What are your crazy theories after Endwalker

[Rosenstrauch]

I agree it seems very plausible that Lahabrea is responsible for introducing tempering, but I don't think we'll be handling a split timeline again. The memory crystal has to somehow independently make its way from Pandæmonium to our present, and that can't happen if we only fix things in an alternate timeline.

(Well, technically we could fix things in timeline A while the people of timeline B (connected to ours) are doomed and send us the crystal distress signal, but that just makes things even more complicated.)

Pardon the belated response, but I feel that I've come up with a sufficient answer for how this would work. I believe it would look something like this:

Timeline A: Someone (most likely Azem), for reasons unknown, sets a soul crystal adrift upon the aetherial sea bearing a message regarding the events taking place in Pandaemonium. Themis is informed by Azem that aid will arrive at a precise location in Elpis at a precise moment in time. But nobody arrives, and as such Themis is forced to conduct his investigation alone. After a brief foray into Pandaemonium, he is forced to conclude that the entire facility is unsalvageable and drastic measures are taken to ensure that it's dealt with. Pandaemonium is destroyed in its entirety and written off as a necessary sacrifice for the greater good, while the truth about what was happening within goes unnoticed. 12,000 years and a lot of change later, the soul crystal sent into the aetherial sea finds its way into the Warrior of Light's hands, and they proceed to make a journey through time and space to investigate...

Timeline B: … arriving at the precise moment and location Themis was instructed to look for us. With the Warrior of Light demonstrating their martial prowess, Themis is confident that the Pandaemonium situation can be handled without sacrificing the facility or its inhabitants. This in turn leads to the truth of Pandaemonium's situation coming to light, etc.

Or in other words: Timeline A is our own timeline, while B is the branch we inadvertently caused by going back in time.

Like I said, however, it's nothing but a crazy theory, and I'm not going to get my hopes up by suggesting it will come to pass. For all I know, this could actually be nothing more than a time loop the WoL ends up setting into motion at the end of the raid by making the soul crystal themselves. But I think the part where Azem knew we'd be arriving, despite not being possessed of future sight, is a dead ringer for their involvement in our arrival. And I don't think they'd set us up to deal with Pandaemonium purely for the thrill of it.

[Ramesses]

Fascinating-- my early morning meeting got postponed which gave me ample time to while away on the forums. Many comments here were so intriguing to read, I even let my coffee go cold-- a sacrilege, I know, I know.

My personal pet theories are not wild-- just a tad eccentric and reckless-- yes, I know-- but the OP asked, and I'll shamelessly tell. My theories tend to revolve around people, places and then critical events-- in that order.

First up-- people-- and I'll commence with our old "friend" from 1.0-- Travanchet. For those who can remember, you'll also recall that the only time he shows up again is in Heavensward during the Alexander quests. Mide and Dayan essentially confirm that he was the culprit who orchestrated the original summoning of the primal Alexander and it's insane control of time manipulation. I reckon this lad could still be residing on one of the remaining shards orchestrating-- something-- but what? I will post my in-depth theories and speculations on this at a later time-- I assure you, it's reckless in it's thought process and I think the only person I mentioned it to was Moose a few years ago when I ran into him in Limsa.

Must remember that this is FFXIV-- and reckless speculation is usually required (and encouraged) provided it is within reckless wild reason. Reckless speculation is bloody good-- has immense potential to become reality.



Next on my list of "people" is Noah and the mysterious relics he nabbed towards the end of the Bozjah arc-- yes yes yes, I know-- I'll bring him up for the umpteenth time because I'm still smarting from his story not being properly concluded as we would have all wished. Which fuels our collective speculation that he quite possibly remains alive and thriving-- maybe in Corvos? I particularly loved the comments that Hemlock made in this thread --(page 6 or 7?)-- regarding the possiblity that Gra'ha could become a central figure for that region, shed his imposter syndrome and elevate into the Nuhn position (insert lovely, uplifting speech right here). Which makes me theorize that Noah could be involved in that whole shenanigans for better or worse-- and heck-- maybe we even go on another convoluted redemption arc for him.

Either way, he'll make a spiffy Trust in the future, yes? Plus Gaius-- and Livia. I think so too.



