Petition against Level Sync

[Quietus]

Like this post If you disagree with the op >_>

This is the most genius response ever. And it goes to show the OP that he's an idiot without saying it directly.

[Levian]

You are completely full of shit. I refused level sync all the time, and other people I know did also.

My my, such venom and spite...clearly you and I have two widely varied opinions of the same game. Not quoting all of that, too long. But I'll start at the top and work my way down.

I refused to synch for a while, aside from a few rare occasions with shellmates. I'd say WotG is when things got extreme. Note that I specified Ronfuare synch parties, as in Ronfuare (S). I spent the majority of my FFXI playtime on Remora, among the first to migrate over when the server was put up actually, until it was recently merged with Leviathan. If you spent any time there about halfway through WotG you know as well as I do this next paragraph is spot on...

The occasional level range? This is a lovely trip down memory lane actually, the last time I played was Bard. We did worms in Qufim from 20-36, with some mandragoras in Yuhtunga Jungle intermittantly from 27-36 though I promise you that was 2 groups at best. Then it was off to Ronfuare (S) for those darling pink birdies, until 55 when you went to toau for more pink birdies until you hit 75 and merit off of yes, more pink birdies. That was IT. No Garliage citadel, Crawler's Nest, Yhoater jungle, East/West Altepa. You get the picture.

The third section you quoted there was actually intended to pin the blame for said issues on ToAU. Perhaps I should've been a little more clear, but that IS where things began to slide down that slippery slope of catering to the more casual crowd. As far as precisely when it was gutted clearly we have differing views. For me it started with ToAU and ended with Abbyssea.

I ask you this, if ToAU saved FFXI, why then did it's population spike at the release, then quickly drop back down below where it had settled prior to it's release? The same can be said for WotG. Granted they were updates and population spikes are expected. But the game continued to decline after the spikes petered out, and fell to levels below where it was before BOTH of those releases. Can you say with a straight face that you know for SURE had ToAU and WotG not come out, that the game would be dead by now?

For every player you can personally name that was brought in by one of those updates, I can name one that left. I'm not saying that the game would still be alive had nothing been done, but I'm not going to laud the updates as saviors of a dying game either. I can probably still dig up the MMO population graphs for comparison if you need me to backup this statement, but they hardly saved anything and were more like putting a comatose patient on life support.

And your last statement? I could have sworn I made it clear that SOME of us liked the old SC/MB playstyle. I liked my BLMs, and didn't find it fair that they were sitting on the sidelines, busting their @$$ to solo XP while the rest of us left them in the dust until we needed them again @ 75. Was the old way perfect? No, clearly melee DD needed some tweaking, and perhaps we needed some more options for closing Skillchains so womething other than BLM got that first seat in the party. Was the answer to obliterate the art of Skillchains in the process? I didn't, and still don't think so.

Edit: Perhaps it is unfair to say level synch destroyed the game as there were a myriad of factors involved, but it did add yet another thing that could be, and certainly was, exploited to death.

[Peptaru]

To everyone who wants to flame/bash/beat upon the very thought of level sync i have just one thing to say? Are you effin serious? If you want to blame something for your personal bad experiences with level sync, blame the player base and more specifically the people you played with. Blame people for being stupid, the system itself works fine. That is all, ty for readin.

[Dragon]

My my, such venom and spite...clearly you and I have two widely varied opinions of the same game. Not quoting all of that, too long. But I'll start at the top and work my way down.

I refused to synch for a while, aside from a few rare occasions with shellmates. I'd say WotG is when things got extreme. Note that I specified Ronfuare synch parties, as in Ronfuare (S). I spent the majority of my FFXI playtime on Remora, among the first to migrate over when the server was put up actually, until it was recently merged with Leviathan. If you spent any time there about halfway through WotG you know as well as I do this next paragraph is spot on...

The occasional level range? This is a lovely trip down memory lane actually, the last time I played was Bard. We did worms in Qufim from 20-36, with some mandragoras in Yuhtunga Jungle intermittantly from 27-36 though I promise you that was 2 groups at best. Then it was off to Ronfuare (S) for those darling pink birdies, until 55 when you went to toau for more pink birdies until you hit 75 and merit off of yes, more pink birdies. That was IT. No Garliage citadel, Crawler's Nest, Yhoater jungle, East/West Altepa. You get the picture.

Well no wonder why Remora was a complete backwards server.

The third section you quoted there was actually intended to pin the blame for said issues on ToAU. Perhaps I should've been a little more clear, but that IS where things began to slide down that slippery slope of catering to the more casual crowd. As far as precisely when it was gutted clearly we have differing views. For me it started with ToAU and ended with Abbyssea.

