On Novice Networks and Inappropriate Discourse

[Caurcas]

Hello Sirenian here and I'd just like to say our NN is not so horrible as is being depicted, yes it sometimes goes way off topic, other night economics somehow came up lol, but questions are asked and answered. I have gotten a great deal of help from NN and it was actually how I got to know the gm of the fc I joined.

To anyone going "omg see NN is bad get rid of it!" I would STRONGLY suggest you take what the op says with a huge pile of salt as they picked fights over nothing (like neir glams), slammed people for "terrible dps" (in low lvl dungeons btw) and called the server trash players.

There it is. You attack my character over opinions I shared in unrelated chatter between answering questions in novice network and accusing me of harrassment of players, which is false. I suppose it's because I break from the typical hivemind certain mentors have crafted for the server's network. I must be discredited and labelled "toxic", despite that the actual toxicity stems from this hivemind.

[Shibi]

...I must be discredited and labelled "toxic", despite that the actual toxicity stems from this hivemind.

Simple question: Have you ever discussed people's "terrible dps" in NN?

[SturmChurro]

I think it's more of a question if they were wrong in their (supposed) criticism, because I see nothing wrong with these opinions. In general.

[Vahlnir]

Hello Sirenian here and I'd just like to say our NN is not so horrible as is being depicted, yes it sometimes goes way off topic, other night economics somehow came up lol, but questions are asked and answered. I have gotten a great deal of help from NN and it was actually how I got to know the gm of the fc I joined.

To anyone going "omg see NN is bad get rid of it!" I would STRONGLY suggest you take what the op says with a huge pile of salt as they picked fights over nothing (like neir glams), slammed people for "terrible dps" (in low lvl dungeons btw) and called the server trash players.

In short NN is a tool and any tool can be misused, however imo Siren mentors are pretty good about not letting things get too out of hand.

If this is indeed true...the plot thickens.

There it is. You attack my character over opinions I shared in unrelated chatter between answering questions in novice network and accusing me of harrassment of players, which is false. I suppose it's because I break from the typical hivemind certain mentors have crafted for the server's network. I must be discredited and labelled "toxic", despite that the actual toxicity stems from this hivemind.

There was a mentor in my server's NN for a little while who did much of what Windfire described and more. They were a destructive force all their own. One thing I've noticed when it comes to toxic players is that most of them seem to believe that everyone is out to get them. Everyone else is being toxic and it is their fault for being part of some 'hivemind". You seem to think the same way. Now, I don't know you...but I do know patterns. Hopefully you are not part of this pattern though. I would love to be proven wrong. I'm pretty good at reading people though.

I think it's more of a question if they were wrong in their (supposed) criticism, because I see nothing wrong with these opinions. In general.

More often than not it isn't what people say, it is how they say it. Still, we don't know quite enough. We've got both sides saying they are in the wrong here. However, I've got my first impressions out of the way. Getting more players from Siren to reply would help though if they have experienced these events.

[Caurcas]

Simple question: Have you ever discussed people's "terrible dps" in NN?

No, as discussing such things is against ToS. What he is referring to is how in the NN I am very vocal in support of pushing for big pulls and pushing unconfident players toward that goal, as it is the expected endgame norm. In short I am just trying to prepare sprouts for endgame.

[SturmChurro]

No, as discussing such things is against ToS. What he is referring to is how in the NN I am a very vocal in support of pushing for big pulls and pushing unconfident players toward that goal, as it is the expected endgame norm. In short I am just trying to prepare sprouts for endgame.

Exactly! Far cry from irrelevent ERP in the NN. Just like ERP has no place in PF, it has no place in the NN, and the NN has no place in the game!

[SenorPatty]

Exactly! Far cry from irrelevent ERP in the NN. Just like ERP has no place in PF, it has no place in the NN, and the NN has no place in the game!

I like how no matter what, you want to see NN and/or mentor system die.

I'm not saying that you're wrong. Or right. You just make me literally laugh.

[SturmChurro]

I like how no matter what, you want to see NN and/or mentor system die.

I'm not saying that you're wrong. Or right. You just make me literally laugh.

It's for a good reason. The betterment of the game! We wouldn't have issues as seen discussed in this thread OR things like that (apparently) Aether notorious NN spammer. I just want to see this game flourish, and getting rid of mentorship, and the NN is a step to further achieving that goal.

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

It\\'s for a good reason. The betterment of the game! We wouldn\\'t have issues as seen discussed in this thread OR things like that (apparently) Aether notorious NN spammer. I just want to see this game flourish, and getting rid of mentorship, and the NN is a step to further achieving that goal.

Not that I’d blame you. To some extent, I share the same sentiment against the NN. Though before axing, I’d like to know if there’s any chance or other way to be exhausted in order to salvage the system. In concept it’s nice imho. The execution as of now is just highly ‘meh’.

[SenorPatty]

Not that I’d blame you. To some extent, I share the same sentiment against the NN. Though before axing, I’d like to know if there’s any chance or other way to be exhausted in order to salvage the system. In concept it’s nice imho. The execution as of now is just highly ‘meh’.

For NN in itself, SE just needs to slap maybe 1-2 absolutes and some guidelines. Like "absolutely no off-topic discussions", for instance. Guidelines can be the usual stuff like "keep discussions clear of profanities and illicit sibjects (whatever that entails)'.

As for the mentor system itself, kill the link between that and the mount and kill the roulette too. Re-label the roulette to something like "Masters Roulette" and transfer current mount progress to it. Masters will have different icons than mentors. Masters roulette can contain ex trials but the participants can only be made up of masters. Mentors would have a different roulette, ex trials completely absent and it would only be populated by minimum 1 mentor and only sprout/returners. Also, at the very least, have SE have a limited amount of mentors at any given time but make sure other people get a chance. Introduce these mentors to the community and let the latter explain who they are, what's their strong points in the game, etc. And finally, properly track these mentors when they interact with sprouts and/or returners, not just to protect the latter but also the former.

That's all I can think of at the time.