What are your crazy theories after Endwalker

[Anvaire]

Livingway says Zodiark could be summoned without us feeling more than a "tug" on our aether. She never says that we'd be tempered by something of his scale. And I'd think she would have, if that were so; given the context of that conversation.

And yet, Emet outright says in Shadowbringers that Zodiark tempered "us". By "us", I assume he means the people who summoned him ie the convocation members and their underlings who were present (if any). But that is technically an assumption, so the writers could come back and claim he tempered the whole city when he was summoned if they want since they've never specified.

(Side note, if Fandaniel is any indication, we at least now have confirmation that tempering definitely does not stick with a soul once they get put thru the reincarnation rinse cycle. Which is cool.)


Hydaelyn definitely doesn't seem to temper people, which we now know is apparently perfectly within bounds of how primal summoning can work. Before EW, that was up for debate.

Tbh I think there are two affects that can happen by tempering. Often when we discuss it, we talk of the mind alterng affect that tempering has on its summoners and those that come into contact with it.

If we consider what tempering actually is, in a base form, it is merely the atuning of Aether to a specific Element or Polarity. I think the mind altering aspect of primals is injecting that Aether polarity with the command to think of the primal, worship the primal and find more worshipers.

When Emet says that he is tempered. I do think hes telling the truth, but the tempering is merely Zodiark attuning his aether to Darkness polarity, making it a bit more active rather than the primal version.

I think this would also explain why the Ascians despite being around Elidibus, a primal, for thousands of years was not tempered to following Elidibus' every desire.
We could also argue that hydealyn's blessing of light is similiar in this regard. It tempers the Aether to be more static, thus providing protection from being influenced by other primals / aetherical polarity.

This also fits in with the meaning of the word.

Tempering:

1. improve the hardness and elasticity of (steel or other metal) by reheating and then cooling it.
"the way a smith would temper a sword"

2. act as a neutralizing or counterbalancing force to (something).
"their idealism is tempered with realism"

[Iscah]

This also fits in with the meaning of the word.

Tempering:

1. improve the hardness and elasticity of (steel or other metal) by reheating and then cooling it.
"the way a smith would temper a sword"

2. act as a neutralizing or counterbalancing force to (something).
"their idealism is tempered with realism"

Something to keep in mind is that (unless there's 1.0 history I'm unaware of) we've acquired "tempering" as a catch-all term by accident. It originally applied to Ifrit's thralls specifically, coming from the first definition, like Leviathan's "drowned" or Ramuh's "touched".

As late as level 50 they're introducing new primal-specific terms – though one they soon drop and repurpose.

http://garlandtools.org/db/#quest/65969
Yet, just as Ifrit's tempered or Leviathan's drowned, Odin must needs have his “sundered” to offer crystals in his name─unless he drinks of the Shroud's aether.

Edit to add: Later still, Lakshmi has her "dreamers".

[Shookbeast]

I’m currently playing NewGame+ for just the ARR stuff (it’s been a while).

Crazy Theory: We actually DO go back in time and give Cid his goggles.

[Iscah]

I agree it seems very plausible that Lahabrea is responsible for introducing tempering, but I don't think we'll be handling a split timeline again. The memory crystal has to somehow independently make its way from Pandæmonium to our present, and that can't happen if we only fix things in an alternate timeline.

(Well, technically we could fix things in timeline A while the people of timeline B (connected to ours) are doomed and send us the crystal distress signal, but that just makes things even more complicated.)

Hydaelyn's talk about time "converging" seems more like she's talking about the two elements of the time loop starting in Elpis have met up. Our paths "converged" back then, we passed the information to Venat, and we went our separate ways – her through the slow path of millennia and us travelling back to where we began. Those two threads join up again when we meet her in full knowledge of what happened back then.

[Rosenstrauch]

I agree it seems very plausible that Lahabrea is responsible for introducing tempering, but I don't think we'll be handling a split timeline again. The memory crystal has to somehow independently make its way from Pandæmonium to our present, and that can't happen if we only fix things in an alternate timeline.

