Dear SquareEnix/Natsuko Ishikawa - About Zenos in Endwalker *MAJOR MSQ SPOILERS*!

[Elysidelphi]

Oh that idea I have already in my mind. Remember we woke up Elidibus and now remember who talked in the final last moment of the Credits in Elpis ... He gave him a second chance, so Zenos should be his "problem" just like Fandaniel.

What do you mean?

[slaymaker1907]

Leave it to someone who likes a piece of cardboard like Zenos to have trouble with making paragraphs.

They did put breaks in their text, just triple left click and it will select the paragraphs. It is unfortunate though that they didn't do it in a way that renders nicely.

[Aneshda]

What do you mean?

Zitat Zitat von KitKatnip Beitrag anzeigen
I'm not convinced Zenos is dead. We killed him once and he didn't stay dead. I think he's going to come back again. Although how he's going to get back from the far end of the Universe, I have no idea.


Oh that idea I have already in my mind. Remember we woke up Elidibus and now remember who talked in the final last moment of the Credits in Elpis ... He gave him a second chance, so Zenos should be his "problem" just like Fandaniel.

That was my answer. See the Credits till the end ... who is standing in Elpis, talking that he wants to go with us to a special Place? And there you have your answers. Zenos could be brought back, by him.

[Loggos]

If Zenos comes back he can start his redemption by paying my WoL's therapy bills because if not even dying at the edge of space rids me of his presence then my WoL's gonna spiral into a serious depression.

[Elysidelphi]

Zitat Zitat von KitKatnip Beitrag anzeigen
I'm not convinced Zenos is dead. We killed him once and he didn't stay dead. I think he's going to come back again. Although how he's going to get back from the far end of the Universe, I have no idea.


Oh that idea I have already in my mind. Remember we woke up Elidibus and now remember who talked in the final last moment of the Credits in Elpis ... He gave him a second chance, so Zenos should be his "problem" just like Fandaniel.

That was my answer. See the Credits till the end ... who is standing in Elpis, talking that he wants to go with us to a special Place? And there you have your answers. Zenos could be brought back, by him.

Why do you think that Elidibus might bring Zenos back? Just curious to see your take on it, I love speculating.

In the present time, Elidibus is dead, right? So how could be bring back Zenos? And why?

As for the last cutscene at the end of the credits with Elidibus in Elpis, I took that to mean that we will have to travel in the past, meet Elidibus there (when he was still alive, in the Unsundered World) and begin the new raids with him by our side.

So how would this work, in your opinion?

[Crushnight]

True. But then, why do you think that Zenos was not left dead at the end of Stormblood, the way Thordan was left dead once defeated?

I've been reading through this thread and I'll get to the last few pages in a moment but this is easily explained.

Fan popularity.

Zenos was popular after 4.0 dropped heck I even loved Zenos in 4.0, Zenos however has only lost popularity since being brought back because the writing surrounding him has been sub par at best.

And if you think Zenos being brought back was all planned you really need to look at how SB patches went.
-Elidibus when he was already meant to be in Zenos's body was as tall as a midlander and not up to Varis's height which Zenos is.
-Redundant scene that makes the Ala Mhigan resistance woefully incompetent (Zenos as an Elezen flying away on a magitek mount and getting all the way to Ghimylt Dark)
- Zenos being the only being to subconsciously body jack someone, he had no intention of doing this he sliced his throat because he wanted to die, he didn't want to live so this body jacking is just wtf, oh and he conveniently masters this body jacking after never doing it before or knowing how he did it in the 1st as he takes over an imperil centurion.

It is very clear that Zenos was originally planned to be dead in 4.0 but they decided they wanted more and I can only surmise Fan popularity is what swayed that decision.

And this Zenos is the result.

Zenos would absolutely fail the simple question; Would you like to see Zenos return? A. Yes, B. No
If they were to put out a survey now because the yes people are now dealing with people who don't like his character from inception + those who didn't like what happened to Zenos since he was brought back + those that like him but felt EW was a good enough send off and don't want to risk harming his character.

[Elysidelphi]

More details on Zenos found in the story in this link (or alternatively in the FFXIV books/encyclopaedias):

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...s_the_offical/



"One might think it a blessing to be born into the ruling family of a vast and powerful empire, but for the young Prince Zenos-great grandson of Solus zos Galvus, revered founding father of the Garlean Empire-it was a curse.


From the beginning, Zenos was alone. His lady mother succumbed to illness shortly after bringing him into the world, and his lord father was seldom present, occupied as he was with his military campaigns and political maneuvering. And while the prince was surrounded by countless servants, they were as machina to him, trundling about on invisible rails, bereft of independent thought. Nor did he hold the learned men and women who served as his tutors in much higher regard. His brilliant mind found their lessons, their very existence-monotonous, and he preferred the silent company of books.


With such an upbringing, he could not choose but be different from other children. Indeed, it could be said that he was never a child at all. Innocence and playfulness were quite alien to him, the former expunged by his earliest schooling and the latter afforded no outlet. His days were uniformly joyless, and he went about his scheduled tasks with apathy. Thus did he pass his first four and ten summers-in a steel-grey blue of tedium."

[Chained_Icarus]

Except we, the players, did not get the choice—and that caused its own disconnect amongst players; and I have read a lot of criticisms about this. **My WoL would not have fought him.**

I know I'm late to the party on this and maybe it's been addressed and you might not even be following the thread anymore but... the WoL isn't a blank insert character. They do have a personality and agency, though we do get to kind of color it a little bit. But most choices in the game are flavors of the same actual choice because the WoL does have desires of their own.

The WoL is Azem. Azem as we know is a thrill seeker and risk taker. Several times the WoL has canonically done things purely for the challenge of it (like making the Ironworks people take the safety off the Omega Savage simulations, or a similar step for the Warring Triad extremes). We duel other people with outright glee (Raubahn and Venat). We dive into several side dungeons and raids simply because the thought of adventure compels us to do so. We also know from the DRK questline that the WoL is frustrated with people asking him to handle all these easy tasks fubar they feel are beneath them and wants to let loose against something without holding back.

Zenos isn't offering the PLAYER the choice to walk away. He's offering Azem the choice to walk away. And while you can choose Azem's overall reason (enjoying the challenge, duty, revenge), Azem does not choose to walk away. Azem chooses to - with no external stakes, distractions or innocents who could get hurt - go all out.

Anyway the TLDR is we often forget the WoL has a canon- though slightly fluid - personally and backstory. For RP reasons we can ignore it but it is what the MSQ pulls from and acknowledges.

[nighttimebunny]

I wish they'd give us flashbacks into his childhood and past.

[Elysidelphi]

I wish they'd give us flashbacks into his childhood and past.

Yeah, me too, but with Zenos being back as himself (not just his avatar or his body being used by someone else again).

By the way, has anyone already figured Zenos's avatar's importance? I know Yoshi-P said we should pay close attention to his avatar. Has anyone figured out why? What's special/different about his avatar?