As I said way earlier, I'm pretty done with this thread and not participating in the argument anymore because it's just beating my head against a wall. But fun little tidbit I just learned yesterday that I wanted to share, on the subject of toxicity, there's apparently alliances of venues in which basically a top venue enforces rules on how the venues operate and who to blacklist and whatnot and if you don't get on board your venue basically gets killed because the alliance will try to make sure no one visits it.

You know, for anyone who thinks 14's community isn't toxic.