(Well, technically we could fix things in timeline A while the people of timeline B (connected to ours) are doomed and send us the crystal distress signal, but that just makes things even more complicated.)

Pardon the belated response, but I feel that I've come up with a sufficient answer for how this would work. I believe it would look something like this:

Timeline A: Someone (most likely Azem), for reasons unknown, sets a soul crystal adrift upon the aetherial sea bearing a message regarding the events taking place in Pandaemonium. Themis is informed by Azem that aid will arrive at a precise location in Elpis at a precise moment in time. But nobody arrives, and as such Themis is forced to conduct his investigation alone. After a brief foray into Pandaemonium, he is forced to conclude that the entire facility is unsalvageable and drastic measures are taken to ensure that it's dealt with. Pandaemonium is destroyed in its entirety and written off as a necessary sacrifice for the greater good, while the truth about what was happening within goes unnoticed. 12,000 years and a lot of change later, the soul crystal sent into the aetherial sea finds its way into the Warrior of Light's hands, and they proceed to make a journey through time and space to investigate...

Timeline B: … arriving at the precise moment and location Themis was instructed to look for us. With the Warrior of Light demonstrating their martial prowess, Themis is confident that the Pandaemonium situation can be handled without sacrificing the facility or its inhabitants. This in turn leads to the truth of Pandaemonium's situation coming to light, etc.

Or in other words: Timeline A is our own timeline, while B is the branch we inadvertently caused by going back in time.

Like I said, however, it's nothing but a crazy theory, and I'm not going to get my hopes up by suggesting it will come to pass. For all I know, this could actually be nothing more than a time loop the WoL ends up setting into motion at the end of the raid by making the soul crystal themselves. But I think the part where Azem knew we'd be arriving, despite not being possessed of future sight, is a dead ringer for their involvement in our arrival. And I don't think they'd set us up to deal with Pandaemonium purely for the thrill of it.

[vormela]

As a result, the conflict growing between Amaurot's people post-Final Days will not be beyond reconciliation and the Sundering will be averted, giving the Ancients their chance at a brighter future.

It's as much wishful thinking as a crazy theory, really.

I love this and want it so badly to happen! I love them so much and to help them would be to fall in line with Louisoix's teachings.

But then on some level the ancients have survived, even though they are not as powerful as their complete forms.

Their being artists/creators is a passion all the civilizations still share (Allaghans, Garlemald specifically, as we face some reckoning about the fate of Garlemald and Hades' legacy). Their drive to accurately name and categorize everything still happens (Thancred realizing in EW what a powerful act naming Ryne was, then us going back to meet the taxonomists in Elpis was a really cool parallel). We still have grapes that look somewhat grapelike in La Noscea. Elpis sure looks a lot like Labyrinthos. People are still napping in the nap room. Creations are still escaping. They lived, just like the people now.

One of the ways I see them as being different is that, though they are curious, they won't leave the lab. They see it as a job for familiars. Azem seemed to be the only role related to studying the geography (human, ecological, geological...all summed up nicely in the story of the volcano) of the world. They need to do some field work and reconnaissance. It is one thing Hades and others admired so much about their version of Azem.

That is just something innately human that they lacked. If they survived, it makes me wonder if they would be inspired by peoples of the future to go outside their laboratories more often. And maybe more than just surviving the final days they would develop in that way. It seems like the societies in current times are a lot more Azem-like in their need for exploration, and their society could be improved in that way!

I really love the ancients. So much. I just did the Elpis guide quests yesterday where you hang out with them and share observations about things like mourning the dead and so this is fresh in my mind.

[vormela]

I’m currently playing NewGame+ for just the ARR stuff (it’s been a while).

Crazy Theory: We actually DO go back in time and give Cid his goggles.

Cid and Azem have a lot in common as well, just sayin'.

[EdwinLi]

If 7.0 ends up a good amount focusing on the New World and exploring/discovering the unknown regions then I think New Job theory wise they may consider to bring in the Sword/Gun job as the Corsair Job so they have one of the two new jobs focus on the expansion theme about exploring the unknown.

