OK, I gotta vent. Are people stupid or... Stupid?

[Wynn]

I would pose to you this question..WHy do mats sell for more than the finished product? The answer is demand. Now we must examine why mats have higher demand than the finished product. This is because the need to level up DoH. There is simply more demand for the mats than the product. That combined with an abundance of gil by much of the player base creates a market for which mats are of more value.

This may stem for the ability to quickly level DoW and DoM and the requisite move to leveling DoH and DoL classes. Hopefully this will change in 2.0, we will see. The fact remains the market we have right now is what we have for the foreseeable future.

Too true... And of course, all that DoH leveling floods the market with tons of finished product, driving the prices right down into the ground.

As much as I hate to say it, because I loved the concept, I really think allowing players to level up all crafts was a mistake.

They need to make gear break permanently or something to drive up the demand for gear and strip it from the wards faster (yeah right lol)

[Irzibe]

Too true... And of course, all that DoH leveling floods the market with tons of finished product, driving the prices right down into the ground.

As much as I hate to say it, because I loved the concept, I really think allowing players to level up all crafts was a mistake.

They need to make gear break permanently or something to drive up the demand for gear and strip it from the wards faster (yeah right lol)

Edit: Ha realized you had 3 points in your post, I am talking about the crafts you can level up.

YES! I totally agree with that notion. I have hope though, the game is still at level 50 cap, you don't know what might happen when there's a limit increase.

[darkstarpoet1]

Too true... And of course, all that DoH leveling floods the market with tons of finished product, driving the prices right down into the ground.

As much as I hate to say it, because I loved the concept, I really think allowing players to level up all crafts was a mistake.

They need to make gear break permanently or something to drive up the demand for gear and strip it from the wards faster (yeah right lol)

no the allowing people to have all crafts leveled was not the mistake. the mistake was made when yoshi increased the exp gained per synth, added massive bonuses on leve turn ins, reduced shard costs allowing cheaper leveling, and added even more increases in exp gained on additional quality.

the easy leveling for crafting classes has led to the same thing in dol/doh. it's too fast and too easy to level so everyone is getting leveled as fast as they can. i know of many people that only started crafting after all of the exp increases because it was easy and not because they cared about crafting.

they need to tighten back down the exp on all dow/dom/dol/dol classes and stop allowing the easy leveling that is destroying the game from the inside. the easier it is to level the more people are going to continue hitting all 50's on every class because it is easy to do so.

[Wynn]

no the allowing people to have all crafts leveled was not the mistake. the mistake was made when yoshi increased the exp gained per synth, added massive bonuses on leve turn ins, reduced shard costs allowing cheaper leveling, and added even more increases in exp gained on additional quality.

the easy leveling for crafting classes has led to the same thing in dol/doh. it's too fast and too easy to level so everyone is getting leveled as fast as they can. i know of many people that only started crafting after all of the exp increases because it was easy and not because they cared about crafting.

they need to tighten back down the exp on all dow/dom/dol/dol classes and stop allowing the easy leveling that is destroying the game from the inside. the easier it is to level the more people are going to continue hitting all 50's on every class because it is easy to do so.

I agree. I feel that super fast leveling is definitely a contributing factor too.

But with slower craft leveling comes more product output. To me, that would seem like it would only compound the problem in our current state of the game, not relieve it.

We didn't have this issue when leveling was slower before because we used to grind on part or material recipes that crafters often just vendored while leveling. Finished items were solely put up on the wards for making money. Now people have to grind on mostly finished items due to the crafting updates and are just trying to get back something on their grind items which were expensive to make.

I said back before recipe simplification that the market would flood with items due to removing parts and trying to sell anything would be almost impossible. I also said crafters would go broke trying to level because they would not be able to make a return at all on the stuff they were grinding on. I think I remember you saying so as well. People told us we were wrong and now here we are. Surprise!

[darkstarpoet1]

I agree. I feel that super fast leveling is definitely a contributing factor too.

But with slower craft leveling comes more product output. To me, that would seem like it would only compound the problem in our current state of the game, not relieve it.

We didn't have this issue when leveling was slower before because we used to grind on part or material recipes that crafters often just vendored while leveling. Finished items were solely put up on the wards for making money. Now people have to grind on mostly finished items due to the crafting updates and are just trying to get back something on their grind items which were expensive to make.

I said back before recipe simplification that the market would flood with items due to removing parts and trying to sell anything would be almost impossible. I also said crafters would go broke trying to level because they would not be able to make a return at all on the stuff they were grinding on. I think I remember you saying so as well. People told us we were wrong and now here we are. Surprise!

oh i know. we both warned them about this issue, but they refused to listen. now the issue has arrived they want to blame other things besides what they were warned about.

you also have to remember with a higher leveling curve less people would be leveling those classes so that would work to balance it out. alot of people are leveling crafts because it is so easy, but don't care for crafting. yes, more gear would come per person due to grinding, but less people would be grinding. if it was harder to level every class then less people would do it because they would be concentrating on the classes they are interested in and not doing things because it is fast and easy.

the other way to look at it. right now most everyone in game has at least one craft to cap. even is they take and only let people take up one class beyond once cap is increased the same problem will exist. leveling is so easy people will just raise that one class and still have the same or even higher competition for selling. here's an example of what i mean.

right now a random number of 6k people just to keep numbers easy have at least 1 craft capped and another 1k people have every class capped. there's 8 dol's. those 1k people and the 6k people have a total of 14k classes at cap total.

when 2.0 hits and leveling stays super give me easy then all of those new players are going to do the same thing we already have. if they do not drastically slow down the leveling curve you are likely to have more people with a capped class than you have total on each server now even if you only allow one class past 50 per person. even if you made it those same 7k people with a single class to cap and add in another 10x that due to the easy leveling then it would still make matters worse than it is now.

edit: the reason i put in the slower leveling curve as a way to relieve the mass of output is with slower leveling in all classes then low, mid, and high level gear is in demand. that in itself triples the amount of gear that is needed. right now the only gear in demand is high level stuff. for example if 1-30 didn't take around 1 hour to get through then people would actually need to get that low and mid level gear. right now they just skip by it because it is not needed while they are sitting on their chocobo being power leveled.

[Conradus]

They need to make gear break permanently or something to drive up the demand for gear and strip it from the wards faster (yeah right lol)

Oh, I've got an idea! They could make it so that you can destroy gear to get gear enhancing items! And then they can make it so that if you try to put multiple gear enhancers on one piece of gear there's a chance you can destroy everything! All we need is a name for it...