3.5k downloads. Somewhere there are fem --> male or male --> female swapped job idles, victories, ect that sit more or less around the same numbers. Hardly insignificant IMO, definitely not as low as you're making it seem. They are, unfortunately, splintered across multiple mods; booty mod being at higher views doesn't really invalidate the fact that gender swaps/animations are particularly high in view, even when they're newer.

I haven't read everything, so this might have been pointed out by anyone already, but I'd like to share my two cents.

One of the reasons why I (and maybe some other people) wouldn't like such an option is... There's a feature that automatically rotates all the poses every X seconds. Many characters would be forced to use those poses, so it's not as simple as "don't like it, don't use it".

Idk, they didn't have an issue have adding them; also don't see why it would be hard to tweak the issue at all or even why it *would* be an issue at all. It's literally just sit positions.

Who has said "They don't care about ungendered sitting poses"? And once again, like I said to him, feeling passionately about something doesn't entitle you to anything. You're never going to express more feelings to inflate the numbers of the extreme niche audience you claim to be speaking for.

Okay, but why are you in particular passionate about NOT getting ungendered swaps? Or even, why are you, in particular, passionate about arguing against them when they do nothing for you?

Oh, I see..

Because I'm tired of people catering to the mentality of children that want what they can't have, and are perpetually unhappy. I defend the devs decisions to have SOME gender/race specific aspects.

Lmao. "People are asking for MORE things for the game they pay for so I have to CRY about it." I can defend them having racial traits - like Miqo with fangs/tribal markings, Au'ra will always have horns, ect. Sitting with your legs crossed, squatting, or one leg over the other isn't a race/gender thing. It's just a thing.

Haha, decoration, emotes, and being able to color your armor is not a QoL feature. QoL features are things that you can ALREADY DO, but made easier, IE an UI improvement, or coloring the text differently.

But those are QoL lmao. It's literally adding to a feature for no other reason other than "it's nice to have". QoL doesn't exclusively have to be improvements to make shit easier; it can literally just be adding features/items/dyes/whatever to add more into whatever feature they're adding. i.e making it so that the orchrestion music that plays in Island Sanc. permanent instead of resetting everytime you leave the instance, is a QoL feature.

It's never enough. Everything is progress with you people. Nothing is ever good/great, everything "could be better" or "a good first step". There is always something you realize you don't/can't have. It's never something that has a strong impact on people, it's always something some four figure amount of people out of the MILLIONS that play want, and it's always the same emotionally based arguments for it; "Why are you against something that makes other people happy?" "You don't even care." "How does it harm you?".

Enough of you people.

You seem to have a personal problem lol. Of course we can always strive to do better or add more. We're 10 years down the line, it is a game made from a successful corporation, and it is still a MMO. There's no slapping it and saying, "Yep! This is the game. That's it. That's all we have."; they literally said this game will continue. It will continue to have new features, new expansions, ect. So yes, of course people want more. We are paying for that. And it's the same arguments because literally it doesn't affect you. If SE added ungendered sits in like, say a patch, you wouldn't give a shit. You only do because people here are asking on the forums and then they get a little heated when they get hit with: "b-but OP, it's unfeminine to manspread."

[DRHaymaker]

They added *more* options to how you can sit, so not sure why picking male/females means you're determined to forever not want the male positions.

No one is saying you can't want something, just you can't have it. If anything you just admit what I'm saying - it's never enough..

Male Miqote Squat to Female Miqo Squat: 13.1k views, 3.5k downloads. Somewhere there are fem --> male or male --> female swapped job idles, victories, ect that sit more or less around the same numbers. Hardly insignificant IMO

First of all, views don't matter - they're irrelevant. Second, downloads don't tell the whole story. UNIQUE downloads do. However, that is not a stat that's covered, so it's not unreasonable to say people have downloaded it multiple times. Again, like I said, a 4 figure number vs 8 figures.

Okay, but why are you in particular passionate about NOT getting ungendered swaps? Or even, why are you, in particular, passionate about arguing against them when they do nothing for you?

Like I said - same tired predictable arguments. Not only that, but it's literally the same tactic as the masculine/feminine question. I already answered, if you didn't find it satisfactory, that's a you problem.

"People are asking for MORE things for the game they pay for so I have to CRY about it."

We both pay for the game, so there's literally nothing you or others have on me monetarily.

I can defend them having racial traits [...] But those are QoL lmao.

No. Objectively wrong. Again, your emotional investment does not transform what things are.

no other reason other than "it's nice to have".

