"You pull, you tank" is a bad mentality

[aveyond-dreams]

It will forever be a mystery as to why players who claim to want to "take it slow" are seemingly so averse to using Trusts, and insist on subjecting the entirety of Duty Finder to their whims.

[Doc_Seraph]

Kupo, I get so "kupo" sometimes when I tank I pull the mobs the wrong way and just lol (but always correct it) so..have fun kupo

[AbysmalDuck]

It will forever be a mystery as to why players who claim to want to "take it slow" are seemingly so averse to using Trusts, and insist on subjecting the entirety of Duty Finder to their whims.

While I think our views are always opposite, you seem to be fair in your responses. I wanted to offer my opinion on this comment, if I may.

I mentioned in another post that I think a lot of the time, it is intent. Most people don't intend to annoy you. I play to have fun, to meet other people (even though no one talks in dungeons), and to experience the story. There are other reasons I play, but I don't play the game as a chore and I think so many people have started playing the game as a chore. Why does it matter if it takes a few extra minutes in a dungeon?

For example, take a pull, if the DPS pulls away to go pick up more mobs, aren't you losing time where if the DPS stayed with the group, the pack would be dead sooner and we could move on? No one really knows how much time we are gaining or losing, but here we are arguing over something so silly. Now there is a difference if people are intentionally being toxic, but without them calling it out, you (generally) are just assuming they are there to annoy you. Single pulls can be annoying, I get it, but at the end of the day, is it really that big of a deal that you let yourself get upset over it?

Honestly, I'd love to see how many people arguing for other's to "stop ruining their experience" go into PvP and either AFK or don't try.

[ForteNightshade]

\For example, take a pull, if the DPS pulls away to go pick up more mobs, aren't you losing time where if the DPS stayed with the group, the pack would be dead sooner and we could move on? No one really knows how much time we are gaining or losing, but here we are arguing over something so silly. Now there is a difference if people are intentionally being toxic, but without them calling it out, you (generally) are just assuming they are there to annoy you. Single pulls can be annoying, I get it, but at the end of the day, is it really that big of a deal that you let yourself get upset over it?

Yes we do. Mob pulls are spread out that you may not even lose a single GCD if timed correctly. At most, you'll delay two GCDs worth. Considering your base AoE combo is the weakest in your arsenal, it's a negligible loss. You also have to factor in that small pulls means DPS won't have their big hitting abilities for both packs, which is a considerably larger loss. A Dragoon that can put Dragonfire Dive, Geirskogul, Nastrond and Stardiver on a pack of eight mobs will deal tremendously higher damage than a Dragoon only putting them on three targets and not having any off CD for the next pull. Furthermore, it's a DPS loss for all DPS (sans DNC) to AoE below three targets, thus you're taking even longer on a three pack pull once something dies.

Even if it weren't obvious enough, we have logs to show exactly how much of an appreciable gain big pulls are. You aren't saving "a few extra minutes." You're saying upwards of ten depending on the dungeon. If not more.

[AbysmalDuck]

Yes we do. Mob pulls are spread out that you may not even lose a single GCD if timed correctly. At most, you'll delay two GCDs worth. Considering your base AoE combo is the weakest in your arsenals, it's a negligible loss. You also have to factor in that small pulls means DPS won't have their big hitting abilities for both packs, which is a considerably larger loss. A Dragoon that can put Dragonfire Dive, Geirskogul, Nastrond and Stardiver on a pack of eight mobs will deal tremendously higher damage than a Dragoon only putting them on three targets and not having any off CD for the next pull. Furthermore, it's a DPS loss for all DPS (sans DNC) to AoE below three targets, thus you're taking even longer on a three pack pull once something does.

Even if it weren't obvious enough, we have logs to show exactly how much of an appreciable gain big pulls are. You aren't saving "a few extra minutes." You're saying upwards of ten depending on the dungeon.

I find it extremely hard to believe you can save 10 minutes in a dungeon. Not saying you are wrong, just that I don't see it feasible, but if you are able to show this via a YouTube video, I'd be interested in seeing it.

EDIT: I mean, from a basic duty roulette and not a single pull, single target vs. big pull.

[SeverianLyonesse]

It will forever be a mystery as to why players who claim to want to "take it slow" are seemingly so averse to using Trusts, and insist on subjecting the entirety of Duty Finder to their whims.

Why don't you just use trusts instead? They seem made for people who don't like dealing with human players.

I find it extremely hard to believe you can save 10 minutes in a dungeon. Not saying you are wrong, just that I don't see it feasible, but if you are able to show this via a YouTube video, I'd be interested in seeing it.

EDIT: I mean, from a basic duty roulette and not a single pull, single target vs. big pull.

I actually believe this when thinking about it more. We usually have, at minimum, four packs in between bosses, usually two walls. Give or take. And it takes about a minute to kill each one. Let's say pulling them together shaves off a whole minute (if you account for the fact that separating them makes the additional packs take longer after/before you popped your big burst damage). That's two minutes in between every boss minimum, so at least six minutes across three hallways.

If you have anything more than four packs (which a lot of dungeons do), then you can tack on another minute here or there. It approaches ten minutes pretty easily.

[Raven2014]

Great community by the way.

It is, as long as you ignore the forum.

Despite playing since 2.0 I have never really hang around the forum. It's only this time due to the long queue at the beginning of this expack that I started visitting here, and it blew my mind. It's almost like seeing the dark-side of the game that I rarely if ever seen inside the game itself. Despite amount of complain/fluff cake I see on here, I think the number of time I run into a matching incident in the game in my all 10 years of playing is probably counted on the fingers.


My advise: go to reddit if you want to find people enjoying the game. Half of this forum feels like people are being forced to play the game as gun-point, or doing it as a job.

To my fellow forumers: it is only now I realize it's a blessing that I have never played with any of you.

[AziraSyuren]

lmao my post got deleted

I guess it makes sense considering how inflammatory it was. I still have nothing but contempt for YPYT players though.

[Atelier-Bagur]

lmao my post got deleted

I guess it makes sense considering how inflammatory it was. I still have nothing but contempt for YPYT players though.

Mines too although I guess we cant call out other people specifically "stooges" lol

Still, wanted to still reiterate about the whole "people with tank anxiety should just use Trusts" point a previous poster made, that it would be fine and dandy if it were for the fact that they seriously cant do so until ShB+EW msq content. Which is why the devs applying Trusts into the previous msq group content is a plus for those type of people.

[Kaoru_Nagisa]

It will forever be a mystery as to why players who claim to want to "take it slow" are seemingly so averse to using Trusts, and insist on subjecting the entirety of Duty Finder to their whims.

Because they aren't actually interested in 'taking things slow' - they just want to get by with minimal effort on the backs of actually competent players who put effort into at least contributing meaningfully when placed into a team-based activity. You know, like normal people do IRL in similar situations.

It always reminds me of back in school, during times we were forced into groups for activities or projects. You always had one or more people who contributed heck-all, but still got a good grade for it based on all the work of the people who actually bothered to be courteous and put in the effort. It's why I vastly preferred when such projects were graded based on individual contribution, and everyone in the group was pre-assigned a task to complete.

I already have to deal with people at work not being courteous and doing their jobs poorly (or not at all), leaving I or others to clean up after them and work harder to make up for them putting us behind. It's incredibly tiring to also have to deal with it in a video game meant to be used to unwind from the capitalism grind and enjoyed.