Samurai: Iajutsu and Tsubame-gaeshi have identical potencies… Wrong description?

[Rongway]

They also both guarantee direct hits for the corresponding actions that involve collecting 3 Sen… Am I missing something here though that happens behind-the-scenes, because the action description for Tsubame-gaeshi still says “Repeats the previously executed iaijustu with increased potency” despite not actually raising the potency. Is there some hidden buff that happens behind-the-scenes, or has the action description been wrong for a long time?

The Localization team is aware of this and have it on their TODO list. See: Thread: Tsubame-gaeshi tooltip is incorrect

We'll try to get this fixed in 6.18. Thank you for reporting it!

if you go into Dungeons you'll probably see that being the same thing cause why update that? As I am typing this let me with Maximum effort queue up for lets see " Shisui of the Violet Tides Lv63 ". Let's go find the 1st Samurai NPC I can find cause it is Eastern amirite I see a ton of Dragoons and Paladins and then I meet the big bad NPC a Samurai lets see what it does.

Gee.. totally not lazy btw. I woulda loved to have what that NPC gets to keep. I guess an NPC has a higher value then me. From Descriptions to what Class Quest NPC's do and Dungeon NPC's, it's like the changes weren't even aimed to fix anything it's just to flip us the bird. And if it's not? it definitely feels like I am being flipped off.

Enemy actions are not required to be identical to player actions. See: the many different versions of Flare, Holy, and elemental spells throughout the game.

[CelestiCer]

Enemy actions are not required to be identical to player actions.

True. This means that plenty of other hittable none boss Job-NPC's throughout your gameplay can cast plenty of skills similar to our jobs for immersion... but sure they don't need to no. We can also just call it " Lazy changes " in many ways.

But, I am deeply comforted that their " TODO " list has fixing this description. Pretty much solidifying their intent to keep Kaiten removed, which fixed practically nothing.

Give them a good pat on the back for us will ya.

[Kolsykol]

True. This means that plenty of other hittable none boss Job-NPC's throughout your gameplay can cast plenty of skills similar to our jobs for immersion... but sure they don't need to no. We can also just call it " Lazy changes " in many ways.

But, I am deeply comforted that their " TODO " list has fixing this description. Pretty much solidifying their intent to keep Kaiten removed, which fixed practically nothing.

Give them a good pat on the back for us will ya.

I fail to see what it has to do with laziness..

People love to throw that word around, but it's like the most absurd and offensive thing to say about pretty much any game dev.
They work incredibly hard, even moreso in Japan with their crazy work culture that is significantly more intense.

You disagreeing with changes the devs have made ( which I disagree with too ) or not getting what you want doesn't mean that they're being lazy.
It's especially absurd with FFXIV knowing the history of the game and compared to the issues in other MMO's.
I mean even just the devs actually doing the content and testing it properly themselves is a luxury that is apparently too much for other MMO's, to the point they just release unbeatable fights that have to be nerfed with sometimes over 100% because it's so overtuned.

We have it really good in FFXIV, the devs are not lazy and I really wish people would stop repeating that based on disagreements or not getting the specific thing they want.

[Hezhi]

We have it really good in FFXIV, the devs are not lazy and I really wish people would stop repeating that based on disagreements or not getting the specific thing they want.

The devs aren't lazy, they clearly spent a lot of time and resources messing up SAM!
Brilliant engineering is fixing a complex problem with a simple solution. They did the exact opposite there, and messed up a lot of things in the process. Their time and good intentions were completely wasted on trying to flatten SAM's damage profile (I assume) withj like 20 potency changes and pruning where it could have been addressed by a simple fix such as changing Kaiten into an ability that makes your next ability into a guaranteed crit for example.

[Kolsykol]

Snip

Yoshi-P explained their reasoning behind it and acknowledged the negative reactions towards it and even apologized for it and took responsibility for it.
And told us to keep giving feedback, I dunno what else people want and it's probably not getting changed until the next major patch.
You disagreeing with the changes doesn't mean that they're lazy or incompetent, his reasoning does make sense even if it was tone deaf and a bit out of touch with the SAM playerbase at large.
However the SAM playerbase is not a monolith and sometimes they can make calculated decisions that may seem right and from certain perspectives are correct but miss the mark entirely.
That is my point.

