The feeling of beeing Home ...

[Jeeqbit]

It's funny how desperate some posters are to counter this supposed 'minority' of players who have concerns about the direction of the game. In reality, I think they're so married to the game that they continue to see any feedback that isn't glowing praise as a personal attack.

There is a difference between having concerns and flat out being rude or being a naysayer that thinks the game does nothing right. Otherwise, the entire point of a forum is debate.

It is extremely exhausting when you want to provide honest feedback only to be met by individuals who are dismissive on the basis of the poster’s tone

Tone is everything. It's awful to imagine the developers going to a fanfest and having people say in person some of the things I have read on these forums that have been so rude.

[SannaR]

It's funny how desperate some posters are to counter this supposed 'minority' of players who have concerns about the direction of the game. In reality, I think they're so married to the game that they continue to see any feedback that isn't glowing praise as a personal attack. Interesting that we're supposedly such a minority but every thread that is even slightly critical of Endwalker is effectively camped by those with an apparent allergy to criticism of the game.

You mean just like those who take disagreements as personal attacks? Or heaven forbid someone utters the words Nazi and Garlemald in the same sentence? Even if that's to point out similarities between both countries? Oh wait we can't say those things cause people who don't like their favorite faction being compared to a real world parallel get their knickers in a twist and try to stifle those who bring up said comparisons. Go ahead and call me a gatekeeping, breastfeeding loving simp of a female demagogue that is crystal mommy. Also don't try and say you never reacted this way or used such words cause I'm fairly sure you've used all of those in some compacity or another.

Again just because someone likes something overall or even partially doesn't mean that they might not have faults with said thing. It's just they don't feel the need to look as though they're still hung up and bitter about it. To the point where it's taken to an extreme and people wonder if they've fallen into a retelling of Chicken Little. Where any complaint must mean that the game is in some kind of death spiral.

[Raoabolic]

I don't think that's fully true. What I think is going on is that they are trying to focus on everybody, and everything suffers because of it. Although, storywise, they do seem to be focusing more and more towards fan service, with characters like G'raha Tia at the forefront.

If they are going for that route then I would love if they put XV's tagline of "For Final Fantasy fans and first-timers" during the first cutscene after you make your character. I would get a hearty chuckle, lol.

[aveyond-dreams]

Tone is everything. It's awful to imagine the developers going to a fanfest and having people say in person some of the things I have read on these forums that have been so rude.

There are significant sectors of the playerbase who feel that they are not being listened to at best or deliberately being ignored with no answer at worst. When this continues for long enough, it is understandable why those players are choosing to react that the way they do. This is why being able to have clear and honest discussions is important. Let the playerbase know they are being listened to and actually respond to feedback in a prompt and timely manner.

Endwalker was a letdown from both a story, gameplay, and content experience. I need to see something better if this game wants to keep my attention. Right now in Lost Ark I see the customization options I always wanted for men in this game, found a class that plays better than my main class in FFXIV (which finally got its rework to be an actual Summoner after 8 years of going down the Warlock route), and found the NPC rapport system I wished this game had. When not playing that I have Fire Emblem and soon Diofield Chronicle while I wait for the releases of Tactics Ogre and then Crisis Core. My time is limited. FFXIV is currently in no position to demand more of my attention than these other games, because I have lost a great amount of confidence in the storytelling and future direction.

This needs to be rectified.

[MikkoAkure]

Kindly stop pretending like there's ANY equivalence in this. Ala Mhigo, Rabanastre, Valnain, Doma and Bozja still exist as do considerable sums of their peoples. Garlemald's native territories are in ruins and are never coming back, and most of their people are dead. As you said, they were victims of Emet-Selch's "treachery" so you cannot honestly say they brought it on themselves either.

Bozja was completely melted and there’s less of it around than there is of Garlemald. Rabanastre is a smoking hole in the ground that was filled with lucavi until we cleared them out. Doma was reduced to a bunch of shacks, with Monzen still in ruins. The Bozjans we bump into were all rebels who were elsewhere, in prison, or even part of the Garlean army with the inhabitants of the city all dead to the last, including the occupiers.

