Dungeons are becoming style over substance.

[Velnora]

i love the look of the Eureka zones better but Bozja is different. I can't fault the look but there is certainly a lot more time and development spent developing all the content there including Castrum/Dalraidia and Delibrum Reginae than simply saying one venue had 4 zones and the other 2. I've also spent a lot of time recently getting clears for my main and a number of alts in DR Savage on Aether, Crystal and Chaos and that content took a lot of time and effort to develop in my opinion.

The problem is people complain that the content is stale and that we get the same stuff but when the team makes the decision to limit the number of dungeons to go and develop other content like Eureka, Bozja, Ishgard Restoration, Island Santuary and so on they get blamed for having less content when people wave the two less dungeon flag in their face.



I've been told but then I'm not a developer that 3 CE's in Bozja are equal in development cost/time to 3 dungeon bosses and there are a lot of them there including 6 solo duels.

Why is it always this or that. Why not maintain the quantity of current content, while also creating new pieces of content. The game has only been growing, so there are no excuses about budget.

[LaylaTsarra]

Why is it always this or that. Why not maintain the quantity of current content, while also creating new pieces of content. The game has only been growing, so there are no excuses about budget.

I don't write the budget and it would be great if they in fact did increase the budget. The surge of new players should warrant that the directors in charge of the money see that and increase the budget accordingly.

I will say that dungeons aren't the where with all that some people want to make them out to be. I may be wrong but I suspect that the development team sees that many people, your truly included, run many of those dungeons for Main Story and then don't go back.

I may be wrong but didn't they say they were considering making some harder 4 man content? They say a lot of things so who knows. I'm still waiting for my alts to be able to share a house and they said they were looking at that too. I also think from what i've read/been told that we aren't going to get another Eureka or Bozja in Endwalker which personally saddens me because i love that content but if that's true then those funds should be going somewhere else.

I suppose we'll see but yeah the game should be getting more money to do a lot more. They are certainly making more.

[sincity1976]

Squadron, a more complex system than the joke that Trusts are, works in most ARR dungeons, which do not share the crappy design of ShB dungeons.

Not really. It uses a clunky command system and the NPCs are immune to the mechanics. Trusts are much better then Squadrons in my opinion.

The classic dungeons are fun. I wouldn't say better. The boss mechanics in new dungeons are much more intense then the classic ones. There are also a lot of misses in classic. Grabbing a sandwich while the tank blows up the bomb next to the boss, killing a red crystal connected to a purple line, turning off lanterns or plugging sewers, etc. It isn't exactly Dark Souls difficulty or Zelda creativity. And it's trivial after you have run it a few times, and frustrating when you have to relive the learning with new players.

Sure, difficulty in general might be a bit low, and as I said a hard mode should be in the works, but adding more gimicks to navigate hampers accessibility and systems like Trusts. In my opinion anyway. To each their own.

[RobynDaBank]

Trusts appear super clever, but there's an easy pattern to them. Whenever you engage a boss it seems there's set movements and actions they do each time. At the first boss of Amaurot for some reason, every time one person will die. I was a healer when I did it and would resurrect them - and they would fail to perform the ongoing mechanic because when they died, the chain of movement was interrupted and now they can't do anything about it. They resume being "normal" once the mechanic ends only. I don't remember right now but there was a DPS check to that boss as well which made resurrecting them almost necessary.

I know it sounds convoluted, but imagine you're doing King Behemoth with 3 others. One of them - most likely a DD - always dies to something right before you have to hide for his one-shot, and that's also the same moment Behemoth began casting it too. You are the healer and by instinct, you send out a resurrection to the dead person. They are alive when the cast is still going, but for some reason don't budge from their spot. They might be damaging an add, damaging Behemoth, anything but doing the movement to hide behind a rock. That's a Trust member.

Of course you could learn to work around them and it seems in Endwalker they will be dumbed down some more on purpose. But it's very bad habits. There's a reason dungeons seem to be built around them. They're a great idea but are deliberately put down so that they don't overshadow doing content with living, breathing people.

I guess they at least move for mechanics, which Squads don't seem to do at all. So true, relatively speaking Trusts are better.

[Larirawiel]

Dungeons have become linear corridors where the trash are meaningless and mechanics are regurgitated over and over again. There are always a few flourishes that make the dungeon feel exciting and fresh, but these are always visual: the whale ride in Anyder; the dragon ride in Pagl'than; the vibrant colors in the lava cave in Matoya's Relict. None of these are gameplay elements.

Jepp. This is one thing i do not like in FF14: the dungeon design. It is always a big linear corridor with three arenas in it. You know one dungeon then you know them all.

They could copy the dungeon design from WoW classic. The dungeons there felt way more organic and natural. But they were also bigger.

Cheers

[Warlyx]

the issue is that tons of dungeons are 1 time thing , 2-3 at best if u like to run alts or level trusts...

lvl X1-X9 are dead , only cap dungeons matter and for that patch cycle then got relegated to a huge roulette....2 dungeons are added and u run that for 3 months...

Dungeons in FFXIV should be EXPANDED but devs think otherwise sadly because 4 man cant be hard...boooh

ppl are hungry for 4 man content that matters.

And who doesnt love huge pulls and blast away , once u are raiding , u barely use AoE skills...and thats too bad.

they can create dungeons that have multiple paths and the one is randomized , add some jumping here and there , more TRAPS please, easy puzzles that make 4 players work togheter because if 1 player can solve its not fun .there are tons of options

having to step in a spot , light something , move blocks in order , water puzzles , rails ,2 players 1 side 2 on the other to open a door , FFXIV has the engine and tech to make those

while the first 10 times is fun , then not and i agree with that , it makes ppl even talk to each other (gasp) , stop the walll to wall and take a breath , instead of rush ahead for more pulls / bosses.

