Criterion dungeons - will there be 'preferred' jobs?

[Risvertasashi]

MCH is great in 4-man content

and in potd, hoh, etc.

Some people can't look beyond "lags a bit in 8 person content with perfectly timed and stacked buff windows" to "blows every ranged except blm out of the water in everything else and can kite forever", alas

[Risvertasashi]

Made even better by the fact that phys range could be excluded entirely since they won't be required for the 1% group buff.

if that happens, it'll probably be magical ranged as well. RDM and SMN don't have their rez utility anymore and in this setting, have worse damage than MCH. BLM has a bit more damage but doesn't have the mobility/kiting.

If there's nothing that gives a downside to melee in this content, though, it could very well be a MNK+SAM meta for DPS.

[Rolder50]

if that happens, it'll probably be magical ranged as well. RDM and SMN don't have their rez utility anymore and in this setting, have worse damage than MCH. BLM has a bit more damage but doesn't have the mobility/kiting.

If there's nothing that gives a downside to melee in this content, though, it could very well be a MNK+SAM meta for DPS.

Looking at the dungeon statistics the other poster provided, Summoner beats out some melee, so they would still be strong even without a rez. Probably thanks to their ridiculous amount of AoE on the trash pulls.

[LittleImp]

Some people can't look beyond "lags a bit in 8 person content with perfectly timed and stacked buff windows" to "blows every ranged except blm out of the water in everything else and can kite forever", alas

MCH is still pretty weak in dungeons, the other phys ranged just kind of lose their edge over it.

As others have been saying, we'll probably just see melee/caster comps with phys ranged benched, unless they add some kind of content-specific mechanic that makes phys ranged more powerful.

[TheMightyMollusk]

Summoner has mobility and decent damage. Red mage has....umm....nice hats?

[Risvertasashi]

Looking at the dungeon statistics the other poster provided, Summoner beats out some melee, so they would still be strong even without a rez. Probably thanks to their ridiculous amount of AoE on the trash pulls.

AOE and burst that recharges between pulls, yeah. And now we're getting into the specifics of "how will it be tuned?" which we don't know.

If it's just uptuned regular dungeons, aoe and buffers will still be relatively strong, though the latter still much diminished compared to 8 person content.

If it's more like HoH/PotD's "hardcore"/upper floors, well, that's going to play out a good bit differently and, again, with rez utility out of the way, selfish damage, ideally without much setup and with a lot of mobility, is likely to be king here.

But we don't know that much yet, we'll have to wait and see.

MCH is still pretty weak in dungeons, the other phys ranged just kind of lose their edge over it.

As others have been saying, we'll probably just see melee/caster comps with phys ranged benched, unless they add some kind of content-specific mechanic that makes phys ranged more powerful.

But for people that want the best single-target damage outside of a timed raid buff setting and with smaller comps, MCH outperforms SMN and RDM. (ie, potd/hoh-style tuning).

And melee outperform all of the above. Ranged can still be valuable in potd/hoh because they can more easily avoid deadly/one-shot attacks from mobs and traps, but it's unknown if things like this will be a factor in criterion dungeons.

If mobs hit weakly enough that mass pulls are still possible and good aoe for large numbers is a thing, RDM and SMN may still be favored.

[Absimiliard]

and in potd, hoh, etc.

Some people can't look beyond "lags a bit in 8 person content with perfectly timed and stacked buff windows" to "blows every ranged except blm out of the water in everything else and can kite forever", alas

You are underestimating SMN a lot here. Even bereft of its rez utility, it boasts some of the highest raw burst you will get out of a ranged DPS. Its burst windows are frequent, powerful, and highly effective for both AoE and single-target. It blows BLM clean out of the atmosphere in this regard. I would wager it handily exceeds MCH in both of these areas as well.

As you said: weakness in 8-man content does not translate to weakness in dungeons.

I definitely expect to see a lot of SMN activity in Criterion.

[MirielleLavandre]

Yep, I saw in an article on estnn.com where it stated
"Instead of having to pick and chose paths that lead through the dungeon, it'll be a linear experience. Raises will also be limited to only one raise per player. And this will only recharge after a boss is slain. To reach a boss, players have to clear out monsters roaming the maze. But, unlike other dungeons, just pulling everything wall to wall will guarantee a wipe. Naoki Yoshida warned players that pulling more than one enemy at a time will end up in disaster and it is up to players to position and pull monsters in the right order to smoothly advance to the next boss."

That's why I made the post because it sounds so different from current dungeons, I wondered what would work best. That quote is in reference to savage.

[Absimiliard]

I can almost guarantee you people will find ways to pull groups of mobs anyway. They'll either have to overtune the fudge out of the mobs, give all of them some kind of stackable debuff, or nerf certain jobs. If not, there will definitely be shenanigans from certain quasi-immortal job combinations.

[CaedemSanguis]

Its not just about the balance, its also about the overall difficulty of the dungeon, the job balance will matter only if dps check are very tight