SE bans twitch streamers but not actual cheaters?

[Gothicshark]

So most everyone heard of the issues surrounding Twitch streamers getting banned for having mods or additions, but I'd like to make clear this thread isn't to argue over that.

By even mentioning it, will lead to a furtherance of discussion.

What I want to discuss is why they did, but when a clearly botting/cheating player is reported, nothing has been done?

They got banned because they provided evidence to SE that they were in violation of TOS while being seen publicly by a large portion of the community, and the Dev team. SE had no choice but to sensor them publicly if they want the TOS to remain valid and understood by all.
While a Bot/cheater who doesn't stream is much harder to prove.

I reported in-game and on the support website directly to the Task Force but there is one particular cheating player that is still around.

What evidence and proof do you have. For them to take action they require proof of wrong doing.

They stand in the same spot, never moving even a pixel, for MONTHS. They only log off when, assuming here, they shut their computer off to sleep. This character is online from morning to night, same spot, checking the summoning bell and doing nothing else but undercutting all day. For months straight. They have done it so long that I've actually been able to pinpoint the names of their retainers because they disappear from the MB when they check the bell, every time.

So.. I personally do the same, I have two paid accounts, I leave my secondary account in one spot and use the account to transfer items and funds between my characters. I can also play the market quiet effectively while at work using my laptop and the second account. No bot needed. Just two accounts, and a love for the market game.

They are either using some program to automate the process of checking retainers and undercutting or they are a bot account. I reported them first a few weeks ago, and again just last week. Still, nothing has been done at all.

Honestly, just need a screen dedicated to a Market Watch Website (there are a couple for FFXIV) no need for a bot, I can watch trends and market fluctuations quiet easily by just using their data. Still not cheating or botting.

I should also note they have several of EACH late game item above 7-10m Gil. Which seems unrealistic since the character doesn't have much leveled and has clearly been level skipped.

Sounds like they have two accounts, and they play on one, and sell one the other. No Big Deal. No evidence of botting, no evidence of cheating.

Evidence for wrong doing has to be something provable. The person on stream gave proof of wrong doing for the whole world to see. having a Dedicated Market character is not evidence of wrong doing, it's just another way to play the game.

[Themarvin]

So most everyone heard of the issues surrounding Twitch streamers getting banned for having mods or additions, but I'd like to make clear this thread isn't to argue over that.

What I want to discuss is why they did, but when a clearly botting/cheating player is reported, nothing has been done?

I reported in-game and on the support website directly to the Task Force but there is one particular cheating player that is still around.

They stand in the same spot, never moving even a pixel, for MONTHS. They only log off when, assuming here, they shut their computer off to sleep. This character is online from morning to night, same spot, checking the summoning bell and doing nothing else but undercutting all day. For months straight. They have done it so long that I've actually been able to pinpoint the names of their retainers because they disappear from the MB when they check the bell, every time.

They are either using some program to automate the process of checking retainers and undercutting or they are a bot account. I reported them first a few weeks ago, and again just last week. Still, nothing has been done at all.

I should also note they have several of EACH late game item above 7-10m Gil. Which seems unrealistic since the character doesn't have much leveled and has clearly been level skipped.

If the streamer violated the ToS... then he deserves is alongside with any other cheater or violater of how the game works, and that is all what you can say about that.

[RitsukoSonoda]

You realize streaming while violating the ToS is basically like doing 150mph through a school zone then sending the dash cam video as evidence to the police yourself. You literally just saved them an entire investigation process.

[Amenara]

I think my biggest problem with the streamer bans is that SE had no issues with the wow streamers blowing up FF14 with a whole bunch of addons but now the decide that it is the right time to enforce the ToS after the wow hype is over. It once again shows that money is king and they didn't want to look bad to a new audience which was giving them a spike in subs and EW sales. It is why I have little regard for SE saying that the ToS matters now that the JP players were mad they didn't win the world first DSR kill and complained about addons.

[RitsukoSonoda]

I think my biggest problem with the streamer bans is that SE had no issues with the wow streamers blowing up FF14 with a whole bunch of addons but now the decide that it is the right time to enforce the ToS after the wow hype is over. It once again shows that money is king and they didn't want to look bad to a new audience which was giving them a spike in subs and EW sales. It is why I have little regard for SE saying that the ToS matters now that the JP players were mad they didn't win the world first DSR kill and complained about addons.

The issue is those WoW streamers you mentioned contributed to the 3rd party tool usage getting completely out of hand so now they're enforcing it to make a point. People shouldn't have been using them to begin with regardless of any excuse you can come up with and claiming it's supposedly because they're salty about who got the world first DSR completion is just an attempt to play the victim card to avoid the consequences of actions people committed knowing they were breaking the ToS and had assumed they had some kind of immunity.

[hagare]

Then the devs should not be shocked when players are taking matters into their hands and doing the job for the devs and GMs. lol
GOBLIN BOUNTY HUNTERS WHEN?!

then they shouldn't be surprised when they get banned for harassment

[Inanegrain]

If bots/cheaters streamed more, it'd be easier to catch, but there are still small "how is this allowed to be streamed" and gets away for some time before being expunged.
Sure, some bot behaviours seem obvious, but gets away with it anyways.

You realize streaming while violating the ToS is basically like doing 150mph through a school zone then sending the dash cam video as evidence to the police yourself. You literally just saved them an entire investigation process.

Feels more like doing 150mph+ on a track while recording yourself for it and then penalized for using illegal mods during an unofficial race.

[dspguy]

The difference is that the undercutting bots aren't announcing to the world that they are in flagrant violation of the TOS unlike Twitch streamers.

The secondary problem with the undercutting bots is that at a glance, nothing they are doing is against the TOS. Standing around isn't against the TOS. Being located near a summoning bell isn't against the TOS. Listing items on the MB isn't against the TOS. Undercutting by 1 gil isn't against the TOS. However, it is the bigger picture of the situation (standing at a summoning bell for hours (days?) on end, relisting every few minutes for the lowest price) that makes it humanly impossible.

Good luck getting a GM to sit there and verify this long enough.

They'd probably fix the problem if they converted the MB into an Auction House instead (FFXI style). And charge an upfront listing fee, so every relist kills the profit.

[Ivtrix]

I think if the casual playerbase was made aware of how much gil was botted daily they would forget instantly about streamers

I think eureka bots alone across all the worlds and DCs is probably in the ballpark of 100K USD a month

[Moonlite]

That’s the thing though, they are >>>possibly<<< cheating. It is extremely unlikely that someone is just sitting their all day every day checking the market board and undercutting items… but it is possible…again however unlikely.

The devs have an innocent until proven guilty stance. There is no way for the devs to determine if that person is just a real weirdo who loves selling stuff, or a bot.

There is no good answer here. Either a) the devs have some kind of cheat detection software which they are against (and indeed can be a huge problem to do in Japan), or b) they start allowing bans for suspicious activity which means truly innocent people will get banned.

The Eureka bots are in a similar situation- unless they are teleporting around or doing something a normal player couldn’t do, there is no way for the GMs to see cheating.

You know how they solved the maybe they are real and not cheating for the fishing bots in 11. The GM would come out to the ice zone (someone ill know the name), say a few things and then go to the fishers and move them. If they tried to fish again poof gone. They did add mobs so GMs didn't have to come by that you could avoid but bots really couldn't at the time at least. Someone else I know got banned in 11 for SMN pet farming, so basically the pet would farm and you could afk. That is against the rules it is in the rules for 14 as well, GM comes out so every often and sends you a few tells. If you can not answer a GM and prove you are a person 3 day, 14 day(I think) , and then ban.