That's a weak argument that can be literally used for anything. There's a lot of things that are "nice to have" that you can't have just because it'd be nice to have. It's a circular argument.

[DRHaymaker]

QoL doesn't exclusively have to be improvements to make shit easier

That's literally the defining feature of QoL, be it visually easy to distinguish (a checkmark next to a collectable, or color text/symbol to denote damage type), or reduce the number of clicks (2~ click gathering crops/animal stuff on the island vs 80~). You have an objectively incorrect idea of what QoL means. And you KNOW this, because your example of your music resetting is LITERALLY you not having to click multiple times every time you want to change the music.

You seem to have a personal problem

Personal? No. Insufferable, obstinate people that don't understand what they're talking about and entire argument, whatever it is, boils down to, "But why?" is a lot of people's problem

Of course we can always strive to do better

You don't even understand the terms you're using, why should people listen to you when you determine something is "better"?

And it's the same arguments because literally it doesn't affect you.

Wrong, it does. Like people said, you can cycle through different stance/sitting poses. What if people don't want to use those poses? What if people don't want to see females squatting or leg's akimbo, or the female equivalent on males?

You do realize the game is rated T, right? While they can't fully control online interactions, they can control what they put out there. I don't think a girl squatting with her knees/legs spread out would fall under the T rating, ESPECIALLY the Lalafell.

If SE added ungendered sits in like, say a patch, you wouldn't give a shit.

Again, I don't know where you're getting this narrative from.

[PyurBlue]

Based on the fact that they give you a sample pool of emotes during character customization to show off the race/gender's personalities. If you went through that whole process and clicked accept then you were drawn to that race/gender as they were presented. Deciding after the fact that they somehow don't conform to how you want to play them in your head is wholey on you.

As you said, you're only given a small sample of emotes, not enough to be certain of anything. You're also given no indication of how emotes work or if you can change them later on. They just play while you're testing voices. Your point doesn't really hold up. People change their characters after creation because the editor often doesn't provide enough information to make a decision in the first place.

And this isn't even considering what the player is trying to accomplish the first time through the editor. Are they unaware of the RP potential of FF14 and just trying the game after seeing good ratings? If so they might not pay much attention to emotes and mannerisms only to much later find out that they can be significant when it comes to character expression. There is no way to truly evaluate a character short of playing it. When new players ask for advice when attempting to fantasia I can almost grantee that someone will suggest testing characters as alts before using the fantasia. There would not be a need if what you said was accurate.

The same could be said for your anecdotal "many more players" you've allegedly spoken to about this. At least the forums are a somewhat measurable metric, unlike your hearsay. I could just as easily say I've talked to many people who think the idea of allowing each gender to use the other's emotes is dumb.

Which is why I brought it up. If we're going to use the weakest of evidence it becomes pretty easy to support any conclusion you want.

[Joven]

Also, your friend absolutely sucks at searching for these things. Tell them to do better. Let's look exclusively at the swaps:

The forbidden mod to add emotes to everyone sits at 4.9K downloads, 25.3k views. Male Miqote Squat to Female Miqo Squat: 13.1k views, 3.5k downloads. Somewhere there are fem --> male or male --> female swapped job idles, victories, ect that sit more or less around the same numbers. Hardly insignificant IMO, definitely not as low as you're making it seem. They are, unfortunately, splintered across multiple mods; booty mod being at higher views doesn't really invalidate the fact that gender swaps/animations are particularly high in view, even when they're newer.

"High in view". Roughly 8k downloads and 38k views across two different features is completely insignificant numbers based on the millions of players who play this game. I stopped at 100k during the search because even then that's still extremely minor league numbers. Maybe when the game first started those might seem like significant numbers, but we're long past that point.

As you said, you're only given a small sample of emotes, not enough to be certain of anything. You're also given no indication of how emotes work or if you can change them later on. They just play while you're testing voices. Your point doesn't really hold up. People change their characters after creation because the editor often doesn't provide enough information to make a decision in the first place.

And this isn't even considering what the player is trying to accomplish the first time through the editor. Are they unaware of the RP potential of FF14 and just trying the game after seeing good ratings? If so they might not pay much attention to emotes and mannerisms only to much later find out that they can be significant when it comes to character expression. There is no way to truly evaluate a character short of playing it. When new players ask for advice when attempting to fantasia I can almost grantee that someone will suggest testing characters as alts before using the fantasia. There would not be a need if what you said was accurate.

It doesn't change the fact that they are presented in a certain way. If that way runs counter to what you want or expect after the fact then that's still no fault of theirs.