And just because the people got tricked doesn’t mean they’re completely blameless. The people were for the most part (minus the populares) all for conquest. Garlemald didn’t march armies of Emet-Selch clones across the world. He weaponized their resentment, but he didn’t bring forth what wasn’t already there and he put fancy new technology in their hands and they mostly did the rest. And all the destruction they brought upon themselves was after he peaced out and ceased to be an influence.

My point was that it doesn’t matter how “worthy” you are of such a fate in this story, bad stuff can still happen to you. The story of the Garleans is ultimately a tragic one, but they still spent 60 years being warmongers so I don’t think you’ll find many people who disagree that karma came back and hit them hard.

No one said they’re not coming back either. If you do the role capstone quests, the majority of the inhabitants are rebuilding while a few pessimists decided to go to the moon because they think all is lost but they’re too proud to be refugees in a neutral country. Garleans have immigrated all across the empire and there were still people in the capital so they weren’t completely annihilated.

[SentioftheHoukai]

You mean just like those who take disagreements as personal attacks? Or heaven forbid someone utters the words Nazi and Garlemald in the same sentence? Even if that's to point out similarities between both countries? Oh wait we can't say those things cause people who don't like their favorite faction being compared to a real world parallel get their knickers in a twist and try to stifle those who bring up said comparisons. Go ahead and call me a gatekeeping, breastfeeding loving simp of a female demagogue that is crystal mommy. Also don't try and say you never reacted this way or used such words cause I'm fairly sure you've used all of those in some compacity or another.

Again just because someone likes something overall or even partially doesn't mean that they might not have faults with said thing. It's just they don't feel the need to look as though they're still hung up and bitter about it. To the point where it's taken to an extreme and people wonder if they've fallen into a retelling of Chicken Little. Where any complaint must mean that the game is in some kind of death spiral.

Actually, yes Sanna the equating fantasy empires with Nazi Germany DOES NEED TO STOP. It's lazy criticism and contributes nothing to the discussion. All it does is make unnecessary enemies. Also, it's not considering it a personal attack when someone insinuates that liking Garlemald or Ascians means someone also idolizes Nazi Germany, IT IS A PERSONAL ATTACK. Full stop, end of debate. If you cannot or refuse to understand this, then you have no future talking to us and indeed in any debate expected to remain polite and intelligent.

Go ahead and call me a gatekeeping, breastfeeding loving simp of a female demagogue that is crystal mommy.

This? This isn't necessary. It's an ad hominem and you know it.

My point was that it doesn’t matter how “worthy” you are of such a fate in this story, bad stuff can still happen to you. The story of the Garleans is ultimately a tragic one, but they still spent 60 years being warmongers so I don’t think you’ll find many people who disagree that karma came back and hit them hard.

That would be believable.... if it ever happened to US. As it stands, we and our allies despite many considerably immoral deeds always remain in the right, justified and most importantly UNTOUCHED AND UNDAMAGED. No matter what we do, we pay no penance and suffer no retribution. No, that's reserved for BAD GUYS. Whatever woes and plights the Scions, the Eorzean Alliance and any distant allies may suffer Square fails to properly display whereas our so-called enemies have their suffering presented front and center with no window dressing and without cease. Worst of all, it's considerable justified by the narrative far too often. This is an issue, an issue Naoki Yoshida fails to address.

No one said they’re not coming back either. If you do the role capstone quests, the majority of the inhabitants are rebuilding while a few pessimists decided to go to the moon because they think all is lost but they’re too proud to be refugees in a neutral country. Garleans have immigrated all across the empire and there were still people in the capital so they weren’t completely annihilated.

Far less than any territory considered "more worthy" of being saved.

[aveyond-dreams]

I don't think that's fully true. I do think is going on is that they are trying to focus on everybody, and everything suffers because of it. Storywise, they do seem to be focusing more and more towards fan service, with characters like G'raha Tia at the forefront.