ToAU didn't cater to the casuals or it wouldn't have had a Leveling requirement of +55, it wasn't something you could just enjoy right as you got into the game. It was about giving options to do different things.

I ask you this, if ToAU saved FFXI, why then did it's population spike at the release, then quickly drop back down below where it had settled prior to it's release? The same can be said for WotG. Granted they were updates and population spikes are expected. But the game continued to decline after the spikes petered out, and fell to levels below where it was before BOTH of those releases. Can you say with a straight face that you know for SURE had ToAU and WotG not come out, that the game would be dead by now?

The game was already experiencing population decline long before ToAU.

For every player you can personally name that was brought in by one of those updates, I can name one that left. I'm not saying that the game would still be alive had nothing been done, but I'm not going to laud the updates as saviors of a dying game either. I can probably still dig up the MMO population graphs for comparison if you need me to backup this statement, but they hardly saved anything and were more like putting a comatose patient on life support.

Graphs can be used to construe anything.

But for the record, I'm not talking about people being brought in by those expansions and their updates - I'm talking about people that were going to permanently leave with the game in the state it was pre-ToAU.

And your last statement? I could have sworn I made it clear that SOME of us liked the old SC/MB playstyle. I liked my BLMs, and didn't find it fair that they were sitting on the sidelines, busting their @$$ to solo XP while the rest of us left them in the dust until we needed them again @ 75. Was the old way perfect? No, clearly melee DD needed some tweaking, and perhaps we needed some more options for closing Skillchains so womething other than BLM got that first seat in the party. Was the answer to obliterate the art of Skillchains in the process? I didn't, and still don't think so.

No one obliterated skillchains in the process. But at least BLM was able to solo through almost anything and still was required at endgame. Not even Paladin nor Ninja had that much an advantage - it was usually possible to only require one or the other, and even then, one was simply able to use RDM/NIN or DRK tanks, but BLM? No alternative whatsoever, period. Even when Scholar came out, BLM was still the ultimate DPS. (And here, I'll give you some credit for admitting it needed some fix.)

But again, ToAU never interfered with anything between 1~55. Nearly every single place from 20 to 55 (Valkurm Dunes also, but that doesn't count because anyone that bothered getting EXP parties pre-Qufim was an idiot) still required sneak and invisible to get around properly and skillchains with magic bursts for higher EXP/HR: Qufim Island, Korroloka Tunnel, Garlaige Citadel, Crawlers' Nest, The Eldieme Necropolis, Quicksand Caves, East/West Altepa, Kuftal Tunnel, and so on.

Perhaps the problem were the Xbox 360 players that came with ToAU since the Xbox 360 player stereotype is typically a FPS fanboi that has no clue about RPG elements.

[DyskoFox]

Bumping for no level sync!

[TirionCrey]

I'm totally against level sync as well...can't even express how much I'm against it.

People who think it didn't effect FFXI really that much, hence ruined it, have no fucking clue about how it destroyed the whole immersion with the world. On Lvl 20 you knew "ok now it's time to prepare for my departure to Jeuno", On lvl 18 you knew "now I gotta get the items for the SJ quest". On 25 you knew "I need to get to Rank 3 City Missions so I can start my airship pass quest so I can go on lvling in Kazham"...all your way from 1-75 the game was "forcing" you to go into all kinds of areas all over the world and that was how it SHOULD be, then lvl sync came...

BUT, in FFXI it became neccesarry at some point to implement such a system...but only for one stupid reason, cause it was impossible to lvl solo at a reasonable pace. Still it destroyed the world, might sound exaggerating but it did.

When I started FFXI, it took me 1 year to get my first Job to 75(including subjobs etc). You wanna know how many areas I visited in that time for lvling purposes? I remember each and every single one of em.

- Lvl 1-12: Ghelsba Outpost
- Lvl 12-14: La Theine Plateu
- Lvl 14-21: Valkurm Dunes
- Lvl 21-25: Qufim Island
- Lvl 25-28: Yuhtunga Jungle
- Lvl 28-33: Yhoator Jungle
- Lvl 33-37: Garlaige Citadel, Crawlers Nest
- Lvl 37-42: Crawlers Nest, Gustav Tunnel, Eastern Altepa Desert
- Lvl 42-46: Crawlers Nest, Kuftal Tunnel, Boyahda Tree, Western Altepa Desert
- Lvl 46-50: Crawlers Nest, Boyahda Tree, Kuftal Tunnel, Lufaise Meadows
- Lvl 50-52: Crawlers Nest, Cape Terrigan, Boyahda Tree, Quicksand Caves
- Lvl 52-56: Boyahda Tree, Cape Terrigan, Quicksand Caves, Misareux Coast


...and so forth and so on...there are still dozens of other places you could lvl and I have lvld, like Ro'Maeve, Sky, Sea, not to mention the Aht URghan Areas that came later on.

