Do you guys want a bad community?

[Rockne]

Pokemon.

This pretty much sums up my thoughts.

[Silvyaniss]

SE is too blame for this also if they wouldn't of released such a broken game some of these problems would go away.
Unfortunately we have to deal with these open forums and all the negativity, trolling, and other things going on here.
SE should learn from this I don't know why you guys open threads like this it's not like you haven't visited other game forums in the past, yes you will still have negativity and attacking each other in other forums where the games launched ok. But when you have a game this broken released it's like adding fuel to a flame all I can say is " too bad"

[Malakhim]

Hey gais, wut's going on in this thread?

More relevant, I never thought the FFXI community was as amazing as people like to let on, and were just as if not more so elitist as other MMOs. Of course I never made it to all the end-game stuff in most other MMOs as my interest usually petered off before then, so what do I know?

[trinta]

I agree with Malakhim.

President of the "I Refuse to Unlock NIN Club" here.

[ShinChuck]

Hey gais, wut's going on in this thread?

More relevant, I never thought the FFXI community was as amazing as people like to let on, and were just as if not more so elitist as other MMOs. Of course I never made it to all the end-game stuff in most other MMOs as my interest usually petered off before then, so what do I know?

This. And yes, I did XI endgame, and still play. It always had a gated community sort of mentality. You're everyone's best friend, until you deviate from the community standards and dared some originality (subbing the aforementioned /NIN [and various other job combinations that were MUSTS], or putting a pink plastic flamingo on your lawn), then you were a moron and/or didn't care about the community.

XIV seems roughly on par for that course.

[Abriael]

because there are people that wants to see this game become a better game.

i enjoys this game and still plays it daily but still doesnt hide the fact that its not a game that can compete with incoming MMOs (short form : this game still sucks.)

And surely you don't think that the continuous and gratuitous use of inflamatory and intentionally hyperbolic, not to mention completely uncostructive terms and attacks will help making a better game? because In that case I see a quite impressive amount of delusion here.

@Shinchuck: when "mainstream" elements, as you call them will guarantee (or even support) any kind of long lasting success in the post-wow MMORPG market, your signature will have any validity

For now history established that "going mainstream" is the perfect way to destroy any kind of hope of success past the first few months.
If you didn't notice the market for that kind of games is full, and any new game that's launched trying to squish to gain some room in it, ends up a failure after a few months, no better than FFXIV.

So I would doubt that the ones pushing for the game to be just a copy of other games (that will always have more content simply because they have been launched earlier, and release expansions to pull back people periodically) "have SE's back" in any way. Quite the contrary.

This, of course, without mentioning the undeniable fact that considering some of the basic systems of this game valid and advocating that they need to be built upon instead of totally scrapped and replaced hardly means being a "fanboy".

But of course, having an inflammatory (and rather nearsighted) signature that splits people between "fanboys" and "haters" is another of those elements that don't really help the quality of the community and of the discussion in any way. Quite the contrary.

[Malakhim]

And surely you don't think that the continuous and gratuitous use of inflamatory and intentionally hyperbolic, not to mention completely uncostructive terms and attacks will help making a better game? because In that case I see a quite impressive amount of delusion here.

One could say that hyperbolic comments from any direction are bad. overly negative comments that don't amount to anything other than "wah wah shit game wah wah" aren't anything more than wastes of forum space and internet bandwidth, while overly positive comments just come off as delusional comments that have no basis in objective reality.

That being said, there's a world of difference between constructive criticism and outright trolling(and if any of you find having your posts being considered that way, then maybe you should rethink your posting style).

[ShinChuck]

And surely you don't think that the continuous and gratuitous use of inflamatory and intentionally hyperbolic, not to mention completely uncostructive terms and attacks will help making a better game? because In that case I see a quite impressive amount of delusion here.