G'raha Tia in my opinion remains one of the best characters in FFXIV that was repeatedly cheapened by the mishandling of his character in the story to the point where he is likely one of the most important problems in the current writing. Stories shouldn't be turning previous fans of him like me into people who cannot stand to see him on screen, or more recently in 6.1 when he started talking my number 1 thought was, "This is kind of embarrassing, maybe I should just go ahead and uninstall this."

Characters like him don't move copies of the game or make for decent posterboys, that's what characters that look and behave like Aymeric, Estinien, Ardbert, or Hien do. G'raha Tia is not a man that fulfils any common fantasy archetype and it makes him all the more difficult to get invested in at a glance. While his Shadowbringers writing can indeed hook a player once they get to know him long enough, starting in 5.4 that begins to be eroded away until he's reduced to his state in 6.1. This shouldn't have played out like this.

[SturmChurro]

G'raha Tia in my opinion remains one of the best characters in FFXIV that was repeatedly cheapened by the mishandling of his character in the story to the point where he is likely one of the most important problems in the current writing. Stories shouldn't be turning previous fans of him like me into people who cannot stand to see him on screen, or more recently in 6.1 when he started talking my number 1 thought was, "This is kind of embarrassing, maybe I should just go ahead and uninstall this."

I don't know about one of the best characters, but the Crystal Exarch was a lot better as a character than the current G'raha Tia, and, I even said it at the time: I thought the Crystal Exarch's end would have been fitting for the character. The current G'raha Tia just doesn't work for me, and cheapens the Crystal Exarch. G'raha Tia was still around, they didn't have to do what they did, they could have treated the character much better.

[SannaR]

Actually, yes Sanna the equating fantasy empires with Nazi Germany DOES NEED TO STOP. It's lazy criticism and contributes nothing to the discussion. All it does is make unnecessary enemies. Also, it's not considering it a personal attack when someone insinuates that liking Garlemald or Ascians means someone also idolizes Nazi Germany, IT IS A PERSONAL ATTACK. Full stop, end of debate. If you cannot or refuse to understand this, then you have no future talking to us and indeed in any debate expected to remain polite and intelligent.



This? This isn't necessary. It's an ad hominem and you know it.

You're proving my point though. People who like Garleans or their country should be able to separate how they feel about those characters or the country in general from anyone comparing a few of its citizens and the propaganda the government taught from feeling like they're being personally attacked. What would you use to compare the treatment of all the other races by Garleans as beneath them, that the magic the other races can wield are unclean, that everyone should be subjugated under Garlean rule? Or how Varis comes off when his idea of at the time defeating the Ascians is to do so under his command?

What? I can't be tired of Theo trying to be neutral when he's been just as bad? Only to fall back when people call him out on his stuff? Or that those who bring up complaints are the only ones who are the innocent victims? When both sides do it? Since he always asks for fairness when it comes to people discussing various topics where he and others feel that people don't bring up that the side their on has done or said similar stuff.

[MikkoAkure]

Actually, yes Sanna the equating fantasy empires with Nazi Germany DOES NEED TO STOP. It's lazy criticism and contributes nothing to the discussion. All it does is make unnecessary enemies. Also, it's not considering it a personal attack when someone insinuates that liking Garlemald or Ascians means someone also idolizes Nazi Germany, IT IS A PERSONAL ATTACK. Full stop, end of debate. If you cannot or refuse to understand this, then you have no future talking to us and indeed in any debate expected to remain polite and intelligent.

I personally don’t mention is so as to not invoke Godwin’s Law, but Garlemald borrows heavily from the Gestahlian Empire from FFVI which borrowed a lot of imagery from nazi Germany. The Gestahlian Empire even has the nazi salute, which didn’t make it into FFXIV for obvious reasons. But the general gist and even magitek designs were ported directly over.

A lot of stock “evil empire” tropes originate in WW2, such as the black, white, and red color scheme and a focus on military technology.

I feel like people forget that there was nothing at all in the game to make you care for the Garleans when they were first written. They weren’t originally designed to be sympathetic, that got tacked on afterwards to make the game more nuanced and interesting. We had an entire expansion that revolves around how terrible they are.