Paladin Updates

[Rydin]

That's not to say that they shouldn't have adjusted the abilities as they did today. They are all nice improvements. I just meant that PLD needs to be able to handle a crowd if it is going to compete with WAR.

TBH.... warrior doesn't do good with crowds either.... Steel Cyclone is pointless once the first AOE nuke goes out

[Sol_Aureus]

Doesn't it depend on how effective the new abilities for Pld are? Pld may be gaining a lot of self-sufficiency, allowing the whm more breathing room, virtually elminating the need to even consider taking a second? Speculation, but at least something worthy of thought. Being able to change jobs is great, too. All it costs is the 15 minute ability which are generally lackluster. There is so much versatility that none of us seem to be messin around with. I'm going to mess with things to find the best set up.

This is all just boss fight talk though, when it comes to clearing trash mobs otw to the bosses, sad to say, warrior still wins no contest.

Honestly I don't think the buffs PLD got this update give it the edge it needs. For stuff like Coincounter, sure, it's great. Divine Veil will be awesome for blocking swipes. Unfortunately though, unless they also increased the range of Divine Veil this patch, the healing effect is still not that useful considering the vast majority of the time everyone is out of range of the PLD, so the regen doesn't get much use.

Spirits within's buff is nice, but it's not like PLD had any trouble with hate before. A little extra damage output, but still nowhere close to a WAR.

Cover's buff is nice but not anything significant.

Stuff like Glower is still a huge danger to PLDs, not to mention Chimera. The point stands that because WAR's HP is so much higher than a PLD's and WARs can hold hate just fine AND they can deal significant damage that PLD is still lacking. L

Regarding virtually elminating the need to even consider taking a second WHM, like I said in my post, what class your tank is has virtually nothing to do with why people take 2 WHMs. People will still want to take 2 WHMs for that safety net.

[Peptaru]

I had meant for it to be taken that PLD provides its own safety net, I didn't miss your point, really! If pld provides enough breathing room then that second whm slot would just be wide open, if they don't then nothing would change from how it is now.

[Xianghua]

I had meant for it to be taken that PLD provides its own safety net, I didn't miss your point, really! If pld provides enough breathing room then that second whm slot would just be wide open, if they don't then nothing would change from how it is now.

People still do things on Classes for a safety net. It won't change. lol

[Sol_Aureus]

I had meant for it to be taken that PLD provides its own safety net, I didn't miss your point, really! If pld provides enough breathing room then that second whm slot would just be wide open, if they don't then nothing would change from how it is now.

And given the changes listed in the patch notes, they don't even come close to providing the same kind of safety net having another WHM does. If your 1 WHM dies your PLD can't really take over main healing efficiently, you don't have chainspell raises to get your down WHM alive again, AoE cures, regen, the list goes on.

The mitigation PLD has is practically the same as a WAR with exception of the force blocks, which are only useful in certain situations. When your PLD and WAR both get hit with glower and take 3,000 damage and your PLD has 3,500 HP vs your WAR's 4,500...yeah.

[Alerith]

People still do things on Classes for a safety net. It won't change. lol

You're clearly not on an intellectual level high enough for this discussion.

"It won't change!"
"...never can and never will!"

If you can't contribute anything useful to the topic at hand, please refrain from posting. Especially when you clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

[Peptaru]

And given the changes listed in the patch notes, they don't even come close to providing the same kind of safety net having another WHM does. If your 1 WHM dies your PLD can't really take over main healing efficiently, you don't have chainspell raises to get your down WHM alive again, AoE cures, regen, the list goes on.

The mitigation PLD has is practically the same as a WAR with exception of the force blocks, which are only useful in certain situations. When your PLD and WAR both get hit with glower and take 3,000 damage and your PLD has 3,500 HP vs your WAR's 4,500...yeah.

How'd you let your whm die?! You're doin it wrong!

[Xianghua]

You're clearly not on an intellectual level high enough for this discussion.

"It won't change!"
"...never can and never will!"

If you can't contribute anything useful to the topic at hand, please refrain from posting. Especially when you clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

Actually look at what we are talking about before insulting someone's intelligence. People are not all the sudden going to start running 1 white mage. just because pld has some new def buffs. That's not the reason they run with 2 whms.
They run with 2 white mages for the same reason other groups run things as classes. To have that safety net for when something goes wrong. Those people won't change.

It's the Same reason people do all the fights as Ranged DD to avoid AoE. Because it's much more Safer then going in with melee's. Once again these people will not change their stance. Until the fights change.

[Akumu]

EDIT: Have people actually tested enmity generation with Vengeance? The chat log states that the damage is inflicted by the mob itself, so i've always been suspicious of any enmity generation by the damage caused by the ability.

I have not crunched any numbers but I would say it does grant enmity. I have popped Sent(or Antagonize) with vengeance and held 6+ mobs at once while DD were attacking different targets.

It is also listed as a Counter! so I see it as the system has it down like you are doing the damage back at them.

[Alerith]

If your 1 WHM dies your PLD can't really take over main healing efficiently, you don't have chainspell raises to get your down WHM alive again

Not completely true. Assuming you haven't had any other "Oh shit" moment, this is the perfect chance to make use of Hallowed Ground > Raise.