Gelmorra And The Duskwight

[thegreatonemal]

Is there even much to go into? They share the same history with Wildwood, they just chose to shun the elementals and stay within the underground city.

[Vyrerus]

Is there even much to go into? They share the same history with Wildwood, they just chose to shun the elementals and stay within the underground city.

Well, in the modern day they live among the Wildwood and Hyurs, but they're treated with racism to the point that many are automatically assumed to be thieves, bandits, etc.

Even the MSQ has a leg around the Ilberd and Crystal Braves getting shady arc where Ilberd and the corrupt Braves insist that a group of Duskwight Bandits have made away with most of a weapons shipment, iirc.

In Gridania it is said that Duskwights are treated similarly to Ala Mhigan refugees. This means that there are Gridanians all the way up to hearers picking bones with Duskwights, and trying to claim that the Elementals don't want them in the Shroud.

Also, they're generally hotter than Wildwood, and in general slept on by the playerbase (of course, Wildwood are slept on too, as are Elezen F in general, so...).

[Cleretic]

On top of all of everything Vyrerus said (okay, maybe not the 'Duskwight are hotter' part), there's some interesting questions to ask about the actual split. Why did so many people choose to stay underground that it essentially created a whole new subrace? That's a lot of people looking at what seems to be a pretty good offer, and declining it very strongly, for at least enough generations to cause actual physical differences. That's clearly not a decision made lightly, they planted their goddamn feet for a reason, and to this day we still don't know why. I think a lot of us fill in that blank with something world-changing, and sure, maybe they knew truths about the Elementals or the Shroud that we didn't, but even if it's not the tale of a people just steadfastly refusing to leave their homelands for generations is a strong one with a lot of potential value to it.

Even beyond that and just into basic details about the civilization, we have curiously little. Like, collating everything I know about the places we've been, all I know about their society is 'they had at least one graveyard'. We don't even know what they used the Thousand Maws of Toto-Rak or Mun-Tuy Cellars for. We don't know their form of government, combat styles, religions, anything like that. There are so many potential plot hooks if they were inclined to write anything about it, and they just... haven't.

[thegreatonemal]

Well, in the modern day they live among the Wildwood and Hyurs, but they're treated with racism to the point that many are automatically assumed to be thieves, bandits, etc.

Even the MSQ has a leg around the Ilberd and Crystal Braves getting shady arc where Ilberd and the corrupt Braves insist that a group of Duskwight Bandits have made away with most of a weapons shipment, iirc.

In Gridania it is said that Duskwights are treated similarly to Ala Mhigan refugees. This means that there are Gridanians all the way up to hearers picking bones with Duskwights, and trying to claim that the Elementals don't want them in the Shroud.

Also, they're generally hotter than Wildwood, and in general slept on by the playerbase (of course, Wildwood are slept on too, as are Elezen F in general, so...).

I know about the racism an all but what other lore would there be? It makes sense why they wished to remain in their underground city. They were driven there by the fickle elementals, granted it was after a race war between Hyurs and Elezens as a whole and as a result are not too keen on listening to a bunch of fickle beings that can and will take our their angry on all humans who live in the forest for a slight.

[Iscah]

I know about the racism an all but what other lore would there be?

Basically everything about their culture – up to and including whether it currently exists. We don't know who their ancestors are (possibly the Amdapori by deduction, but there's no statement), how they dress, what their customs and attitudes are; which of the Twelve (if any) they might prefer to worship; what their city looks like in its prime.

I have a Duskwight character and while there is enough insight into what other races might think of his when he ventures into the wider world, there is nothing for me to build into a concept of his own cultural identity.

[MikkoAkure]

Basically everything about their culture – up to and including whether it currently exists. We don't know who their ancestors are (possibly the Amdapori by deduction, but there's no statement), how they dress, what their customs and attitudes are; which of the Twelve (if any) they might prefer to worship; what their city looks like in its prime.

I have a Duskwight character and while there is enough insight into what other races might think of his when he ventures into the wider world, there is nothing for me to build into a concept of his own cultural identity.

The Duskwight/Wildwood lore is the same as it was in 1.0, but on a tighter timescale because I don't believe calamities existed in the pre-Yoshida days.

Elezen were the only Spoken race left in Eorzea in great enough numbers for a civilization (in 1.0, they were the sole native Spoken race to Eorzea). Hyur started coming back and colonizing the land in great migration waves. The first of which pushed some Elezen north where they settled Ishgard and the second pushed others to the east where they began settling the Shroud. The Elezen were immediately attacked by the Elementals and fled into the caves. When the Hyur came, they too were attacked by the Elementals and started attacking the Elezen for the good caves. After decades of fighting, they realized the Elementals were the true enemy and decided to work together to build Gelmorra.