There are a few more "people" I had wanted to dredge up from the intricacies of the MSQ (from 1.0 to 6.0) but I'm suddenly getting distracted by work and I need more coffee, so I need to wrap this up now-- plus I still need to finish drafting my "feel good" post to the incredible Dev Team (regarding my review of EW) that I've been sitting on for a few weeks. As such, I'll just skip straight to listing one of the tentative "places" I've been theorizing might become a possibility-- wait for it--

A new powerful empire from one of the other shards who have consolidated all the nations, races and creeds under their banner into one technological juggernaut-- see images below of their airships that make the Garlean dreadnaughts look like mere drones. What? I like the idea of having big bad empires to battle with. Now that our lovely ol' lass Venat is no more, the barriers that kept all the fourteen shards separated have dissolved and our new Imperial friends have seen it fit and proper to expand their borders to include inter-planetary domains-- they are especially keen on absorbing Etheirys. Could make for some interesting new arc provided it's not pedestrian in it's storytelling.

It's okay if you reckon I've gone mental and lost the plot-- a few of my friends already said the same when I told them on discord. It's either we get some new Imperials or some of Omega's old colleagues






By the way-- remember how we kept running into "mirror" versions of certain NPCs from the Source while we were on the First? Rowena? Gerolt?

Well-- when you think about it along those terms, guess who happens to be the Crown Prince for these new Imperials?

Yes-- just when we thought we had enough of him-- I assure you this can happen-- the Devs love us like that. Please look forward to it.

Crap-- need to stop here an get to another meeting.




*Still editing, still editing, still editing-- images of the Lindblum airship and Phoenix are concept art from FFXIII, used here to convey how I envision our potential new imperial "friends"*

[Alleluia]

Crazy theory: The shoebill is the final boss.

Srsly, what is with that bird? Even the guys in Elpis are confused.

[Fenral]

Lyse needed an entire expansion to grow into her role in Ala Mihgo, and she had much stronger ties there to begin with, so I'm still not totally on board with G'raha suddenly putting down roots in Corvos (as nunh or otherwise), even though I know it's probably coming. It'd be too sudden a reversal from his 6.0 epilogue conversation, not to mention the very dreams that gave him hope as he stared death in the face in Ultima Thule.

However, some of his dialogue seemed to suggest the existence of a younger G tia, so if G'raha were to (re)discover he had a younger brother... We could potentially get the Lion King scenario they've clearly been dying to do since the ink dried on the Seeker tribe structure, but with G'raha and Krile serving in more of a mentor capacity.

G'raha shows up just in time to fill a power vacuum in the wake of the Final Days. The younger tia, who's been prepping his entire life for this is jealous, but eventually concedes that he can never match one of the saviors of the universe. G'raha, meanwhile, really wasn't planning on sticking around for longer than a daytrip, and now has the ironic task of helping his little brother to overcome deeply-rooted insecurities and be true to his desires, while simultaneously reaffirming his own. All of this set to backdrop of post-imperial intrigue and ancient Allagan mystery.

[EdwinLi]

Lyse needed an entire expansion to grow into her role in Ala Mihgo, and she had much stronger ties there to begin with, so I'm still not totally on board with G'raha suddenly putting down roots in Corvos (as nunh or otherwise), even though I know it's probably coming. It'd be too sudden a reversal from his 6.0 epilogue conversation, not to mention the very dreams that gave him hope as he stared death in the face in Ultima Thule.

However, some of his dialogue seemed to suggest the existence of a younger G tia, so if G'raha were to (re)discover he had a younger brother... We could potentially get the Lion King scenario they've clearly been dying to do since the ink dried on the Seeker tribe structure, but with G'raha and Krile serving in more of a mentor capacity.

G'raha shows up just in time to fill a power vacuum in the wake of the Final Days. The younger tia, who's been prepping his entire life for this is jealous, but eventually concedes that he can never match one of the saviors of the universe. G'raha, meanwhile, really wasn't planning on sticking around for longer than a daytrip, and now has the ironic task of helping his little brother to overcome deeply-rooted insecurities and be true to his desires, while simultaneously reaffirming his own. All of this set to backdrop of post-imperial intrigue and ancient Allagan mystery.

