The Final Fantasy XIV Problem.

[DPZ2]

Final Fantasy XIVs Learning curve.

Faceroll easy all the way to endgame then a sheer vertical cliff to climb that players are totally unprepared for.

You are conflating the ease of completing content with the learning curve. I know plenty of players who have absolutely no problem moving from Story Raids to EX trials and then on to the higher tiers. I know plenty of players who will never actually do even the Story Raids unless forced to do so.

It has nothing to do with a 'learning curve' and everything to do with gaming experience, period. Why gaming experience? Because not every player finds every instance up through Story Raids to be a "faceroll". The fact that the poster here does find these to be a faceroll says more about their gaming experience in general than a learning curve.

[Deveryn]

Never said that XIV is unfriendly. I'm saying that XIV isnt build to be a friendly user rather it's build to be a game that promotes the ignorance towards its gameplay.
You dont have to know nothing to clear normal contents. Just be in there.
That's wrong and that's why WOD is still the most difficult ARR's alliance content, and I dont mention Dun Scaith or even the Rabanastre arc...

It doesn't promote ignorance, it encourages you to learn and find other people to do stuff. It's actually quite user friendly... a lot of people are sadly just ignorant by default. Yes, the info is still limited, but this is nothing new. This is gaming in general. It's been this way for years. This is why guides exist. They show you a certain amount and then let you learn along the way and figure things out. I touched on this earlier. People want to dive right into something and not be hit with a ton of info all at once.

Not all the info they give is shown in text. A lot of the arenas are intentionally designed to have points of interest where things will happen. If you look and pay attention to that stuff, you'll learn plenty. Alliance raids from the get go have always pointed you north and shown you how to split into your three parties and where you go. It amazes me that people still fail to catch on to this into the more recent expansions. More recently, they've even started tethering you to the mobs you're supposed to go fight.

The game actually teaches you a lot if you go back and play things over again, but it seems like people just want to one-and-done things to get to the end. It's not the developers' fault people are like that. It's an unfortunate mentality that just exists.

In the social environment like this, what happens with interactions and such falls way beyond the scope of what they can feasibly provide. All the rules and such are set to guide people, but it's mostly beyond their control. It's up to the players to make some choices and ask questions and seek info as regional communities do things differently.

[Canadane]

The game actually teaches you a lot if you go back and play things over again, but it seems like people just want to one-and-done things to get to the end. It's not the developers' fault people are like that. It's an unfortunate mentality that just exists.

I find this one a lot, people really don't understand the games concept of teaching you via your failures.
Death and wipes are fine and expected as you learn new difficult things. As long as you learn from it you can move forward.

[Raoabolic]

I find this one a lot, people really don't understand the games concept of teaching you via your failures.
Death and wipes are fine and expected as you learn new difficult things. As long as you learn from it you can move forward.

Do you not remember when the modern player had that hot take that they are owed a victory/ending because they purchased the game? This is the mentality you are fighting against, good luck! lol

[Midareyukki]

Do you not remember when the modern player had that hot take that they are owed a victory/ending because they purchased the game? This is the mentality you are fighting against, good luck! lol

wait what? xD

So you buy a JRPG. Solo experience. Some boss kills you. Game clearly has the tools for you to beat it, you just need to train, figure out a strategy and stuff... but you insist the boss should now harakiri itself because you paid money for the game? It's a game, the whole point is to learn how to play it and go for the objective and have fun while doing it.

[Jokerz_93]

It doesn't promote ignorance, [..] It's been this way for years

It doesn't mean that this is the right path to walk.

People want to dive right into something and not be hit with a ton of info all at once.

I agree and people should be guided towards a right behavior not left alone. XIV requires a better learning system. By default XIV does not provide you anything if not short tooltips that sometimes can be misleading (e.g Paldin's PoA).

A lot of the arenas are intentionally designed [...]

Not my point. Didn't say anything about fight design.

It's not the developers' fault people are like that. It's an unfortunate mentality that just exists.

I dind't say it's Yoshi-P and dev's fault. I don't even think is something that depends by them.
XIV is changed trying to become more "user firendly" (again, I dont think that this changing can be called "user friendly") for the casual and newbie side.
Jobs easier expac by expac, normal content easier patch be patch, Duty support to make an MMO more a Solo game, a pointless Hardcore scenario. All of this are not meant to make a better XIV rather to make XIV more accessible.
And it's fine to me. But when this accessibility comes without a proper build-in knowledge of the game's basics, when this "user friendly" mentality weights on the avarege vetaran's players whose see the game they spent years on turning into a pit full of headless chicken it's time to sit down and say "nope. that's too much".

I see these headless chicken in savages all the time. I've in my top corner of my screen all their mistakes. My ACT doesnt tell me the dps anymore. It says to me "Why are you doing this to yourself?"
I dont blame who doesn't know how to play. I dont blame the dev team. I blame the company SE itself to be so greedy to have forgotten that who is paying their bill since a long time patch doesnt see any improvements, rather a simplification expac aftet expac.
But yea, milions of active players and only a small amount of them know what to do...i guess that's why hardcore mode is pointless.

I loved this game when i started to play. Now I see that this game is WoW, just with another name and another "elitism".

[magitekLuna]

Tooltips are there. Read them. Not that hard

problem is why some one that don't give a care in the world will

[Lustre]

This problem will exist as long as the ToS stays unchanged, as a result of all of this the XIV fanbase is simultaneously the most passive aggressive and sneaky fanbase, and also most "fake nice" there is out of any community I've been a part of. ToS goes an awful long way to feeding this

[Deveryn]

I agree and people should be guided towards a right behavior not left alone. XIV requires a better learning system. By default XIV does not provide you anything if not short tooltips that sometimes can be misleading (e.g Paldin's PoA).

...

I dind't say it's Yoshi-P and dev's fault. I don't even think is something that depends by them.
XIV is changed trying to become more "user firendly" (again, I dont think that this changing can be called "user friendly") for the casual and newbie side.

Which is it? The game is not designed / maintained properly or Yoshi and the team are doing their job?

[caffe_macchiato]

“User friendly” doesn’t necessarily need to mean more tutorial or guides, either. It could mean having each rotation condensed to less buttons like most other MMOs. It could mean having a better tick rate on our servers so that people can see mechanics easier. It could mean giving us more diverse dungeons that aren’t hallways so that players see many more mechanics and have a better challenge. Tutorials are fine, but subtle design changes would mean a lot to modernize the user experience. Older MMOs like WoW and GW2 have substantially upgraded their user experiences, but FFXIV still feels old-fashioned and cumbersome. That’s a difficult environment for new players to start raiding in.

Tooltips are there. Read them. Not that hard

That’s fine and quintessentially FFXIV, but remember that YOU are stuck with those people. It’s YOUR time wasted if you resist any positive changes to the gameplay. FFXIV is a live-service game, do not expect your 2013-esque experience to remain the same. If you still want to make toxicity in the game after improvements are made, you can always add that in yourself, but we don’t need the devs to hold your hand through that.