You wanna know how this changed after Lvl sync?

- Lvl 1-20: Start Areas+Valkurm Dunes
- Lvl 20-75: Qufim Island

Sounds awesome, right?

Yeah, now that I think about it, THAT is what I want in FFXIV...have dozens of areas with absolute no meaning to them(even less then they already do). Would make the world feel more alive too. /sarcasm

PS: I remember all the hate threads about people complaining they want to be able to solo efficiently for lvls...well now you got that and for quite some time. Lvling solo through leves is just way too fast(compared to what to do on the way to 50) but PT lvling is faster, so now people complain they want to be able to form PTs with anyone on any lvl, through lvl sync...get your priorities straight...before demanding change over change over change...

[Renshi]

Well... if people wants to level the lame way it's their choice. I want to help low-level people doing content they can't do because there are so few low-level people, and that being my choice I gladly support the Level Sync.
As for now, you could just take a L1, go to Treespeak on its East and Power-level that L1 until L40, then going to a Stronghold and make its way to L50.

By the way, can you guys explain me how can a party that is the same level getting powerleveled in Level Sync? Sorry if I don't grasp this concept, but I'd like to understand, since I never power-leveled in XI. Thanks!

[Levian]

Renshi: I dunno how PLs work in FFXIV, but in XI they would sit around outside the pt and heal as needed. So you could synch up and have your pocket healer doing his thing outside the group.

Dragon: Remora was most certainly backwards. There were times I wanted nothing more than to get away from that server, but I'd been playing with the same group of people since ps2 release. Call me sentimental, but I had no interest in changing that. ToAU didn't directly cater to casuals, no. But you can easily see SE was testing the water there. Why else would ToAU Areas average 7-10k xp/hr and the ROZ/COP areas stand around 4-5k xp/hr. Let's not forget the low HP mobs that didn't beg for a chain to kill them because 2 WS more or less did the job.

I know the grind was grueling in that game. Some XP tweaks were likely in order as well. But between the easily killed mobs and the 2 handed weapon buffs, anyone could've seen what happened coming. True No one person killed SC/MB pts, but the community at large did as it's necessity faded into the backdrop.

Sure the game was shrinking, but like I said before it seems to me that as many people left because of the tweaks as those that stayed or returned because of them. I wasn't the only one that got bored with WS spam pts. They were admittedly neat initially, but once the shiny new wore away I wanted my BLM back. Or at least my SC partner.

Maybe ToAU didn't have any 1-55 content, but you could easily see a ripple effect in the lower levels. Xbox 360 players did cause a bit of havoc, but teaching them didn't seem too far removed from having to teach any other new group that rolled in through the years. Much like when the game opened it's doors to the UK, there were some bullheaded SOBs in Valkurm, but usually by qufim they'd taken their knocks and more or less figured things out. Same can probably be said for ps2 release, CoP release, etc.

At any rate, even then you could see people wanting to WS spam like the "big boys" at 55+ in ToAU zones, and for some odd reason they were completely adamant that it would work the same. No amount of pointing out the differences between a properly constructed lvl 55 bird party and a kuftal tunnel crab pt would sway them. Even showing them failed to work in many cases.

As for the sneak/invis bit I'm not entirely sure how the populace at large lost their aggro dodging skills. I did it so much even up through WotG it was rediculous. Maybe I'm just tricking myself into thinking that there was a greater number of skilled players pre ToAU?

[vax]

Renshi: I dunno how PLs work in FFXIV, but in XI they would sit around outside the pt and heal as needed. So you could synch up and have your pocket healer doing his thing outside the group.

PL on XI was fine, here it's not. the pl kills and the other sit afk.

_
At the game how it's at the moment level sync is needed, but idk after merge/ps3 realese will be. Level sync is only need it when there're short amount of people (or there is, sorry my enligsh sucks more than normal when i just wake up)

[Exekutor]

Adding a new feature will not force you to use it. Level 45+ Parties will always grant greater XP, so why would you want to join the lvl25 party? BUT if you want to level with a friend, who is not just as high as you, why not have such a feature? I don't get wheres the problem about that.