The sword/gun combo is a iconic priate job weapon in fantasy games and it may fit to be the 2nd Scouting Gear job since currently only Rogue/Ninja use scounting gears. Not to mention SE may use 7.0 as a opportunity to get a 2nd Scouting gear job due to how 7.0 should be the double DPS new job expansion if following new job release patterns.

This may also give SE a job that may focus on lore about the priates that never became part of Limsa Lominsa changes and thus set out into others regions they believe will allow them to continue their way of life far from Limsa Lominsa control, did not agree with Merlwyb, or explore lore about pirates and/or explorers born in the New World and Unknown regions.

Not to mention this maybe a good opportunity to revive the Corsair Job from FFXI into FF14 with a new weapon set being the sword/gun weapon since single Gun weapon is taken by Machinist already similar to how SE revived the Scythe Dark Knight from FFXI as the Reaper in FF14.

[Kesey]

If 7.0 ends up a good amount focusing on the New World and exploring/discovering the unknown regions then I think New Job theory wise they may consider to bring in the Sword/Gun job as the Corsair Job so they have one of the two new jobs focus on the expansion theme about exploring the unknown.

The sword/gun combo is a iconic priate job weapon in fantasy games and it may fit to be the 2nd Scouting Gear job since currently only Rogue/Ninja use scounting gears. Not to mention SE may use 7.0 as a opportunity to get a 2nd Scouting gear job due to how 7.0 should be the double DPS new job expansion if following new job release patterns.

This may also give SE a job that may focus on lore about the priates that never became part of Limsa Lominsa changes and thus set out into others regions they believe will allow them to continue their way of life far from Limsa Lominsa control, did not agree with Merlwyb, or explore lore about pirates and/or explorers born in the New World and Unknown regions.

Not to mention this maybe a good opportunity to revive the Corsair Job from FFXI into FF14 with a new weapon set being the sword/gun weapon since single Gun weapon is taken by Machinist already similar to how SE revived the Scythe Dark Knight from FFXI as the Reaper in FF14.

Wouldn't the corsair be two pistols like Merlwyb Bloefhiswyn? Did it not seem strange she had new animations we haven't seen before in 5.5 during the duty?

It would also be interesting for a pirate town, that is basically the opposite of Limsa, that is lawless and a criminal haven and could easily be placed in the South Seas or the New World. But I also think it would be weird to have a second pirate town and putting it in the new world also takes away the chance to have a colony themed town.

[EdwinLi]

Wouldn't the corsair be two pistols like Merlwyb Bloefhiswyn? Did it not seem strange she had new animations we haven't seen before in 5.5 during the duty?

It would also be interesting for a pirate town, that is basically the opposite of Limsa, that is lawless and a criminal haven and could easily be placed in the South Seas or the New World. But I also think it would be weird to have a second pirate town and putting it in the new world also takes away the chance to have a colony themed town.

While dual pistol will be interesting for Corsair, I feel that maybe used for a different job such as Gunslinger Job which maybe western theme Job for the New World side of the theme if they have a location in the New World themed around the wild west. That will then make Gunslinger the 4th Physical Range Job. We currently have 4 Tank, 5 Melee DPS, 4 Healers, 3 Mage DPS, and 3 Physical Range DPS by how SE categorize Job roles now.

This will set up the 8.0 expansion for either a Physical Range DPS or Mage DPS job and Gunslinger Job maybe a possible choice if they want to give us Merlwyb theme job if they don't give the dual pistol weapon to Corsair.

However, it is possible sword/gun weapon may not be given to Corsair as well and they go down the Merlwyb path which will lead to a different job getting Sword/Gun for a different type of theme to maybe fit the theme of one of the Unknown civilization we don't know about. I already have one guess for a long time in my signature being the Modern Assassin job as the Sword/gun job while the others is either a Demon Hunter Job or a Noctis/Yozora Job.