You just have to give him time off-screen to get things done before his return in Season 2. The Scion splitting up is mostly to set the stage for them to eventually return in Season 2 (most likely with new gear as well and maybe a new Job) but first they have to do is deal with their own issues by themselves while WoL begins his/her new adventure with the new companions who will be with the Scions as WoL Season 2 companions.

That is sadly how life stories are sometimes as we are never there to see the stories of everything about a person that leads to their progress and development once their stories crosspaths with another person's story but we know they happened once we learn about it.

However, that is not a bad thing because it shows that a person like WoL is not need to be there all the time for a person to get things done even involving their own personal issues.

[Fenral]

You just have to give him time off-screen to get things done before his return in Season 2. The Scion splitting up is mostly to set the stage for them to eventually return in Season 2 (most likely with new gear as well and maybe a new Job) but first they have to do is deal with their own issues by themselves while WoL begins his/her new adventure with the new companions who will be with the Scions as WoL Season 2 companions.

That is sadly how life stories are sometimes as we are never there to see the stories of everything about a person that leads to their progress and development once their stories crosspaths with another person's story but we know they happened once we learn about it.

You quoted my entire post, so I'm not really sure what you're trying to reply to (I'm assuming the first paragraph).

I'd rather not see any of our companions handled like that, personally. Alisaie went through some stuff during her post-Coil wanderings, but she was still very much Alisaie when she came back. The core of her character hadn't changed. I think the only one of our companions who really changed during the Shadowbringers timeskip was Thancred, and that not only took literal years, but dragged underlying issues he's had since 1.0 to the fore, rather than completely replacing his established motivations.

But I'd rather not get preemptively worn out over possible writing fumbles that haven't even happened yet. I was really just speculating on how a possible, on-screen, "Nunh of the G" story might play out in a way that wouldn't undermine established characterizations.

[KageTokage]

I would like to see G'raha go on his own journey and get to explore him as a character in a setting that doesn't revolve around the WoL so much.

I feel like Corvos would be a perfect chance to explore that.

He's already expressed interest in returning there plus the land was ravaged by the Final Days, so I think we might end up visiting the place with him in patch content. It would result in him having a diminished 6.x MSQ presence, but I think he's gotten a fair bit of spotlight as is.

[EdwinLi]

You quoted my entire post, so I'm not really sure what you're trying to reply to (I'm assuming the first paragraph).

I'd rather not see any of our companions handled like that, personally. Alisaie went through some stuff during her post-Coil wanderings, but she was still very much Alisaie when she came back. The core of her character hadn't changed. I think the only one of our companions who really changed during the Shadowbringers timeskip was Thancred, and that not only took literal years, but dragged underlying issues he's had since 1.0 to the fore, rather than completely replacing his established motivations.

But I'd rather not get preemptively worn out over possible writing fumbles that haven't even happened yet. I was really just speculating on how a possible, on-screen, "Nunh of the G" story might play out in a way that wouldn't undermine established characterizations.

I think you are confusing personality change with character development here. Personality change is a common trait used to show character developement but it is not actual character develop but a easier way to show it if you understand what I am trying to say.

A character can go through his/her own character development while maintaining their original personality. G'raha himself literally went through this from 2.0 Crystal tower raid story to his return in 5.0 Shadowbringer. His Exarch personality and experience may have developed him greatly but his personality was still very much the same from his 2.0 days. He just had little time to show it to others until WoL appeared on the First due to how focuserd he was on his mission.

However, showing off-screen development for a character is often difficult because readers/followers of a story often want to see it happen directly especially when they can only see the story through the views of their own character. Yet to focus too much on showing it with players characters always around is one of the greatest fumbles any story writer can make as well since it shows how characters themselves can't develop in positive ways unless the Player's character is there to help them.

[Fenral]

I think you are confusing personality change with character development here. Personality change is a common trait used to show character developement but it is not actual character develop but a easier way to show it if you understand what I am trying to say.

A character can go through his/her own character development while maintaining their original personality. G'raha himself literally went through this from 2.0 Crystal tower raid story to his return in 5.0 Shadowbringer. His Exarch personality and experience may have developed him greatly but his personality was still very much the same from his 2.0 days. He just had little time to show it to others until WoL appeared on the First due to how focuserd he was on his mission.

I'm sorry to confuse you. I think you just lost sight of the larger context required to understand what I was getting at.

