New summoner is unacceptable

[Scryar]

While I prefer the new summoner over the old one it's undeniable that they went i bit too far in terms of simplicity. It feels like a job which will be really fun in 2 expansions which shouldn't be the case when they can release fun and complete new jobs like reaper. And summoner is basically a new job.

[Coatl]

Wow. They went too far.

[Melorie]

I don't get that vibe from them honestly. Rather, it just seems like they're now taking feedback from players who don't care about the game that much, or who don't know what they're talking about. If anything they should listen less to feedback from players who demonstrably are unable to achieve or excel in their roles. They should not be taking feedback on SMN from people who don't even have it leveled at 90.

It doesn't really help that the community is so loud, without reason. People barely try to spend 15*min on a dummy in order to understand a class, much less use it outside a leveling roulette and still feel like they should have a strong opinion on it (at least that's what I see with healers every day). Also, the fact that apparently the option of simply disliking a certain class and not playing with it for whatever reason doesn't exist. They must ask for it to change without even thinking twice what that "change" means.

[Anvaire]

Honestly i think the intention for the rework was for summoner to be fast and flashy, with a lot of optimisation to fit everything in. But it came at the cost of any meaningful mechanics. Honestly i think they plain ran out of time with it. Each primal should mechanically feel distinct and you can see this with how they work ... Bahamut and Phoenix aside. Garuda is fast, but slowed with slipstream. Ifrit is Slow but powerful strikes, Titan is fast 1-2 rotation that actively limits OGCDS.

Its like they got the bones in place but forgot to account of sinnew and flesh. The design approach isnt the problem on a whole. Rotating though the summons and using them to change the spells cast is a neat design, but the implementation is where they went wrong. Too few OGCD's, and rotations that are overly simple. Heck if they had gone with 1-2 rotations for phoenix and Titan a, 1,1,1,1,2 for Garuda and maybe a 1-2-3 for Ifrit with some OCGD's to weave, it would make the job feel more active.

Honestly though, even if they made bahamut spells casted rather than instants, it would balance out the variance and give more to consider. Its why i dont think its wholly bad, it just needs small nudges here and there to fullly complete.

The biggest challenge they face, if they ever think to address it is to make Arcanum summons feel more like summons. I suspect they land and then imediately vanish because they wanted to differentiate them from the demi's.

Once adjustment they could make is to give the arcanums a chargable bar that mean they only do the enkindle ability if you manage to weave in all abilities ... but i dont really know how that would work in practice.

Carbuncle im not really sure what the philosophy behind him is other than a means to give Egi-Gamour without worrying about attack animations. i guess.

[Rolder50]

Honestly i think the intention for the rework was for summoner to be fast and flashy, with a lot of optimisation to fit everything in. But it came at the cost of any meaningful mechanics. Honestly i think they plain ran out of time with it. Each primal should mechanically feel distinct and you can see this with how they work ... Bahamut and Phoenix aside. Garuda is fast, but slowed with slipstream. Ifrit is Slow but powerful strikes, Titan is fast 1-2 rotation that actively limits OGCDS

The problem here being that they give you all this space to think about oGCDs, and then just plain don't give you any to use. The couple you do get, energy drain and fester, can easily be fit inside Bahamut and Phoenix without issue, leading to the rest of the rotation being rather sleep inducing.

[seraf]

65 pages in and I still fail to see why the job being simplified is bad.

[Rolder50]

65 pages in and I still fail to see why the job being simplified is bad.

Because the game has too many simple jobs and not enough complex jobs, and with the rework, they removed yet another complex job. I fail to see why every single job in the game needs to be simple but that is the route they have been heading down for a couple expansions now.

[Snorky]

I really like what they did with summoner, although I wish the summons were all a bit bigger.

[Vahlnir]

The problem here being that they give you all this space to think about oGCDs, and then just plain don't give you any to use. The couple you do get, energy drain and fester, can easily be fit inside Bahamut and Phoenix without issue, leading to the rest of the rotation being rather sleep inducing.

Yeah. I wouldn't be opposed to having more OGCDs (that aren't DoTs). It's super fun for me as is, but I know that it could still be improved. Hopefully what we are seeing now is just the foundation for future plans.

[Rolder50]

Yeah. I wouldn't be opposed to having more OGCDs (that aren't DoTs). It's super fun for me as is, but I know that it could still be improved. Hopefully what we are seeing now is just the foundation for future plans.

I don't trust them at all these days with "future plans" after seeing how those future plans panned out for MCH.