If we don't get to explore and rebuild more of Garlmald, it will be a waste.

[Alleluia]

I really hope they're not going to let this whole moral argument of "who deserves to live in Corvos" just blow over with the non-Garlean rebel faction getting to have the run of the place with no objections from anyone.

With it being the initial reason the Garleans even started their campaign of conquest, I don't think the remaining legions would want to allow its reclamation by the "savages" slide.

Ideally, I'm hoping we go over there but with the intent of making an arrangement where Garleans and the other races can dwell there in unity, though likely not without convincing parties on both sides of things to see reason.

Same. The Garleans have an ancestral claim to the land cus it’s where they were pushed out of initially. But they’ve also been gone a long while and came back a conquering power who likely didn’t treat the people currently living there all that well. And the Garleans have the possible added incentive of needing a new place to live. Corvos is destined to be a tinderbox. I’d enjoy a story about navigating that and trying to keep it from burning. I’ll enjoy the inevitable real world political comparisons and arguments less so. ( For the record, I think Garlemald behaved much worse than Great Britain (empire) or Israel (land dispute from hell) ever have and are not really comparable. But you almost know people will do so anyway.)

[thegreatonemal]

Same. The Garleans have an ancestral claim to the land cus it’s where they were pushed out of initially. But they’ve also been gone a long while and came back a conquering power who likely didn’t treat the people currently living there all that well. And the Garleans have the possible added incentive of needing a new place to live. Corvos is destined to be a tinderbox. I’d enjoy a story about navigating that and trying to keep it from burning. I’ll enjoy the inevitable real world political comparisons and arguments less so. ( For the record, I think Garlemald behaved much worse than Great Britain (empire) or Israel (land dispute from hell) ever have and are not really comparable. But you almost know people will do so anyway.)

The people living there now also have that claim. They can stay up north and rebuild once the fighting dies down in Corvos and they lose.

[MikkoAkure]

The people living there now also have that claim. They can stay up north and rebuild once the fighting dies down in Corvos and they lose.

Yeah, the miqo'te tribe living in Corvos has been there 5000 years, which in my eyes means they have a right to live there.

Then there's Jenomis, who says that at least 1 of the Garlean tribes didn't come from Corvos at all, they came from Goug to the southeast. And then he makes a theory that after the city exploded and the giant ocean hole was made in a battle between Construct 8 and Ramza, they left in an exodus to the current location of Garlemald and took their technology with them. That would put at least some Garleans in Garlemald hundreds of years before the Garleans claim they were kicked out of Corvos, and also contact with a new extra-planar rift, the Ridorana Cataract, which could explain some of them having Voidsent if that rift connects to the Thirteenth.

I'm sure they would have had some Ascian contact prior to Emet-Selch and I wonder how much of their believed backstory was "embellished" in order to sow the seeds of further conflict. We already know that their "Great Eikon Conquest" was a fake excuse of a casus belli in order to get them to conquer the world and it would stand to reason that "reclaim the Corvosi Homeland" could be one too.

[KageTokage]

The G tribe had to have been there before them due to having a presence even during the time of the Allagans, so it makes me wonder what happened between them and the original Garlean settlers.

Were they among those who eventually forced them into the north, or was there a peaceful coexistence broken by the arrival of other peoples?

Hopefully there's still enough of the second legion left over there to properly tell their side of the story.

[KizuyaKatogami]

The G tribe had to have been there before them due to having a presence even during the time of the Allagans, so it makes me wonder what happened between them and the original Garlean settlers.

Were they among those who eventually forced them into the north, or was there a peaceful coexistence broken by the arrival of other peoples?

Hopefully there's still enough of the second legion left over there to properly tell their side of the story.

Honestly with how they treated garlemald this expansion it seems like there’s some heavy bias against them. At this point i’m expecting for them to just always be in the wrong, they’ll be told how they need to move on from their birthright homeland and instead move to the moon i guess and anyone who disagrees with the mighty Alphinaud will be cut down by us. Perhaps the G tribe were among the ones to push them out originally, but it won’t matter because that’s in the past and we need to move on and forget it ever happened.

[Anhra]

I think it will take some time until Squeenix will adress the rebuilt of Garlemald (remember that it took for Ishgard restoration works 2 Expansions of time in order to be a thing), since they have probably their hands full currently with alot of projects and Yoshi P. haunting the JP Datacenters for Crystal Conflict Ranked Matches (currently in Gold 1 as BLM, last time i checked).

So there is little point in (Garle-)malding about the matter. Chances are good that it will happen since Squeenix usually does Restoration Works in a new instances area, and since the inner City, as well as the Palace itself, is part of the background of the Garlemald area we have access to, it doesnt seem so farfetched that it will happen sooner or later.

[KizuyaKatogami]

I think it will take some time until Squeenix will adress the rebuilt of Garlemald (remember that it took for Ishgard restoration works 2 Expansions of time in order to be a thing), since they have probably their hands full currently with alot of projects and Yoshi P. haunting the JP Datacenters for Crystal Conflict Ranked Matches (currently in Gold 1 as BLM, last time i checked).

So there is little point in (Garle-)malding about the matter. Chances are good that it will happen since Squeenix usually does Restoration Works in a new instances area, and since the inner City, as well as the Palace itself, is part of the background of the Garlemald area we have access to, it doesnt seem so farfetched that it will happen sooner or later.

I don’t think anyone is really malding about it so much as Garlemald has just gotten bad treatment after bad treatment and it would be nice for them to finally get something good coming their way, it’s well-deserved at this point.