Which is why I brought it up. If we're going to use the weakest of evidence it becomes pretty easy to support any conclusion you want.

Except that despite being a small sample size it's still a visible metric unlike "he said, she said". It's also an argument for why there needs to be a dislike button on here as well.

[Padudu]

No one is saying you can't want something, just you can't have it. If anything you just admit what I'm saying - it's never enough..

First of all, views don't matter - they're irrelevant. Second, downloads don't tell the whole story. UNIQUE downloads do. However, that is not a stat that's covered, so it's not unreasonable to say people have downloaded it multiple times. Again, like I said, a 4 figure number vs 8 figures.

I mean, why can't I have it though? :think: What are you, Yoshi-P's niece/nephew? If anything you can just admit you don't want people to suggest having things because you seem to be spiteful about people asking for certain things.

Also, I was also going by what they were arguing. So then both of our points are moot if you want to go by that lmao. I do agree that unique downloads are what count, but it works both ways; it doesn't matter in general. I do think the downloads are more of a factor and across the board, there's no denying that there is an outside want for them. After all, I don't think whoever is making the emote/idle/stance swaps are fibbing say like, 13,400 of those downloads; same with I don't think there would be that many redownloads, but who knows.

We both pay for the game, so there's literally nothing you or others have on me monetarily.
No. Objectively wrong. Again, your emotional investment does not transform what things are.

I mean, same to you. Do you cry about the gendered items becoming unisex as well?

It's also not objectively wrong lmao. It has nothing to do with emotional attachment. For some reason you're obsessed with that. You can change from idle stance 1 (arms down) to idle stance 2 (arms crossed). Some people prefer hand on the hip. That is a customization feature my dude. Whether you like it or not that is giving a tiniest amount of sprinkle of personality into your character. What, do you go out of your way to create a character that you dislike looking at?

QoL stuff

Adventure Plates are also QOL :U Something that we don't need, yet it's here anyways. It's not my fault you have these hard-lined definitions of what things should and shouldn't be and it HAS to be this way for you or it doesn't work.

Wrong, it does. Like people said, you can cycle through different stance/sitting poses. What if people don't want to use those poses? What if people don't want to see females squatting or leg's akimbo, or the female equivalent on males?

Idk, like you and the other person amounted to earlier: suck it up lmao. What if people don't want 2B dresses? What if people don't want this or that? What if people are content in making healers wear robes? Idk man, people don't want a lot of things in the same aspect that people want both. I'm not sure why there can't be a middle ground; toggling idles for example. They make other useless features so I'm not sure why toggling idles or something would be an issue.

Even then, again, it's literally sitting. If it's not a big deal, and it's no-skin-off-the-bones, then why cry about it? If you're using the rotation idles, then chances are you likely don't care because you like seeing the poses, right? So are those idles I keep mentioning really gonna break your immersion or make you unsub lmao?

You do realize the game is rated T, right? While they can't fully control online interactions, they can control what they put out there. I don't think a girl squatting with her knees/legs spread out would fall under the T rating, ESPECIALLY the Lalafell.

There's Miqo'te female NPCs squatting in Limsa tho.



Also, Lalafells can literally wear the playboy bunny outfit. They can wear bikinis. the 2b leggings is a straight up thin bikini with pantyhose. The new togi (sp) outfit is literally a tanga. They can wear sexy outfits, even if it isn't sexy on them. The game literally has options to show you censored booba. Y'all talls got a max chest slider, after all. Squatting is not a sexy/mature thing. You can literally be pantyshotted anytime tbh. Using the Teen rating here is at best laughable when arguing against women squatting lmao.

Again, I don't know where you're getting this narrative from.

Right here:

Because I'm tired of people catering to the mentality of children that want what they can't have, and are perpetually unhappy. I defend the devs decisions to have SOME gender/race specific aspects.

ninja edit soz:

"High in view". Roughly 8k downloads and 38k views across two different features is completely insignificant numbers based on the millions of players who play this game. I stopped at 100k during the search because even then that's still extremely minor league numbers. Maybe when the game first started those might seem like significant numbers, but we're long past that point.

It doesn't change the fact that they are presented in a certain way. If that way runs counter to what you want or expect after the fact then that's still no fault of theirs.

Except that despite being a small sample size it's still a visible metric unlike "he said, she said". It's also an argument for why there needs to be a dislike button on here as well.

