Abyssos is fun for tanks because Warriors can't cheese it

[fulminating]

Instead you get a dark knight to solo all the condensed aeroes. Amazing.

The issue is not warrior’s sustain, but the lack of variety, poorly chosen tb timings (just have three in a 230s period) and especially the lack of auto attacks. Last tier ultima unreal required more from any tank than the savage fights, no one can live through 5 stacks, short telegraph tankbusters and constant autos made it far more engaging. Even with the ubiquitous tank lb. I don’t think anyone would accuse arr of having superior fight design, but there are elements that have been lost over the years which would be interesting to see resurface.

[Oizen]

Instead you get a dark knight to solo all the condensed aeroes. Amazing.

The issue is not warrior’s sustain, but the lack of variety, poorly chosen tb timings (just have three in a 230s period) and especially the lack of auto attacks. Last tier ultima unreal required more from any tank than the savage fights, no one can live through 5 stacks, short telegraph tankbusters and constant autos made it far more engaging. Even with the ubiquitous tank lb. I don’t think anyone would accuse arr of having superior fight design, but there are elements that have been lost over the years which would be interesting to see resurface.

Well I mean that fight you mention, WAR was far better off than DRK at surviving in that fight. DRK crumbles under constant damage and thrives under singular big hits, while WAR can just sorta coast through most things with its insane self heals, I would actually swap to WAR for that unreal in particular because of it, only content thats ever made me want to do that.

But this tier seems to be a direct response to Asphodelos being homogenized to such an insane degree by MT War strategies having Holmgang thrown out 3 times per fight. Personally I would have just increased the cooldown on Holmgang but I don't think SE is quite ready to admit that Invuls and their functions need to be readdressed across the board.

[AttilaHetzel]

Instead you get a dark knight to solo all the condensed aeroes. Amazing.

The issue is not warrior’s sustain, but the lack of variety, poorly chosen tb timings (just have three in a 230s period) and especially the lack of auto attacks. Last tier ultima unreal required more from any tank than the savage fights, no one can live through 5 stacks, short telegraph tankbusters and constant autos made it far more engaging. Even with the ubiquitous tank lb. I don’t think anyone would accuse arr of having superior fight design, but there are elements that have been lost over the years which would be interesting to see resurface.

I don't think that's a good example, or any would be, because warrior will always be the "best" for each of those scenarios

[Absimiliard]

I don't think that's a good example, or any would be, because warrior will always be the "best" for each of those scenarios

WAR hasn't been the "best" for anything in a while. Yeah, you've historically been able to use Holmgang for some glorious shenanigans, but the vast majority of groups didn't bother save in those situations where WAR found itself blessed with an acceptable level of level of damage. They preferred bringing tanks with higher DPS. WAR's sustain is vastly overhyped, its mitigation is kinda crappy compared to GNB and DRK's, and its damage is potential is lower than FFXIV's average player skill level.

Being able to cheese something and being the "best" are two very different things. This is a game built in such a way that only damage, mitigating when/if warranted, and performing mechanics correctly are of consequence. All other considerations are secondary at best.

The only form of content WAR truly breaks is dungeons. In everything else it's quite meh.

[AttilaHetzel]

WAR hasn't been the "best" for anything in a while. Yeah, you've historically been able to use Holmgang for some glorious shenanigans, but the vast majority of groups didn't bother save in those situations where WAR found itself blessed with an acceptable level of level of damage. They preferred bringing tanks with higher DPS. WAR's sustain is vastly overhyped, its mitigation is kinda crappy compared to GNB and DRK's, and its damage is potential is lower than FFXIV's average player skill level.

Being able to cheese something and being the "best" are two very different things. This is a game built in such a way that only damage, mitigating when/if warranted, and performing mechanics correctly are of consequence. All other considerations are secondary at best.

The only form of content WAR truly breaks is dungeons. In everything else it's quite meh.

This comment is actually the best so far, I'd disagree that their kit is meh compared to DRK and GNB, I've seen people bringing it up several times, but I play those classes, for DRK it depends a lot since dark mind is magical only, but also on the fight we're talking about, GNB is a closer comparison in my eyes, given that HOC is a free 30% mit for 4s then 15% but the healing can be quite significant, healing a DRK requires more effort, but a GNB can be ok with some shields alone from healers (all this assuming we don't kitchen sink, because yeah a DRK can solo a condensed on p7s, but then they have no mit for the next buster, which granted they could invul, I just wouldn't on a pf, totally ok with static).

Totally agree on the rest, I thought it was clear on my post that I disagree with WAR being the best cuz they can cheese, but just in case, yes that's what I meant. Ultimately being the easiest to play, I guess my perspective comes from playing so much with them, then again, it's the most accessible tank for people just like WHM is for healers, and therefore would be more played than other classes. For the rest I guess it's also my server, most strats account for a WAR cheese, so much in fact that sometimes I would join a PF and my co tank would say that they have never MT the fight and have to talk about swaps and mit before going in because they're used to the WAR doing all (and this annoyed me as much as people not wanting to do uwu because no one had auto markers for titan)