Does 14 Promote a Culture of Mediocrity?

[Zsolen]

This is an MMO. They pay a sub to play a cooperative game with other people also paying subs.

It has nothing to do with duties going faster. Most people don't teach for duties to go faster. It's probably faster to just drag corpses across the finish line most of the time. You are simple accusing people of not actually caring, when they try to teach people. I have yet to see anyone going into teaching in a 'half-hearted' manner, and no I don't consider toxic behavior as teaching what is needed to be taught.

Everyone teaches. Tell me when was you formal training on this subject. Every single person in the world is at least an informal teacher and student. Everyone. No exceptions. Some are better at it than others. Some need to work on it. You should not tell people to not teach. That's unhealthy and also 100% impossible. Telling someone how to complete a mechanic they failed is not toxic, unless it was said in a toxic manner. It has nothing to do with intent. Every time a person goes into a duty, even with their static, they learn something. You cannot intend not to learn, and playing an MMO you should expect people to show you the ropes, when needed. It's also how life works.

You try to pegged me into a hole, where it didn't apply. That's all that happened. You applied your examples to me, which have nothing to do with me. If you don't want to apply it to me, then don't use the second person.

[Toutatis]

Plenty of people are happy when you explain the mechanics. I guess it goes with the tone. There's no need to say they are doing it wrong: just explain objectively what there is to do.

As for learning, well it's a game accessible to people 13+ yrs old, not a job. Many have families, jobs and limited time to play and do it to relax after a long day and some have more difficulties than others for a number of reasons.

[Caurcas]

"Lmao bruh! ItS a gAMe nOt a JoB!" is not a valid point to make in this case. When you play a cooperative game, like 14, you should have the common courtesy to try your hardest to complete the task at hand in an efficient manner. Its not about it being a "job", and more about not actively ruining the experience for other players.

[BigHoffie]

"Lmao bruh! ItS a gAMe nOt a JoB!" is not a valid point to make in this case. When you play a cooperative game, like 14, you should have the common courtesy to try your hardest to complete the task at hand in an efficient manner. Its not about it being a "job", and more about not actively ruining the experience for other players.

I've never understood the idea that people are okay being, not even mediocre, but outright bad at something they consider a hobby. Especially in a cooperative environment. I liken it to someone showing up to a recreational basketball league and trying to punt the ball every time someone passes it to them. How well do they think screaming "ItS a GAme NoT a jOb!" would work in any other situation?

[Kaurhz]

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Yes they do, obviously. But the reality is that many people are just not open to the idea of improvement beyond the bare minimum of minimums. US education is quite seemingly in a much better state then, many people get into the profession for all the wrong reasons, it was painfully obvious in my secondary years. - For reference, I've seen a teacher tell a student that they still get paid regardless of the result the student gets. As for my formal teaching, I've done several years of it in Higher Education, teaching anything from first year undergraduate students in my major, to teaching digital literacy and study skills, and on the other spectrum I've been involved with teaching digital skills to NEET. I have several certifications relating to the topics I teach, and 2 qualifications relating to education. Neither of these are relevant to the topic

The reality of the situation; regardless of whether you believe it to be the case or not (or whether you adhere to it), is that many people are woefully concerned with their time, both how they use it, and who they use it on. People want smooth duties, if they can help people along the way, then by all means, but the reality is this won't always be something that'll show in your duty. To take an example for myself, back in Heavenward someone was asking me why I wasn't using Bane on AoE packs (yes I know). When people are trying to blitz through these duties reading the tooltip and immediately putting it into execution on a routine basis just isn't happening in that dungeon, so I took the time, read the tooltip and facepalmed for an hour. Then in subsequent runs I started to use it until it naturally fit into muscle memory. Which need I might say took a few pulls. People at the time were equally pretty annoyed, and for obvious reasons.

The extent of me telling people not to teach is when they don't fully commit to it, either for that duty or whatever. It happens on a very regular basis. You cannot teach, expect people to immediately apply it then get frustrated when they don't. A lot of people in the community do this and are routinely upset by it and the general performance. I've reiterated several times that you only do so if you can commit and follow through without getting annoyed, because this is where stigmas and generalisations start that are detrimental to the community. Terms such as casual very quickly grow to have negative connotations. Equally so; it is unhealthy and unrealistic to expect that everyone can teach and is always doing so with the best of intentions in mind. If people want to teach by all means. But don't cry wolf when people don't learn within 10-15 minutes

Let me snag another example. If someone provides me with feedback, sure I'll be receptive to it and on the subsequent pulls I'll even try to apply it if I can, equally so for subsequent runs. This was a very commonplace thing to happen when I tried raiding in Eden's Verse. But if people, anyone does this and then bashes or berates the player for not meeting that expectation in a due timeframe, then the player very quickly becomes reluctant to forms of feedback. Why? Because to them they associate that experience with being berated. It has absolutely everything to do with intent. If you're trying to help and you're doing it with the goal of a faster or more efficient duty, you'll be woefully disappointed. If you try to help with the expectation that they'll learn fast; again, woefully disappointed. It is absolutely everything to do with intent and expectation, especially from the perspective of the one helping.

Again, I'm not personally attacking you, I'm just presenting you with logical reasons why not everyone should try, or why it can be detrimental to do so when you don't commit to the endeavour.

[VerdeLuck]

It's a game not a job. I don't get upset in a pickup game of basketball when people miss easy shots, I just keep playing.

[Illmaeran]

Tell me when was you formal training on this subject.

1995-1999!

[SenorPatty]

It's a game not a job. I don't get upset in a pickup game of basketball when people miss easy shots, I just keep playing.

Are you paying for the play time or pay an entree fee to use the court? I've seen...things happen when people mess with payed limited court time.

[MidnightEquinox]

I've never understood the idea that people are okay being, not even mediocre, but outright bad at something they consider a hobby. Especially in a cooperative environment. I liken it to someone showing up to a recreational basketball league and trying to punt the ball every time someone passes it to them. How well do they think screaming "ItS a GAme NoT a jOb!" would work in any other situation?

I can assure you you're mediocre or bad at at least one of your hobbies, unless you literally have like just the 1 hobby.

[van_arn]

“It’s just a game” just tells me it’s a cardinal sin for someone to bore me. If someone else is bored with me I’ll kick, if the other three are boring I’ll bail.