The number of users who use forbidden stuff is small yet SE seems determined to phase out the use of mods as much as they can. I wonder why. If it's a no bother number amount of people using mods, then why even go through the lengths to make the outfits unisex, make items dyable, or even add in raiding features? They're only catering to the small % of people who utilize these features, yet they make it available to everyone, including console players.

[GTK0HLK]

-snip-

Unrelated and irrelevant, the reason it doesnt exist is cause it just leads to a higher and higher acts of Passive-Aggression and Toxicity.
[the whole Just cause youre right or correct, or slightly in the right direction. SOME consumers can see it as a merit to continue acting in negative ways. when there are better ways to communicate]

which back on topic.
Yours and Hymkrs tend to Lead to absorbing anything that could even possibly lead to your "opinion" side leaning.

There are times a Majority is correct, or incorrect. Just like a minority can be incorrect or correct on a subject.<diverting slight from the topic. it can lead to spite, mob rule/opinion, etc. which I take it from both your reactions as well as those youve absorbed into your "Stance" on the topic as those who go against anything with backing if it mildly goes against your perceived views. hence why if downvotes existed, those shunned or uplifted would feel it both ways. Which leads to either bashing the community/devs/game if not leading youre way.>

The reason many brought up the "Illegal" additions is cause its gotten to the point that well known Streamers/Media Precense getting banned for what would be a small QoL.
<which it is, cause it covers a whole System that is USED EVERYWHERE, including Cutscenes. as representatives of your character or to add emotion to the story or interactions with Players in the MMO part of the game> Hence why with the Conversion "Additions" Mentioned are aggregated, rather than individually counted. [whilst a Rear Slide would be individually counted or merged with a full modification. which isnt what many players would obtain, but arent against it(since it isnt for them as the audience)]

alot of "Goalpost" moving as people would say. when you nitpick what does exist as some form of data, cause it could be used to disprove your position or wants to deny.

Many have even suggest ideas in how they could also SUGGEST, to the devs to ensure you dont get offended or hurt by a harmless change that could in its systems improve the game.[it is a whole system after all.]

Many things in this game tie together, and it isnt the slippery slope kind as you all are masters of. but more in the, an improvement or Simplification of it/enhancement allows for changes that would benefit you indirectly or directly in other topics.

[1]

[Bunnycake]

"Omg, it's just pixels. You're not freakin forced into gendered stereotypes lol." See how that sounds?



Based on the fact that they give you a sample pool of emotes during character customization to show off the race/gender's personalities. If you went through that whole process and clicked accept then you were drawn to and accepted that race/gender as they were presented. Deciding after the fact that they somehow don't conform to how you want to play them in your head is wholey on you.



The same could be said for your anecdotal "many more players" you've allegedly spoken to about this. At least the forums are a somewhat measurable metric, unlike your hearsay. I could just as easily say I've talked to many people who think the idea of allowing each gender to use the other's emotes is dumb.



Going by the site a friend of mine uses, in the "most viewed" category, the highest viewed item was at 664k for a firmer fanny. Emotes barely cracked the 100k mark and those were custom ones that had nothing to with gender. Not exactly what I would call a sizable group compared the number of players.



Depends on how you cross them and masculine.

What, it's true tho. It's not mandatory.

[GTK0HLK]

[2]
We know they plan 10 more years, and despite not knowing what the Graphics update will bring. they have to do alot to ensure it survives that long. A Reasonable person wouldnt ask the MMO they enjoy to not update their systems.[some also forget that CBUIII specifically has had its Workforce split into projects for a chunk of time as well, when its convenient] Which none of it should/will delay them in anything else more time consuming. as we should expect from a company of their size.

all that said. One user asking for just 4 emotes wouldnt hurt anyone at all. and they have the tools to automate the majority of the process.

[PyurBlue]

It doesn't change the fact that they are presented in a certain way. If that way runs counter to what you want or expect after the fact then that's still no fault of theirs.

What do wants and expectations have to do with anything? You cannot know anything about what the editor does not show you, which is a lot. Again, the point you're trying to make falls flat.

Except that despite being a small sample size it's still a visible metric unlike "he said, she said". It's also an argument for why there needs to be a dislike button on here as well.

Being visible doesn't make it useful. If you can find an accurate metric that represents the portion of the community that is interested in unlocked poses, then you might be able to say that it's a niche desire. You can't make up statistics just because you don't have data.

There's a feature that automatically rotates all the poses every X seconds. Many characters would be forced to use those poses, so it's not as simple as "don't like it, don't use it".

Ideally this could be changed as well. It's not like every pose in the current cpose list is universally liked as it is.