I'm gonna say it. cause no one else will.

[Drkdays]

I get what you're saying. I do.


BUT

Healers DOOOOOO have dps abilities already. Several, actually. They can and do contribute, even though it was stated that it should never be considered necessary for success. It's even been stated many times that they are even better at doing damage than tanks. So this ability to push themselves to be better in the available windows of down time is already clearly there. Its just ...IRRITATING to read about people complaining about, essentially, how EASY and boring it is to do great dps while effortlessly healing like it's some huge problem.

That's why I feel like people really just don't know what it is they want. MORE CAKE!

[ty_taurus]

I get what you're saying. I do.


BUT

Healers DOOOOOO have dps abilities already. Several, actually. They can and do contribute, even though it was stated that it should never be considered necessary for success. It's even been stated many times that they are even better at doing damage than tanks. So this ability to push themselves to be better in the available windows of down time is already clearly there. Its just ...IRRITATING to read about people complaining about, essentially, how EASY and boring it is to do great dps while effortlessly healing like it's some huge problem.

That's why I feel like people really just don't know what it is they want. MORE CAKE!

Yes, because that's what I want in a video gaming experience: something that's easy and boring. I yearn to take time out of my day and pay money to bore myself with slow and uneventful gameplay.

Do you honestly not see what's wrong with that statement?

Also, I don't know how the topics on this forum could possibly be even more clear that we know exactly what we want.

I was trying to give the benefit of the doubt, but now I'm inclined to believe this is just more bait. I don't really know why there's a handful of people that just want to harass the people on here discussing valuable and important conversations. I totally get that this place is, in many ways, is really just an echo chamber, but the trolling is entirely unwarranted.

[Drkdays]

Yes, because that's what I want in a video gaming experience: something that's easy and boring. I yearn to take time out of my day and pay money to bore myself with slow and uneventful gameplay.

Do you honestly not see what's wrong with that statement?

Also, I don't know how the topics on this forum could possibly be even more clear that we know exactly what we want.

I was trying to give the benefit of the doubt, but now I'm inclined to believe this is just more bait. I don't really know why there's a handful of people that just want to harass the people on here discussing valuable and important conversations. I totally get that this place is, in many ways, is really just an echo chamber, but the trolling is entirely unwarranted.

Yes, clearly I'm trolling because I'm the only one who feels this way.

I was actually giving you the benefit of the doubt since, for a moment there, you seemed willing to actually talk. But then I continued to disagree with you and the truth came out. Pity.

[ty_taurus]

Yes, clearly I'm trolling because I'm the only one who feels this way.

I was actually giving you the benefit of the doubt since, for a moment there, you seemed willing to actually talk. But then I continued to disagree with you and the truth came out. Pity.

It has nothing to do with the stance you take and everything to do with how you communicate it. The community that stands on the "experienced" side of the argument has largely come to the conclusion that want we want is something that adds the depth and fun value without disrupting the easy and accessibility of the role for casual players, but you won't hear it. You don't want something that makes the role more fun for us without changing your ability to not worry about optimization. You want us to enjoy the role the way you do or not at all, and that, to me, doesn't sound like something any legitimate casual player would say.

There have been people that have brought up concerns about not wanting the role to become harder for incredibly valid reasons. Examples like "my brother has special needs," "I'm in my 60s now and its hard to keep up with DPS jobs," "I have joint problems in my hands that make it hard to maintain a rotation," are all things that I've heard and are completely reasonable things to want healing to stay simple and not require optimization which is exactly why the vast majority of us have been beating the dead horse over and over and over again that raising the skill floor is NOT what we want, and it is entirely possible to raise the skill ceiling without making a noticeable impact on the skill floor, or even making it easier for the casual audience to improve their optimization without changing how they will play the job.

Wanting SGE's Toxikon II for example to be DPS neutral with 2 casts of Dosis III changes nothing about how a casual player will play SGE, but will actually improve their DPS contribution because it means overusing E. Diagnosis will actually be less of a DPS loss for you while allowing experienced healers to optimize how they shield the party.

The suggestion I made above about adding in a Water spell actually makes it easier for casual players to dodge mechanics because it gives you a way to do a little extra damage without having to cast anything at all.

That said, I cannot, in good conscience, believe that someone actively wants a game to be boring so they can not play the game. If you want to just enjoy the scenery, then explore the overworld or use the Explorer mode that we've had for quite some time now to just explore dungeons for the fun of it. That is literally a mode added to the game for that very purpose. If you want to instead watch Netflix or talk on the phone with your friend, then go do those things instead. These are solutions that rational people understand without having to explain them, and I cannot bring myself to believe you don't have the sense to understand that. You are an intelligence, conscious person, and I have enough faith in your intelligence to view these as nothing more than an attempt at trolling and not a genuine stance you would possibly take.

[RobynDaBank]

VictoriaLuv ruined Viera for me.

I was trying to give the benefit of the doubt, but now I'm inclined to believe this is just more bait. I don't really know why there's a handful of people that just want to harass the people on here discussing valuable and important conversations. I totally get that this place is, in many ways, is really just an echo chamber, but the trolling is entirely unwarranted.

It's not a conversation when anyone with an opposing view - granted with some level of aggression (but honestly unparalleled to the aggression of the other side) - is told that they're baiting for inflammation and irritation. You acknowledged that the forums can become an echo chamber, but continue that preconception. Wording can be the difference between bait and a true opinion sometimes, it's true, but so can the poster's intent.

[ty_taurus]

VictoriaLuv ruined Viera for me.



It's not a conversation when anyone with an opposing view - granted with some level of aggression (but honestly unparalleled to the aggression of the other side) - is told that they're baiting for inflammation and irritation. You acknowledged that the forums can become an echo chamber, but continue that preconception. Wording can be the difference between bait and a true opinion sometimes, it's true, but so can the poster's intent.

There have been people that have brought up concerns about not wanting the role to become harder for incredibly valid reasons. Examples like "my brother has special needs," "I'm in my 60s now and its hard to keep up with DPS jobs," "I have joint problems in my hands that make it hard to maintain a rotation," are all things that I've heard and are completely reasonable things to want healing to stay simple and not require optimization which is exactly why the vast majority of us have been beating the dead horse over and over and over again that raising the skill floor is NOT what we want, and it is entirely possible to raise the skill ceiling without making a noticeable impact on the skill floor, or even making it easier for the casual audience to improve their optimization without changing how they will play the job.

There have actually been several great conversations with players that had an opposing view, but the difference is that we were able to find a healthy middle ground whereas there are players on here who's entire point is basically:

"I like it because it's boring, so why can't you?" Which just isn't something that you can debate about. And I also just have a very difficult time accepting that that's a real perspective that someone can have on a video game and not just someone verbally teabagging on players who are frustrated with a game's direction for the sake of being obnoxious. It's difficult to make that discernment between someone who's legitimately trolling and someone that is either poorly communicating their point or just has a very extreme opposing view.