They then spent the next 200 years partying underground until the Elementals' favorite, the Ixal, were kicked out of the forest. The Gelmorrans saw this as their chance to live above and spent years asking the Elementals for their shot at a city on the surface before they were finally allowed to and made Gridania. Some of the Elezen thought serving the Elementals was BS and continued to live in caves to this day. Their culture according to Eorzea Encyclopedia:

The customs of the subterranean city of Gelmorra are still practiced by the Duskwight to this day, from architectural advances developed to stake out comfortable residency in dank, humid caves to mystical wards that serve to stave off the fury of the Elementals. The Duskwight-fashioned pomanders-urns engraved with mystic glyphs of great power and filled with fragrant herbs-are an art without parallel in the realm. Duskwight cuisine is famous for its use of Mun-Tuy beans (soy beans?), a staple food in the subterranean depths, where they grow in abundance with no need for sunlight. That these dishes have come to be considered a Gridanian delicacy is an ironic twist, given the history between the two clans

The rest goes on to describe how they still live in Gelmorra or new caves, hate surface society and city-states, and some resort to brigandry to survive. Another thing to note for RPers is that they basically have bat ears, with exceptional hearing and can "ascertain the source of a sound with unerring accuracy, unaffected by the echoes or reverberations".


I think the idea of calamities ruined large swaths of pre-existing lore. The Dunesfolk made more sense when they were originally desert-dwelling nomads from islands south of Eorzea who migrated to Thanalan, which was similar to their home. Instead now, they're ex-Mhachi mages (but only the Lalafell, for some reason) who decided to move there of all places and somehow evolved their desert-adapted eyes in an extremely short amount of time. Ditto with the Duskwight. We're supposed to believe that in 500 years, the Duskwight went from being normal Elezen to having completely different skintones and bat ears.

You can tell the lore was changed because 1.0 Dunesfolk specifically mentioned migrating to Eorzea. The old lore for them had them as nomads who lived on great beasts of burden and had emblems on their head for their zodiac sign. This was changed in ARR and now the emblems are to remember Mhachi sorcerers and while they kept the idea of them living as nomads on the backs of giant animals, those animals are nowhere to be seen and the Lalafell were in Thanalan for just 37 years before creating Belah'dia so I don't think their writers are talking to each other if we're to expect their "heritage" as nomads and evolution into Dunesfolk was that short.

[Angellos]

This is the sort of lore I would love to have explored and made widely available in the game present day.

You know what would be amazing? Like really, REALLY amazing?

To have a Historian that players could talk to, for each race: And get a detailed recounting of their origins, society, life, cuisine, social structure, etc. It'd even be amazing to have a racial story arc as side-quests. Let all of us explore the races at our leisure. Bonus points for doing quests relating to each race. By the twelve, that would truly be great.

[Cleretic]

This is the sort of lore I would love to have explored and made widely available in the game present day.

You know what would be amazing? Like really, REALLY amazing?

To have a Historian that players could talk to, for each race: And get a detailed recounting of their origins, society, life, cuisine, social structure, etc. It'd even be amazing to have a racial story arc as side-quests. Let all of us explore the races at our leisure. Bonus points for doing quests relating to each race. By the twelve, that would truly be great.

Fun fact: back in 1.0, that was basically Erik's role, albeit in a different space. He had jumbo-sized infodumps, you can find some on Youtube in videos about 1.0. Given the fact that when he came back in the Monk questlines in the live game, the joke about him was that he's go on long pointless lectures that nobody listened to... I kinda get the feeling that approach might not have been popular!

Something I think could fill this role is the Unending Codex. Historically, both in this game and in others, people tend to like a sideline infodump they can read whenever they want, as long as said infodump isn't essential to understanding the story (thank you, FFXIII).

[bitterhorn]

I'll add to this that it'd be lovely if certain dialogue trees - particularly in Gridania! - were at least slightly modified for Duskies to reflect their 'othered' status in the modern Shroud. It felt really weird to have NPCs repeatedly elfsplaining who Duskwights were from a Gridanian POV to my Obviously Duskwight Character. I seem to recall the archer questline being particularly jarring ^__^;

[Iscah]

Their culture according to Eorzea Encyclopedia:

Sure, but – I nearly raised this in my last post – what sort of meaningful culture do you derive out of "they craft pomanders and like Mun-Tuy sauce"?

Why are the archaeologists in South Shroud talking about Gelmorra like it's a thing of the past? Where do they live now? Is there a city still? What does any of it actually look like?