The issue on this forum and online forums in general I find is that it's impossible to have a mature and adult conversation about any of this because it just turns into people screeching about how devs are lazy or stupid etc.
It's not a serious conversation and it's completely one-sided and unwilling to see the other perspective and why these changes happened to begin with.
If all people do is screech about this then there can be no learning from past mistakes because what the actual mistakes were aren't even being discussed or it gets drowned out by the screeching.
If all that happens is that people keep screaming about how the devs are stupid and lazy then no long-term changes will ever happen to their thought process because people are not actual having a good faith conversation and listening or even trying to understand what they're saying and why they're making these decisions.
And how then are you going to be able to have a conversation with them at all?

SAM is not in a bad place currently, and they didn't '' mess them up '' in the way you're implying.
They made an unpopular change that did change how they play but solved a problem they were seeing, and it's okay to think that it was a bad change that should be reverted I agree with that too.
However there are also people who do approve of the change this isn't a totally black and white issue with just no upsides to the changes at all.

I think that people need to drop this mentality that everything the devs do that we disapprove of are done out of spite or incompetency or whatever.
The truth is that they're juggling a lot of problems and a lot of different views of how things should be at the same time, and sometimes they're going to either disagree and decide to move ahead with something that is unpopular or they'll miss the mark in some other way.
If we could have a more adult conversation about this then maybe we could solve this long-term and build some bridges so that they can see our perspective on things.
But when they try to see our perspective on things a very significant portion of what they see is just the screeching about them being lazy etc.

[CelestiCer]

snip

They asked for " Feedback ". Perhaps the frustration of players seeing their BS and voicing it? and having radio silence is a form of yes " Feedback ".

Defending a Multi-Billion Dollar Company with the argue point of " stop screeching " and the customers being " one-sided " as you put it? When Square is clearly one-sided. Look at how they overtuned BLM, apologized for it and then readjusting it instantly in a short time vs any other Job change issues... but we are biased or " one-sided " as you put.

3 Months time to fix our issues or even acknowledge ANY of it btw vs BLM instantly in barely a week or 2. But we are Onesided btw.

Unless that's your take on an adult conversation, being an company apologist. I wont kink shame.

[KurenXIV]

They asked for " Feedback ". Perhaps the frustration of players seeing their BS and voicing it? and having radio silence is a form of yes " Feedback ".

Defending a Multi-Billion Dollar Company with the argue point of " stop screeching " and the customers being " one-sided " as you put it? When Square is clearly one-sided. Look at how they overtuned BLM, apologized for it and then readjusting it instantly in a short time vs any other Job change issues... but we are biased or " one-sided " as you put.

3 Months time to fix our issues or even acknowledge ANY of it btw vs BLM instantly in barely a week or 2. But we are Onesided btw.

Unless that's your take on an adult conversation, being an company apologist. I wont kink shame.

Bingo. They took away something that was fun and impacted a lot of players in the process.

It sucks, I lost my favorite game to play because of the changes and I know many feel the same.

Say it with me folks: SAMURAI WAS NEVER AN ISSUE PRIOR TO THIS.

The devs are indeed lazy and going about making changes in the wrong way. They didn't change the kit to be more fun AND to make future designs easier on them. No, they simply stripped the job of its core rotational fun and called it a day.

But that's fine. All the apologists can keep paying to play but I won't be taking part in giving a company my money that doesn't listen to feedback. That is to say, if they don't address this/roll things back in 6.2 I'm quitting the game I've played for nearly a decade.

[Hezhi]

snip

I didn't call the devs lazy, I truly believe they put a lot of resources in these changes, but what they did was still completely, as you said, out of touch and in my opinion that is echoed by hundreds of SAMs across the forums, unwarranted. They absolutely messed up SAM from a gameplay perspective, if they didn't you wouldn't see such a big outcry. The brief, puzzling reasoning they gave was laughable and didn't really explain anything. They did this to "make the job more accessible". But SAM was already a popular and beloved job, what's the issue here?! For who were these changes for if nearly every single SAM main I talked about it hated it? People who don't care about this job, or this game, and don't want to invest any time into it trying to get better at it, I guess.