I don't disagree with the sentiment that he needs a break (I even said as much myself in another thread), I even think there are obstacles that could arise naturally to pull him into the background for a time (losing the Allagan Eye, for one). I just don't think having him pull a Lyse and become a leader figure, in a region he has already said he has no intention of settling down in, would be a natural development, nor do I think there's anything that could believably happen to him off-screen that could enable that turn as a natural character development, short of replacing his personality.

The Exarch worked because, at the end of the day, he still retained that baseline desire to go on adventures with his hero. His lifelong dream is continued participation in FFXIV's narrative. To replace that with another goal (i.e. restoring the G as nunh) would be to suggest that his original goal was somehow deficient. Sure, there are players who don't like him, and maybe even want him dead and gone, but the story has never framed his desire to be this wandering altruistic figure alongside another wandering altruistic figure as anything but worthy. Adventures are best when shared.

For a really old and well-known comparison, take Dogi from the Ys series. He appears in almost every game in some capacity (except Ys II), and has been Adol's formal traveling companion since Ys III (well, IV but that timeline is a mess). He didn't settle down in his hometown in Felghana, and after 35 years (well, only 7 in-universe) nobody keeping up with the series really questions his presence anymore. If there's a wall, he'll be there to crush it. It's what he does.

We're definitely going to Corvos, and G'raha is definitely coming with us. I just prefer to think we won't be leaving him there.

[EdwinLi]

I'm sorry to confuse you. I think you just lost sight of the larger context required to understand what I was getting at.

I don't disagree with the sentiment that he needs a break (I even said as much myself in another thread), I even think there are obstacles that could arise naturally to pull him into the background for a time (losing the Allagan Eye, for one). I just don't think having him pull a Lyse and become a leader figure, in a region he has already said he has no intention of settling down in, would be a natural development, nor do I think there's anything that could believably happen to him off-screen that could enable that turn as a natural character development, short of replacing his personality.

The Exarch worked because, at the end of the day, he still retained that baseline desire to go on adventures with his hero. His lifelong dream is continued participation in FFXIV's narrative. To replace that with another goal (i.e. restoring the G as nunh) would be to suggest that his original goal was somehow deficient. Sure, there are players who don't like him, and maybe even want him dead and gone, but the story has never framed his desire to be this wandering altruistic figure alongside another wandering altruistic figure as anything but worthy. Adventures are best when shared.

For a really old and well-known comparison, take Dogi from the Ys series. He appears in almost every game in some capacity (except Ys II), and has been Adol's formal traveling companion since Ys III (well, IV but that timeline is a mess). He didn't settle down in his hometown in Felghana, and after 35 years (well, only 7 in-universe) nobody keeping up with the series really questions his presence anymore. If there's a wall, he'll be there to crush it. It's what he does.

We're definitely going to Corvos, and G'raha is definitely coming with us. I just prefer to think we won't be leaving him there.

I personally don't think he abaddon his dream to go on adventures with WoL but this issue has been on his mind despite not speaking about it. It feels more like this was a personal matter he wanted to deal with first before setting out on his dream which he should follow through in Season 2 once he returns.

6.1 to 6.55 is meant to be the Prologue for Season 2 after all so I expected that during this time SE and Yoshi-P may use this to settle personal matters with certain characters, like G'raha, so they can determine which one of the Scions will return first during 7.0 both for plot reasons and to determine which character are going to be in the Trust for 7.X era. Along with show the aftermath of Endwalker events on Eorzea and maybe a bit on how the Final Days affect the Unknown regions we will go to in Season 2.

I also expect we may meet one or two of the new companions in 6.1 to 6.55 since they may seek to set the stage for the locations we are going to in 7.0 and the Season 2 plot through this new companion for WoL.

Scion return wise for 7.0, I expect G'raha to be the first since we did make a promise to him about going on another adventure with him so 6.1 to 6.55 may focus a bit about G'raha settling his personal matters before WoL starts his/her journey into the new regions in 7.0 so he can be there when WoL begins his/her new adventure. My other guess is Thancred and Urianger mostly due to how their reason for splitting up with the group is to go on their own adventure which most likely may lead to their return either during Prologue (aka 6.1 to 6.55) or during 7.0 during some moment when they make a heroic return.