[Alleluia]

The people living there now also have that claim. They can stay up north and rebuild once the fighting dies down in Corvos and they lose.

I know they do. I’m pretty sure the real answer is that everyone lived there and the Garleans got kicked out. Thus everyone technically has a claim on the land and they are correct. If we care about ancestral claims on land in the first place. The current residents (tribe plus whoever else lives there) displaced the Garleans. Which on the face of it seems to have been morally wrong. But it also happened 800 years ago (I think???) and I don’t believe in holding people responsible for things their ancestors did, so I don’t necessarily care about land claims like that. Wars happen, people run or migrate, you can’t do anything about it except endeavor not to repeat it in the here and now. It’s up to the people currently alive to be better and not repeat the mistakes of the past.

So I don’t think Garleans have a right to Corvosi land just b/c they got driven from it however long ago by people who are no longer alive. But I do think the Garleans need to resettle in a more hospitable place if they are to survive, and they have ancestral ties and apparently emotional attachment to Corvos, so that’s gonna be where they’d head. And I don’t think I’d be ok with telling to go pound dirt back in the glacias, essentially (re)ostracizing them and leaving them to die when they are actually in need. It’d be wrong, and also kind of stupid. It’d decimate any chance of good will from them and prime them to remain on a war footing towards the rest of the world forever more.

They’re already down, kicking them won’t do anything but ensure a lasting enmity. And you don’t end up with peace with that. When possible, we should make our enemy our friend after a war is over so that we don’t have another. Look at the US and Japan, for example. They sucker punched us to start the fight, they committed some horrible war crimes on both us and our allies during it, we caused mass casualties to end the fight. But a decade later and they were our friends again, with relations only having strengthened and improved since. B/c the side that won chose to make the side that lost their friend instead of exacting punitive vengeance that would leave only resentment. (Basically the opposite of what was done at the end of WW1 and led to WW 2 in the first place.)

Guarentee there would be voices on the corvosi side of things calling for vengeance against the Garleans. And there’ll be at least some Garleans who won’t want to “deal with the savages”, though not Jullus’/maxima’s faction and they’d be the Garleans we’d be aiding with anyway. Anyway, I’m sure there will be that conflict and I’d imagine that would be what we’d have to navigate as players.

[MikkoAkure]

Honestly with how they treated garlemald this expansion it seems like there’s some heavy bias against them.

We did just come off 12 years of story where the writers continued to double-down on them being the destructive, sexually violent invading force that completely razed cities and ruined countless lives in their wake. Once the Eorzean Alliance saw the destruction of their homeland and found out what caused it, they finally were able to earn some pity points with the player and the characters of the story and so the Alliance decided to play nice with them. This can also be seen with Gaius, who in order to make his transition from villain to anti-hero had to have his story retconned with Livia to prevent him from being creepy, pointed out that he has reason to hate the Ascians (like us) and has killed more than a few (like us), and have it brought back to the attention of the player that he adopts children (like Cid and Livia) by introducing the Werlyt kids and thus giving us, the player, a reason to empathize with him as we went through that whole mess.

I just wish we instead had a FFXII-esque story where we sneak in there like Archades and connect with the disenfranchised folk of the city who are put down by the militaristic majority and/or the surviving Populares. That would have allowed us to empathize with at least some of them without having them having their city blown up by the plot, slowly freeze to death, and then run away scared of the magic users into the claws of a lake monster.

I can see why they did what they did, but I don't agree with the means or the end result. The narrative was never going to take us to Garlemald and negotiate our way to friends after the writers spent so much time and effort showing the majority of the ones we have interactions with being terrible people and an entire expansion about why they suck and need to be stopped. I would have liked the city to survive though so we could have a snowy New York City zone with cars and skyscrapers.

[KizuyaKatogami]

We did just come off 12 years of story where the writers continued to double-down on them being the destructive, sexually violent invading force that completely razed cities and ruined countless lives in their wake. Once the Eorzean Alliance saw the destruction of their homeland and found out what caused it, they finally were able to earn some pity points with the player and the characters of the story and so the Alliance decided to play nice with them. This can also be seen with Gaius, who in order to make his transition from villain to anti-hero had to have his story retconned with Livia to prevent him from being creepy, pointed out that he has reason to hate the Ascians (like us) and has killed more than a few (like us), and have it brought back to the attention of the player that he adopts children (like Cid and Livia) by introducing the Werlyt kids and thus giving us, the player, a reason to empathize with him as we went through that whole mess.

I just wish we instead had a FFXII-esque story where we sneak in there like Archades and connect with the disenfranchised folk of the city who are put down by the militaristic majority and/or the surviving Populares. That would have allowed us to empathize with at least some of them without having them having their city blown up by the plot, slowly freeze to death, and then run away scared of the magic users into the claws of a lake monster.

I can see why they did what they did, but I don't agree with the means or the end result. The narrative was never going to take us to Garlemald and negotiate our way to friends after the writers spent so much time and effort showing the majority of the ones we have interactions with being terrible people and an entire expansion about why they suck and need to be stopped. I would have liked the city to survive though so we could have a snowy New York City zone with cars and skyscrapers.

We’ve also had numerous quests etc about how sexually violent and brutal the ala mhigans were/are, and the domans. That did not stop us whatsoever in helping them now did it? They’ve said since the very first lorebook the way they are today is due to the shitty things that were done to them, and this expansion even cemented this in the reaper questline where we get even more backstory and are shown they were no more than peaceful farmers. Also how was his story retconned? I thought the allegations were always just headcanon by weird players and never confirmed that they had any sort of relationship of the assumed nature.