The way they've been designing XIV as a whole recently extremely confusing and, as far as I can understand, quite stupid. They keep dumbing down the sh*t out of everything and dragging everything around the lowest common denominator so everyone and their grandma can pick u p the game... But why? You can already clear MSQ spamming 2 buttons because its too easy. People who aren't already interested in savage aren't going to jump on endgame content because a job is slightly easier to play. Why???? I would trust them more if my expectations for job design weren't lower than dirt after all the idiotic changes they made, proving that whatever reasoning they entertain only made the game feel worse and worse to play over the years across every job I tried.

[Roxus]

Abbreviated.

What people want is acknowledgement after all the feedback that has been given so far after the changes people knew beforehand would be a poor gameplay experience were "given a try". Or denial. Any reaction really, that isn't a hard ask. Do people want the actual changes sooner? Of course. Not sure what the hell you're talking about regarding a monolith, though.

We had civil conversations aplenty at the start of 6.1. There is only so much you can say before you parrot the same thing waiting for some sort of response without fearing that you were ignored or viewed as silently accepting the changes after some time. You're also bound to see many people becoming upset because they feel like they are being ignored while a plethora of other issues are addressed thoroughly. We've had plenty of people try to explain why we think this happened. That still isn't official confirmation. That's speculation. That's why we ask for a response. The only people that have been screeching are mostly people speaking against those who don't want the game to turn into a browser game. I won't say you are arguing in bad faith, but you are disingenuous at best, ignorant at worst if this is your take on how the feedback has gone.

They are not in a bad place in terms of purely numbers. The enjoyment has been stripped away, the thing we play games for. Yes, they did mess them up.
It did not solve a problem because they were simply replaced by the next best thing. The problem is still there, just not on Samurai.
There are very few people who approve of the change and those that supposedly are for the changes can't even reason why they like it without being refuted on how the changes have only subtracted from the player experience.

I think you need to drop this mentality that this is how everyone responded to the issue, because it isn't and most people wanted a simple answer as to why this was needed on this specific patch and how it was going to solve what problem.
That is fine if it weren't for the fact their communication regarding job balance was one sided, not just for Samurai but for other jobs too.
You can go see what the Healer and Machinist player situation looks like and tell me again that they communicate well.

[Quor]

I fail to see what it has to do with laziness..

I made a post about this actually.

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...ZY.-Here-s-why

The tl;dr is that the devs are making changes to the jobs - of which SAM is but the first in a series according to what Yoshi P. has said - with the intent of making future iteration and innovation easier. Addressing SAM specifically, Kaiten was removed because it was "restricting" future skill/ability creation for as-yet-unreleased expansions. So, in order to make the lives of the job devs easier, the decision was made to just remove Kaiten. This isn't to say that job design and balance is an easy task, as it's not. But the underlying thought process behind it is one of laziness. It's a laziness that led to the current state of tanks and healers and it's now spreading to other jobs. The devs are no longer designing something with "fun to play" as the primary focus, but rather they are concerned about "upcoming issues that may or may not arise in the future."

This is a lazy way of doing things, as it's the easiest possible thing they could have done. Instead of altering Kaiten in some way that preserves it's role while simultaneously making it less restrictive, they chose to remove it outright. They could have done any number of things to reign in the supposed power that Kaiten has. The best option would be to abandon their ridiculous focus on two minute burst cycles. Of course SAM damage is going to be nuts in 6.0. It was bad enough that we got second charges on Meikyo and Kaeshi, but with every raid buff also leaning into a two minute burst cycle plus the insane damage of Ogi/Kaeshi Namikiri, it's only natural that SAM - as a heavily raid-buff-reliant job - would see bigger damage spikes. It's like they didn't think the 6.0 changes through and realize that SAM's would be dumping all their charges under buffs. If SAM was still locked to it's old 60s cycle from 5.X then the damage variance "problem" wouldn't exist and any alleged problems that Kaiten brought to the table would be drastically mitigated.