@Shinchuck: when "mainstream" elements, as you call them will guarantee (or even support) any kind of long lasting success in the post-wow MMORPG market, your signature will have any validity For now history established that "going mainstream" is the perfect way to destroy any kind of hope of success past the first few months. So I would doubt that the ones pushing for the game to be just a copy of other games (that will always have more content simply because they have been launched earlier, and release expansions to pull back people periodically) "have SE's back" in any way. Quite the contrary.
This, of course, without mentioning the undeniable fact that considering some of the basic systems of this game valid and advocating that they need to be built upon instead of totally scrapped and replaced harly means being a "fanboy".

But of course, having an inflammatory (and rather nearsighted) signature that splits people between "fanboys" and "haters" is another of those elements that don't really help the quality of the community and of the discussion in any way. Quite the contrary.

Now, we're both reasonable people, and we'll concede that certain popular aspects of MMOs are popular for a reason. Neither of us is so unreasonable as to say, like some extreme fanbots, that mainsteam = bad gameplay mechanic, or popular = automatically bad idea.

I said nothing about the definition of fanboy in my sig. You're responding to your own ideas and thoughts of what you think others consider a "fanboy." So I'm not sure what your point is, because it's rather unrelated to my lil siggy there.

We both can agree constructive criticism is the way to go, not simple "Yes Man" responses. So we're on the same page there, and we agree that's what SE needs to improve, rather than mindless fanboyism simply telling them their game is perfect.

Are you telling them their game is perfect? No? Then it's not directed at you. You'd agree that telling them there's absolutely nothing they could improve upon is bad? No? Alright then, your ninja edit is unnecessary, and we're on the same page. We both think coddling them is bad, and that constructive criticism is good.

Well, anyway, good talking to ya.

[viion]

What we talking about in this thread, im lost, elitisim?

[Abriael]

One could say that hyperbolic comments from any direction are bad. overly negative comments that don't amount to anything other than "wah wah shit game wah wah" aren't anything more than wastes of forum space and internet bandwidth, while overly positive comments just come off as delusional comments that have no basis in objective reality.

That's, of course, completely true, while my experience in official forums tells me that for basically every game bashing attempts that tend to blindlyattack the game in an inflamatory and uncostructive way a la "the game sucks!" are quite a lot more widespread of the pretty rare "the game is absolutely fantastic! Don't change a single bit!".
Actually, I'm quite sure I saw less than a couple people in this forum stating that the game is fantastic and should remain as it is. Ergo, I would say that the first category is, at the moment, a more present menace for the quality of discussion.

Now, we're both reasonable people, and we'll concede that certain popular aspects of MMOs are popular for a reason. Neither of us is so unreasonable as to say, like some extreme fanbots, that mainsteam = bad gameplay mechanic, or popular = automatically bad idea.

I said nothing about the definition of fanboy in my sig. You're responding to your own ideas and thoughts of what you think others consider a "fanboy." So I'm not sure what your point is, because it's rather unrelated to my lil siggy there.

We both can agree constructive criticism is the way to go, not simple "Yes Man" responses. So we're on the same page there, and we agree that's what SE needs to improve, rather than mindless fanboyism simply telling them their game is perfect.

Are you telling them their game is perfect? No? Then it's not directed at you. You'd agree that telling them there's absolutely nothing they could improve upon is bad? No? Alright then, your ninja edit is unnecessary, and we're on the same page. We both think coddling them is bad, and that constructive criticism is good.

Considering that, as said above, there's very, very few people in this forum (actually I would say almost no one, and I wouldn't be able to pinpoint even one off the top of my head) that say that the game is fantastic and nothing should change, that kind of signature is rather unrealistic and hyperbolic, ergo inflamatory. If you adress a group that doesn't exist, people will naturally consider a larger group in order to read your sgnature with any reflection in reality.

While some mainstream mechanics aren't necessarily bad, a radical steer towards the mainstream would simply make this game jump in a pool of sharks that fight for a market niche too small to support them all. That's why all the "wow/everquest/daoc clones" in the market so far simply sank. WoW holds most of the customerbase hostage with their level 85 characters, and no matter what SE does, it will always have more content, it will always release new expansions to act as a siren's song to call them back. So if "mainstream" is a demonstrated way to failure, innovation seems to be the only commercially sound way to pursue. Innovation doesn't mean that ALL of the mechanics need to be innovative, but a large percentage does.