I dont want max ilvl gear from 4 mans it wouldnt make sense , but glamour rewards ,some gil , minions, mounts , hell the whole new pvp system would have been amazing as dungeon pve system if it looks like a path...that can be expanded.

get 3 friends/lsmates and do some dungeons for fun, and get rewarded for it , tomes that matter have cap and nowdays is fater to run a hunt train than repeat the DR expert (btw is even a roulette with just 2 dungeons?)

[iheartlove42]

This is in a way a good thing. The reason WoW fell to FFXIV this year is that the devs of WoW has for years been catering to Mythic raiders at the expense of the rest of its original player base and all other content including community content. As soon as a new patch gets released in that game, all previous content gets immediately made obsolete and nobody wants to play it anymore. FFXIV is more focused on story telling and community content that makes the world feel alive. On my server all the starting cities are packed full of people instead of ghost towns, since people don't feel the need to just sit in Eulmore all day or to only login during raid night or to tick some boxes so they can raid. I prefer the pretty looking dungeons to what WoW's had in recent years, thanks.

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

Trusts appear super clever, but there's an easy pattern to them. Whenever you engage a boss it seems there's set movements and actions they do each time. At the first boss of Amaurot for some reason, every time one person will die. I was a healer when I did it and would resurrect them - and they would fail to perform the ongoing mechanic because when they died, the chain of movement was interrupted and now they can't do anything about it. They resume being "normal" once the mechanic ends only. I don't remember right now but there was a DPS check to that boss as well which made resurrecting them almost necessary.

You don’t even need to get to the bosses to see how flawed their script are. Just start any dungeons with them, preferably as a tank or healer. Do a wall pull. The moment multiple trash pack start casting AoEs in succession then we’ll easily notice how these Trust AI do not do a good job with avoiding the subsequent ones. They will move out from the first AoE just fine, but anything that’s cast few seconds after that first AoE doesn’t seem to ‘register’. So yes, they will stand in the bads cause it’s not within the first AoE’s danger zone. Or if you interrupt/stun the mob from casting the AoE, they make no effort to adjust to this turn of event (i.e. continue attacking) and just stand still as if the AoE actually goes off. This is why Amaurot’s first boss is a bane to their existence half of the time.

[Kaurhz]

snip.

Whilst I don't necessarily disagree with the idea of this. I just have concerns about practicality. The inevitable result is that people will always go for the most efficient route of completing a dungeon. If people don't need the explore something, then they will rarely bother to do such. I can pretty much use Haukke Manor as a feeble example of this. You had some areas that you didn't need to explore, but exploring them would open up the avenue for some good drops including the Manor Varnish and Fine Wax. When it actually dropped from those dungeons. Yet people would ignore it despite the fact it would only add a minute at most to the dungeon. People will always avoid what they don't need to do. Such things work well on paper, but in execution will go largely ignored by people if they don't need to do it.

Something like this, with heavy interaction potential would be suited to the Gold Saucer to be frank. When you run a dungeon once or twice, it's great. Beyond that it's inconvenient. Outside of this the only way I see it working is if it becomes exclusively premade content strictly for a group of friends. - Incorporating something like this into the duty finder with random folk and something that gets put into the duty roulette will only lead people to moaning (Assuming they would ever make creativity and innovative dungeons the norm). People already cry with something as meek The Thousand Maws of Toto-Rak, Aurum Vale and Amaurot, let alone where they bother to be creative.

[iheartlove42]

Whilst I don't necessarily disagree with the idea of this. I just have concerns about practicality. The inevitable result is that people will always go for the most efficient route of completing a dungeon. If people don't need the explore something, then they will rarely bother to do such. I can pretty much use Haukke Manor as a feeble example of this. You had some areas that you didn't need to explore, but exploring them would open up the avenue for some good drops including the Manor Varnish and Fine Wax. When it actually dropped from those dungeons. Yet people would ignore it despite the fact it would only add a minute at most to the dungeon. People will always avoid what they don't need to do. Such things work well on paper, but in execution will go largely ignored by people if they don't need to do it.

Something like this, with heavy interaction potential would be suited to the Gold Saucer to be frank. When you run a dungeon once or twice, it's great. Beyond that it's inconvenient. Outside of this the only way I see it working is if it becomes exclusively premade content strictly for a group of friends. - Incorporating something like this into the duty finder with random folk and something that gets put into the duty roulette will only lead people to moaning (Assuming they would ever make creativity and innovative dungeons the norm). People already cry with something as meek The Thousand Maws of Toto-Rak, Aurum Vale and Amaurot, let alone where they bother to be creative.

Yea I completely agree with this. Dungeons with crazy secrets and kooky mechanics can be fun sure, but not when you're doing your Roulette. These things are best relegated to the Gold Saucer where it's a little less serious and I potentially can spend free time there if I choose.

Believe it or not folks, some of the people playing this game have lives outside of it and don't want to have to treat it as a second job. If you're into a video game being a second job you can certainly treat FF14 that way but don't try to make the devs force that on the rest of us. If you absolutely wanna play an MMO that's a second job there's a ton of Korean MMO's out there, and if those are not sadistic enough for your masochist tastes then there's Eve Online: Excel Spreadsheets The Multiplayer Game.