FF14 is not made for hardcore players.

[Goji1639]

It is a shame that the only even moderately challenging content is 8+ players. As it stands if you don't have 7+ people to who are all willing to work around each others schedules you have no reason to explore whatever gameplay depth this game might have. I'd get WAY more into this game if there were significant solo or small group progression content.

I guess it's not that big of a deal, though. I play a lot of other games that give me my fix of challenging/engaging gameplay. This game's niche is being a pretty, vibrant world with content that doesn't require or ask for any effort. It's the only game I really have where I can make real progress even at endgame while not paying attention, lol, so it's the perfect game to play at work.

It does kind of annoy me when people try to get all whiney or tryhard regarding roulettes on these forums, though. Everyone knows this is the game where effort doesn't really make a difference, so why do you even play this game? If you're going to be like that then find an actual difficult game to play; don't try to be the toughest guy at the kids table, it's just lame.

[ReynTime]

So it's funny, because what we consider hardcore is only savage and ultimate as the real content. I tried to find an analogy for how we view extremes. And the closest thing I can compare it for you is.. An extreme for us is like a fate to you and ultimate is an extreme. The spread of difficulty between those two are way too far apart that I wouldn't consider it even close to hardcore.

Here's a little more refrence. It took me and a group of friends 1 hr to clear an Extreme blind. It took about 72 hrs to clear ultimate with guides. This doesnt make ultimate 72x harder, but you can get what I mean.

If we take out extremes, we have only 14 fights in 2 years. And usually the 4 fights in a tier are cleared in at most 2/3 weeks. So in total, we got 21 weeks in 2 years for proggression. Thats not even 1/4 of the expansion time. Our solution would be adding 1 more ultimate in the expansion and we would be content. But as it is now, the game during the content droughts. The wait between 2 tiers is always the worst feeling in the game with nothing in between.

This is probably gonna sound really dumb, but I always viewed extremes as "midcore". Like, it's not necessarily hardcore, but it's challenging enough for players who aren't casuals but also don't want to dedicate the amount of effort savage and ultimate require. Like, the level of challenge I'd expect from a single player RPG as opposed to the safe roller coaster ride that the MSQ duties offer.

And that, from my PoV, is something this game is lacking more than anything.

Speaking as someone who started playing in 2.3, I used to have the impression that there was a small gap in difficulty between MSQ dungeons and "hard mode"/"extra" dungeons until Stormblood happened. After that came Normal Raids, again until Stormblood happened and turned them into what are essentially more Trials (not that the non-savage raids became easier, I don't think they did, but they're just trials, no mini-dungeon or gauntlet turns anymore...). After that came Extremes, which thankfully are still a thing. And beyond that, Savage then Ultimate.
But the gap between extreme and savage is a lot bigger than expert roulette -> endgame extreme. I'm sure many will disagree but I feel like in this game the endgame focus is always either on very casual content or very hardcore content. If you're not big on either you're left with grinding the same few extremes over and over.

I suppose CLL and DR count as "midcore", but the problem is Bozja also attracts a lot of casual players. Some which don't want to do their job basics well and make the experience super frustrating. Which is why me, personally, I think doing alliance-sized dungeons as midcore challenges was a terrible idea. Coordinating 30+ players, half which learned in their previous 79 levels and 100+ hours up til that point that the game doesn't punish them for not putting minimal effort. Because at the present XIV does a very poor job at teaching players to be prepared for content that doesn't hold their hand. But I digress. The point I want to make is just that there is a whole tier of players in between "casual" and "hardcore" that don't have much beyond extreme trials.

[Sathona]

This is probably gonna sound really dumb, but I always viewed extremes as "midcore". Like, it's not necessarily hardcore, but it's challenging enough for players who aren't casuals but also don't want to dedicate the amount of effort savage and ultimate require. Like, the level of challenge I'd expect from a single player RPG as opposed to the safe roller coaster ride that the MSQ duties offer.

And that, from my PoV, is something this game is lacking more than anything.

I consider Savage/Extreme midcore cause Savage is something anyone can do with effort, if u exclude the day 1 sweats.
Ultimate is a different toxicfest all together /sweat

[Themarvin]

Definition of hardcore has nothing to do with Savage or Ultimates or Extremes.

If you only play for these 3 things, you are considered a casual in my eyes, hardcore is digging it all, not just a little niche part of the game, reaction time can be accounted for, experience says it all and can use that to lead those few disciplined youngsters that do exist.

[Doozer]

I'm still hoping for a Duty Roulette min ilvl. These are fun.

I don't bother with most "hardcore" content because I'm not interested in the incentives or dealing with trying to group with strangers in PF, so a min ilevel roulette actually sounds pretty fun. I miss the days when stuff like Labyrinth of the Ancients, Syrcus Tower, etc. actually had mechanics done instead of just facerolling until the boss dies or you die from refusing to move out of AoEs.

Though the point of roulettes is to fill empty slots so others can complete duties, so having it set to min ilevel would separate it away from the regular runs. They would probably have to make it a little different, like expressly state that it's a "challenge roulette" rather than what they're usually for.

[Y2K21]

Are we talking about hardcore in terms of content or in terms of commitment?

Because we could all make an argument that a lot of the people who focus on housing, gil farming, RPers, professions, etc. could be considered hardcore players based on the amount of time played rather than the content they play.

There are people who spend hours and hours to do each of these things rather than focus on Savage/Roulettes/Leveling/Ultimates etc.

[MPK]

People casually raid savage/ultimate all the time

[Edax]

People casually raid savage/ultimate all the time

It's only a video game.

[Penthea]

Goddamnit I thought this one was banned

God I feel like I jinxed it by being happy they were gone. The forums are going to get full of spite again because of these threads designed to trigger people. Wonderful.

[GrassCuttingAuRa]

In response to the OP, I don't consider myself a hardcore player at all, but I think even as a "casual player", you should at least try to learn whatever classes you play most frequently, especially in endgame content. I shouldn't need to tell tanks in Expert Roulettes to turn on tank stance, for example, or remind a White Mage in a Seat of Sacrifice party to use their Lilies. This isn't putting someone down for "not getting gud", this is just asking people to understand how to play the classes they choose to in endgame content as a courtesy to their party members.