Some jobs aren’t well-balanced in dungeons

[Supersnow845]

Clearable, probably.

You're basically griefing unless you run WAR/SGE/BLM/(probably)SMN, also likely. The sustain and AOE damage of that combo of four is significantly better than their competition.

Criterion is likely going to be more like DRS than anything prior to it in the game so likely WAR’s sustain will be totally useless beyond how it’s tuned in raids, still your point about that combo (or sub BLM with DNC) is just disgustingly tuned for AOE spam which is just……why

[Raoabolic]

*Reads thread*
*Remembers HW era DRK*
*Remembers w2w pulls during Baelsar's Wall and all that sweet sweet hp drain*
Like tears in the rain... ;_;

[Amenara]

You guys memeing DRK while the real problem at dungeon right now is GNB... Despite all of the cd they get, still problematic on big pulling...

GNBs have the biggest swings in tanking skill that I have out of all of the tanks. When my friend GNB tanks a dungeon, I never have to heal them, when I get randoms from DF, most of them I am spam healing to keep them alive. Everyone's complaining about DRK but usually DRKs are pretty decent in dungeons. I think one of my favorite things about playing SCH in dungeons is that I can actually use a whole bunch of tools I normally don't get to because of ED as was pointed out earlier.

Also, jobs aren't balanced around dungeons, every job is more than viable in them.

[Mikey_R]

SCH used to have an aoe dot from what I recall, wasn't it Virus? They deleted it.
Just like they removed Aero 3 (also aoe dot) from WHM.
I'll never understand it.

You are thinking of Miasma 2. It was a GCD, Instant cast AoE centred around the caster. The Dot potency was really weak, with the potency per GCD on a single target being less than Ruin.

[Jeeqbit]

Some tuning to jobs based on dungeons would help Dark Knight be less of a pain to do big pulls as most of their problems with mitigation and self-sustain is most evident in dungeon content.

The Blackest Night absorbs 25% worth of health in damage, which can be effectively increased by combining it with Shadow Wall, Rampart, Oblation, Reprisal, Dark Missionary or Dark Mind. On a 15s cooldown, it can have almost 50% uptime.

Every 60 seconds you can use Abyssal Drain to absorb health from all of the enemies there. The more enemies the bigger the heal. If you think you'll die, you can use Living Dead and heal yourself to full.

A good dark knight is more comfortable to heal than the others in a lot of dungeons. I met a sprout one in the last 5.0 MSQ dungeon the other day who was really good and I didn't need to heal them hardly at all with eos heals.

The other tanks can sustain themselves without a healer a lot of the time, but after taking the damage first, which still makes the healer think about healing. Dark Knight doesn't take the damage in the first place. Paladin is worse at 80 and lower because the only sustain they have is on the GCD and their other unique mitigation doesn't compare to The Blackest Night.

It would also help Scholar not have to burn through so many resources during trash packs which other healers can do with less effort.

It's not difficult to do this on Scholar. Unlike White Mage, they don't have some of their instant heals on the GCD so they can DPS uninterrupted. Complaining that healers actually have to press their heals probably wouldn't sit well with all the healers who want to have more situations that actually require them to heal. Big pulls in certain dungeons are one of the few situations that actually make healers useful and you want to unbalance it by making them more useless than people already regard them.

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

That’s because people try to play shield healers like a WHM, the shield healers are the stronger dungeon healers but you actually have to organise your healing in advance, you can’t just spam adlo when things go south

Reminds me of those rare times when people asked me to use more Adlos because they ain’t getting ‘heals’ despite no deaths occurred and I was like “Bruh, those WD/Union/Excog/Soil were invisible to you or what? -_-“

You guys memeing DRK while the real problem at dungeon right now is GNB... Despite all of the cd they get, still problematic on big pulling...

Imho people are just babied too much by WAR & some PLDs carrying the large bulk of healing required in wall pulling. I’ve said it plenty of times in the past both in-game & out: if you (general you, not you Knot_D) were capable to heal a DRK back in ShB through a wall pull, then EW DRK will be just as fine. Heck PLD was spicier to heal or use to wall pull back then and I don’t think I’ve seen more ”Reee I need more self sustain.”-complaints compared to present.

[Larirawiel]

Some tuning to jobs based on dungeons would help Dark Knight be less of a pain to do big pulls as most of their problems with mitigation and self-sustain is most evident in dungeon content. If dungeon balance was considered more, it wouldn’t feel as bad to take into dungeons and people would stop automatically leaving or harassing you because you chose to play DRK.

I never experienced it, sorry. Yes, sometimes i die when i do big pulls. But i can adapt it and my next pulls will not be as big as the first pulls. And the second thing is, you can meld Battledance Materia, which increases your Tenacity. This lowers your damage taken and increases incoming heals.


Cheers

[Jettinson]

Never had people complaining you join a dungeon with a certain class unless you go without a job stone for obvious reasons.

When you get too used to Warrior's self sustain or PLD i can see either some sense of relief or stress depending on healer but either way the runs are pretty standard with w2ws.

And Living Dead is super good now so all about using mitigations well/see how dps and healers are going

[Vatom]

*Reads thread*
*Remembers HW era DRK*
*Remembers w2w pulls during Baelsar's Wall and all that sweet sweet hp drain*
Like tears in the rain... ;_;

Owe ;_; that hurt.

Since LD has become better and gear has out powered the issues during launch I haven't been having any real issues though there wasn't a heavy one back then either but I would love a AD stack and fuse oblation and drk mind would be nice but hey thats me

Paladin is worse at 80 and lower because the only sustain they have is on the GCD and their other unique mitigation doesn't compare to The Blackest Night.

Say your a PLD main with out saying your a PLD main lol


I do agree that almost all the jobs aren't design around dungeons but that's because they aren't even looked at as significant
Until the new dungeons come out we don't fully know for sure but as of now most classes are design around Savage etc
and thats because its the height maybe if the new dungeons are at that lvl then maybe they will change it but I doubt to the extreme

[Kes13a]

the basic purpose of "balance" leads to homogenization. its end goal is to make all classes exactly the same. I would vote no just for that.

removal of any kind of skill required to play a job is not a step forward and does not favour any new players. it frustrates those people that do their best to figure optimal rotations to use what is available to them. it also preloads boredom.

this mythical "balance" might have some foothold in a more pvp centered game, but even then, Blizzard has spent YEARS "balancing" and it hasnt helped WoW any, in fact its an incredibly dull game. and some of their epic fails at it have required an entire patch cycle to calm the whining about the latest OP class the created in the name of "balancing" before nerfing it into virtual oblivion.

no thanks. pvp here isnt front and center, nor should it be. in a pve world, everyone is different, make the jobs better, more fun, yes. but "balance". no thank you