i'm sick and tired of the excuse for not having unique or varied jobs

[anhaato]

I’d rather take discrepancies between jobs’ numbers on release, given that every job has a unique and fun playstyle, and subsequent number adjustments to make things more balanced in the immediate patches. And I mean immediate as in x.01, not x.1 like they love to put it off until. It might also help if they contacted more people to test the jobs’ early media tour builds and give feedback on them, if they were to grace the popular raid streamers in the community with any sort of recognition for example.

[pikalovr]

You respond as if you have never spent a minute browsing information on Icy-Veins or The Balance websites.

And yes, there are players in dungeon instances who have expressed extreme displeasure of players in non-endgame instances for not conforming to the current Meta. On these very Forums.

Then again, you may be excused as a relative newcomer based on Forum join date. You missed most of the not-very-fun threads during Heavensward, for example.

if they had to deal with half the stuff we do today i wouldn't blame them. we can't even trust the general player base to just bait a god damn cleave in P3s literally stand in one consistent spot for a mechanic we can't even trust them to do that. there's a reason why JP players can literally hop in DF and clear an entire tier regardless of what day or how long it's been pop a macro for strats up everyone undestands and you pull. we still have people who can't even do something as simple adjusting from left to right nado. so yes if they had to deal with stuff liek this, good they had every god damn right to want people to play better. and there was more at play than just people wanting meta you also had poorly tuned systems like striking piercing slashing which is also getting ignored in your point

[pikalovr]

I’d rather take discrepancies between jobs’ numbers on release, given that every job has a unique and fun playstyle, and subsequent number adjustments to make things more balanced in the immediate patches. And I mean immediate as in x.01, not x.1 like they love to put it off until. It might also help if they contacted more people to test the jobs’ early media tour builds and give feedback on them, if they were to grace the popular raid streamers in the community with any sort of recognition for example.

nah MMO devs don't use an actual logical balancing system even GW2 is in alot of hot water rn for having a leak basically confirming their head of balancing was biased when doing changes

[DPZ2]

cleave in P3s

See, I knew you wouldn't get it.

You're talking Savage.

I was talking specifically about 'dungeon instances' and the required Meta. End-game raiders always appear to forget that what they desire in play runs downhill into what they require from players who will never touch Savage in their lifetimes. One can read it in their attitudes, despite their claims (when called out) of "I was never talking about regular dungeons", when players who are religious in their devotion to the current meta most certainly are talking about them.

[pikalovr]

See, I knew you wouldn't get it.

You're talking Savage.

I was talking specifically about 'dungeon instances' and the required Meta. End-game raiders always appear to forget that what they desire in play runs downhill into what they require from players who will never touch Savage in their lifetimes. One can read it in their attitudes, despite their claims (when called out) of "I was never talking about regular dungeons", when players who are religious in their devotion to the current meta most certainly are talking about them.

right back at you bud there's a reason i brought up a basic simplistic mechanic in the HARDEST content in the game not being able to be done or trusted to be done by players if we're having issues like this in the HARDEST difficulty how do you think players feel in dungeons or midcore content? why do you think people today are so frustrated with cure 1 healers or ice mages or single pull tanks etc... especially at high level?

if you actually understand the issue i was bringing up you'd understand why i'd pat them on the back for holding their ground and wanting people to get better even if it meant playing "meta". which once again you completely ignored the other forces at play here like the damage typing system and even before then the crossclass system both of which was implemented extremely poorly. it's thanks to those players not getting better that we end up where we are now healers basically not being needed outside of savages and even needing two there is debatable. dungeons becoming stale and boring cause why bother running a dudgeon with actual thought and good combat encounters when nobody wants to do anything? it's why jobs get more and more lobotomized as expansions go on etc...

so yes my point still stands and is valid if they had to go through half the stuff we do today i wouldn't blame them and i'd pat them on the back for holding the line in trying to stop this game from what we unfortunately see today.

[SendohJin]

You respond as if you have never spent a minute browsing information on Icy-Veins or The Balance websites.

And yes, there are players in dungeon instances who have expressed extreme displeasure of players in non-endgame instances for not conforming to the current Meta. On these very Forums.

Then again, you may be excused as a relative newcomer based on Forum join date. You missed most of the not-very-fun threads during Heavensward, for example.

Explain how it affects Leveling dungeons, Expert dungeons, 24 man raids, Normal raids, Treasure Map parties, and Hunts.

You need to get off the forums and just play the game.

[Kolsykol]

nah MMO devs don't use an actual logical balancing system even GW2 is in alot of hot water rn for having a leak basically confirming their head of balancing was biased when doing changes

GW2 has always been poorly balanced, it has been one of the most off-putting things to me.
FFXIV all things considered has a history of being very well-balanced numerically so you can at least play what you want and not feel bad about it.

That said I do think there is a problem sometimes in FFXIV of higher skill not being rewarded.
I know the devs have said that they don't think a Job being more difficult to play should translate to higher dmg output but I just fundamentally disagree with that.

See, I knew you wouldn't get it.

You're talking Savage.

I was talking specifically about 'dungeon instances' and the required Meta. End-game raiders always appear to forget that what they desire in play runs downhill into what they require from players who will never touch Savage in their lifetimes. One can read it in their attitudes, despite their claims (when called out) of "I was never talking about regular dungeons", when players who are religious in their devotion to the current meta most certainly are talking about them.

Meta in dungeons lol?
Tbh I'd rather not Jobs be balanced around dungeons or other such content, it's already so easy you can play however you want still succeed.

The furthest I ever see people take it in dungeons is '' wall to wall pulls and use AoE '' that's about it.

I mean... Mechanist is pretty unique and fun.

Just saying.

I think a lot of people will look at MNK and think that it's '' just like the other melee'' but it's not at all if you actually know how to play it properly with Optimal Drift.
Advanced BLM gets pretty crazy too, there's definitely a lot of fun and unique optimization floating about, I'd say DRG is fairly unique too with their Life of the Dragon delay and being so ogcd heavy.

I definitely don't think the DPS Jobs are as homogenized as people say, on some level especially a surface level I'd agree tho in the sense that they revolve around the dreaded burst window.
But I definitely think that they all feel unique and very different to play.

Now uh... Healers are a different matter entirely lol.
And I think Tanks could have more unique defensive kits.