Death unto Dawn page up

[KizuyaKatogami]

I'm not sure what you mean? ShB and 5.3 are widely praised as the highest points in the story and yet the only deaths were the villains, who you fully expect to die. It rather proves my point, you don't need to kill people off for a story to be good and emotional.

I'm not saying "a character dying makes a story bad", that would be absurd, just that it isn't some metric you need to check off a list in order to be considered a good story.

Both end of ShB and 5.3 relied on random plot armor and plot holes to prevent character deaths (both involving graha). If you need to rely on random plot armor just to prevent a character from dying, that’s bad writing.

[JeanneOrnitier]

Both end of ShB and 5.3 relied on random plot armor and plot holes to prevent character deaths (both involving graha). If you need to rely on random plot armor just to prevent a character from dying, that’s bad writing.

The crystal memory transferrence had already been established prior, it didn't come out of nowhere. That's not plot armor.

[Theodric]

The crystal memory transferrence had already been established prior, it didn't come out of nowhere. That's not plot armor.

I'd argue that it is when it's consistently made out to be a big, risky affair stacked up on top of other big, risky affairs but none of the established limitations ever come into play on any meaningful level.

Personally I don't care for most of the characters that exist to fawn over the Warrior of Light. At the very least, I'd like to see G'raha injured and quietly retired. Much like Zenos, he's overstayed his welcome for me.

I have a feeling that's a significant amount of bias involved, at any rate. Very few people want their favourite characters to be killed off, injured or made to be wrong in any major capacity - and as such, so many settings and writers have effectively been held hostage by their fans.

I just want a return to the consequence levels of ARR and HW. That was the peak of the game's writing for me.

[Kesey]

\Personally I don't care for most of the characters that exist to fawn over the Warrior of Light. At the very least, I'd like to see G'raha injured and quietly retired. Much like Zenos, he's overstayed his welcome for me.

I agree 100% with G'raha. In fact, I'd take it a step further and say that his continued presence in the story behaving the way he does sets an example for players who do not know better to think that kind of behavior is okay. It's not. He's basically a creep who won the friend lottery because he was powerful. That kind of behavior is unhealthy and uncalled for. He needs to go.

[Mahoukenshi]

I agree 100% with G'raha. In fact, I'd take it a step further and say that his continued presence in the story behaving the way he does sets an example for players who do not know better to think that kind of behavior is okay. It's not. He's basically a creep who won the friend lottery because he was powerful. That kind of behavior is unhealthy and uncalled for. He needs to go.

This sounds really farfechted. I mean, sure, there are simple folks out there, but to take an example of NPC behavior and use it to communicate/behave around other players? This sounds veeery absurd to me. Those people may have other, more serious, underlying issues. Not because one NPC is extreme-fawning over the WoL. That's simple power fantasy setting.

I agree in general that some people, myself included, have double-standard in applying the "character x has overstayed their welcome". I wish it for Zenos but not for the Scions *shrugs*. One thing I never understood is the "Kill character x because I don't like them." I've seen it in other MMOs as well (GW2: Taimi and Braham) and most "reasoning" was just childish.

[Iscah]

I agree 100% with G'raha. In fact, I'd take it a step further and say that his continued presence in the story behaving the way he does sets an example for players who do not know better to think that kind of behavior is okay. It's not. He's basically a creep who won the friend lottery because he was powerful. That kind of behavior is unhealthy and uncalled for. He needs to go.

I don't see an issue with G'raha because my character seems to reciprocate the relationship. It's not just one-way him showering us with compliments while we remain disinterested.

Haurchefant, on the other hand, is downright creepy to us a few times - moreso in the Japanese script with the English downplaying it, but there's one bit in post-ARR where we actually look unsettled or scared by what he's saying to us. They seem to have backed away from that take on him but it still creeps me out every time I get a character up to that point in the story.

[Ceridwenae]

I don't see an issue with G'raha because my character seems to reciprocate the relationship. It's not just one-way him showering us with compliments while we remain disinterested.

Haurchefant, on the other hand, is downright creepy to us a few times -

For the longest time I thought Haurchefant was a serial killer. He creeped me out no end, reminded me of real life guys who have had me deeply unsettled in the past and I really wanted to keep far, far away from him. He became less creepy over time to the point I was not happy when he died, but I have no doubt in another life his tale was quite a nefarious one.

Conversely, I've never thought G'raha was a serial killer and my daughter adores him so he has a pass for now. If he ever upsets her, however, I'm coming for him.



As for Death unto Dawn, part of my brain wants us, the WoL/D, to die. Sort of. But I suspect it's likely more lateral than literal and I'm not currently invested one way or another.

[Lauront]

I agree 100% with G'raha. In fact, I'd take it a step further and say that his continued presence in the story behaving the way he does sets an example for players who do not know better to think that kind of behavior is okay. It's not. He's basically a creep who won the friend lottery because he was powerful. That kind of behavior is unhealthy and uncalled for. He needs to go.

The way you describe him there reminds me of Zenos for a moment.