More unneccesary nerfs to older content

[FoxyAreku]

As somebody who started playing the game way later than you, it was more annoying and frustrating to sit and watch a battle when I fell off (or not being able to resurrect somebody when they fell). It didn't make me want to quit but I don't think the person you were 7 years ago enjoyed it much at all.

Hate to be that guy but you know there's a solution to this besides unnecessary nerfs?

Don't get knocked off.

[kpxmanifesto]

Strange decision. As if the content wasn't already easy enough.

[Raoabolic]

Hate to be that guy but you know there's a solution to this besides unnecessary nerfs?

Don't get knocked off.

Agreed for the most part. The 4 man should allow you to rez but 8man hard/ex modes should not be touched. In a way, the way it felt already felt like it was exclusive to Titan which made him a much more dangerous threat. Get rid of that and people might as well run unsynced since what little thrill to that fight is now gone. The bigger question is will this "fix" be applied to the Unreal version when it comes back?

[Daeriion_Aeradiir]

Good. Permadeath is an ancient, archaic mechanic that has no need to exist in this game outside of niche side-content that is designed with it in mind.

It removed any semblance of skill or control of the situation - didn't matter if your healers were skilled and could easily dodge all the knockoff mechanics then rez the party for the epic comeback, the moment someone got yeeted, any and all counterplays or party recovery were gone. Not to mention it's just a completely hostile mechanic to fun in its entirety. 'Tee-hee, you made a small mistake/had a lag spike/had no idea that knockback was coming since its your first time ever in this fight (Ravana's knockback after Bloody Fuller, Bismark's wind phase & getting stunned into the add's knockback AOEs) and now you just don't get to play'. How anyone can defend its existence when it's such a Zenith of truly interesting and engaging gameplay getting to stare at your screen while the rest of the party either wipes or kills the fight for you, assuming you don't just tab out and spend those minutes doing something else is beyond me.

"It taught people" - I'm sorry to burst your bubble: no, it didn't. Anyone who cares to learn will learn, anyone who doesn't won't, regardless of perma death or just a temporary death. It's been that way since time immemorial - a not insignificant % of the playerbase will never desire to learn no matter what you do or lessons you try to 'teach' them. Perma was just needlessly punishing for zero point. It was artificial fake difficulty done bad, nothing more.

[ZephyrMenodora]

I actually prefer being able to be revived if I fall off an arena. Falling off and watching the entire fight afterwards isn't really engaging play either.

I don't feel they need to nerf most things though, but a lot of this is very early content. For people letting their subs expire over it - how often were you going to level 40 dungeons and finding that exciting even as is?

[Jojoya]

Hate to be that guy but you know there's a solution to this besides unnecessary nerfs?

Don't get knocked off.

A lot of players are playing with bad latency and poor FPS. I can remember when I started playing - I was on a toaster of a computer (barely met the minimum system requirements at the time) with a slow internet connection.

I would do my best not to get knocked off by Titan but it was always a crapshoot. Most of the time, I would still get knocked off despite doing my best to anticipate the need to move. I would feel bad for not being able to contribute the rest of the fight and it discouraged me from queuing for group content because I would never know if I would get stuck in a duty where my FPS issues would be a big detriment to the group.

Then I finally got a decent computer. What happened? I stopped getting knocked off and was able to contribute for all of the fight. I don't worry when I queue anymore.

What SE is doing not only making a better experience for the individual player, it is removing a penalty that the entire party is incurring because one member doesn't have the best equipment.

I don't necessarily agree that they needed to make the change for the EX trials (EX is totally optional content) but certainly it was warranted for Normal/Hard modes.

[angienessyo]

Permadeath was bad anyways so it's a good change. You're not really properly teaching a new player how to do the fight if they make one mistake, fall off, and everyone kills the boss without them. I get Titan EX all the time in mentor roulette and I know my way around the fight thanks to having cleared UWU. 90% of the time I get this fight the bulk of the dps get killed by getting knocked off and I get them the clear. Was spending the whole time on the floor unable to be rezzed really a good experience for a sprout? Of course not. This gives new players more opportunities to actually learn the fight.

[Colt47]

Good. Permadeath is an ancient, archaic mechanic that has no need to exist in this game outside of niche side-content that is designed with it in mind.

It removed any semblance of skill or control of the situation - didn't matter if your healers were skilled and could easily dodge all the knockoff mechanics then rez the party for the epic comeback, the moment someone got yeeted, any and all counterplays or party recovery were gone. Not to mention it's just a completely hostile mechanic to fun in its entirety. 'Tee-hee, you made a small mistake/had a lag spike/had no idea that knockback was coming since its your first time ever in this fight (Ravana's knockback after Bloody Fuller, Bismark's wind phase & getting stunned into the add's knockback AOEs) and now you just don't get to play'. How anyone can defend its existence when it's such a Zenith of truly interesting and engaging gameplay getting to stare at your screen while the rest of the party either wipes or kills the fight for you, assuming you don't just tab out and spend those minutes doing something else is beyond me.

"It taught people" - I'm sorry to burst your bubble: no, it didn't. Anyone who cares to learn will learn, anyone who doesn't won't, regardless of perma death or just a temporary death. It's been that way since time immemorial - a not insignificant % of the playerbase will never desire to learn no matter what you do or lessons you try to 'teach' them. Perma was just needlessly punishing for zero point. It was artificial fake difficulty done bad, nothing more.

It wasn't permadeath, it was more a thing done for immersion. It's just that I think the AI for the trusts tries to raise people who are downed during the fight, and if one of those other npcs gets knocked off, it could probably lock out the other trust NPC that is responsible for casting raise from taking actions. It is a quality of life improvement, but given the AI stuff it just feels that some of it is being done for making trusts work.

[Puc]

There goes people killing the trial for me for my unfortunate mistake.

[Magiron]

Not gonna miss Limitless Blue taking 3-4 chains because people jump too early.