Alliance raids have no business being a relic step.

[Doozer]

If a duty isn't popping because the duty finder can't find enough people, is it possible that it's because there's something wrong with the duty?
Perhaps the duty is dead because there's insufficient interest in the duty; the plurality of people don't want to do Ivalice and Mhach raids, for their own personal reasons.

Lots of people will only do something if there's loot at the end, no matter how fun or interesting it is. Why do you think they had to hotfix Bozja stuff? No one was doing Castrum except for the relic and there was never enough people. A lot of "gamers" will only do something for the incentive, not because it's fun. Oh also because the HW/SB/ShB raids aren't the total faceroll that the ARR ones are (not that they're hard, but some people would rather sleep through the raid), so they avoid it whenever possible.

I personally disagree with that way of playing, but that doesn't mean it isn't true.

[Titor]

I'm just kind of sad that there becomes a point in the relic line where bozja isn't relevant. I'd be happier if all the relic steps could be done -in- bozja/castrum/DR. But when it was like "go to these unrelated raids/fate areas" it was kind of strange.

[Avatre]

I'm just kind of sad that there becomes a point in the relic line where bozja isn't relevant. I'd be happier if all the relic steps could be done -in- bozja/castrum/DR. But when it was like "go to these unrelated raids/fate areas" it was kind of strange.

Technically, the Ivalice raids are connected, but I still agree it all should 100% be able to be done, at a much faster rate, inside Bozja rather than outside of it in older content.

[ForteNightshade]

I can get having a few rare rewards, but I don't understand why they're so stingy on everything else. Silver Coins just aren't enough of a reward to make it feel worth your while and have very limited use. You don't get mettle, tomes or exp and you get a pittance in fragments. Fragments especially I don't understand when the whole instance is designed around us using them, yet you can go an entire run and end up with none. We should be getting several per boss at the least.

I know we like to joke about glamour being the "true endgame" but Enix time and time again overestimate how much we care about it. This was a big reason Castrum died, because they honestly thought 500-1000 coins for a 495 glamour item would be enough to make us spam it 50 times.

I hate to be cynical, however I suspect it's because they know very little in the way of new content is coming. Therefore, they're arbitrarily trying to prolong the lifespan, especially for players who return to the game as Endwalker looms closer.

Ironically, I think such stinginess actually has the opposite effect. We're seeing that with just how many people won't use Essences/Lost Actions in DRN. No really incentive to when you'll have to farm boring trash in Bozja or throw heaps of gil at the MB. It really is quite baffling because they don't seem to care that things like endgame crafted gear is both readily available and easy to make. You'd think they would want to dump fragments on you as a way of screaming "TRY OUT THESE CRAZY BUILDS!" But that goes back my initial argument.

[Arkevorkhat]

I hate to be cynical, however I suspect it's because they know very little in the way of new content is coming. Therefore, they're arbitrarily trying to prolong the lifespan, especially for players who return to the game as Endwalker looms closer.

Honestly, I'd be inclined to say that such "cynicism" is warranted, after all, SE is responsible to their shareholders above all else. The issue is that they failed to account for the precedent they've set with previous content; generally, the rewards from a duty are fairly closely tied to the difficulty of that duty. I'd place DR at about the same difficulty level as Emerald Extreme, but where EmEX gave both a mount and semi-casual players' BiS weapons, DR gives some zhuzhed up Exarchic gear and an extremely rare chance at other rewards.

[Packetdancer]

Honestly, I'd be inclined to say that such "cynicism" is warranted, after all, SE is responsible to their shareholders above all else. The issue is that they failed to account for the precedent they've set with previous content; generally, the rewards from a duty are fairly closely tied to the difficulty of that duty. I'd place DR at about the same difficulty level as Emerald Extreme, but where EmEX gave both a mount and semi-casual players' BiS weapons, DR gives some zhuzhed up Exarchic gear and an extremely rare chance at other rewards.

Honestly, I've seen the 'rare' drops of one form or another in Delubrum more often than I have seen the mount drop in EmEx. I have won the hairstyle and three orchestrion rolls in Delubrum; I've seen the mount drop once in EmEx. Total.

(I rolled a 97. Someone else won it with a 98. I'm not salty, noooo, why do you ask?)

Doesn't meant the drop rate is good, mind you, but I'm not sure contrasting it with EmEx and saying EmEx has better loot tables is the direction I'd go with this one.

[wereotter]

First of all: You must be new here, so welcome. Apparently you never did a Heavensward or ARR relic if you're complaining that you have to do old, dead content in order to get your relic weapon completed. This was a lot of what earlier relic weapons were about.

Second: This is by design. It should be better now that they buffed drop rates within Bozja, but feedback from Stormblood's relic was people hated being forced to do Eureka as the only option to complete their relic weapons. So they took that feedback and allowed people who don't like exploratory content an option to still complete a weapon. You have choices, you have the choice for every step except for one (that's more of a side quest to the relic as opposed to an actual relic quest) being able to be completed within Bozja.

Ironically this is the first thread I've seen that there's not ENOUGH Bozja for the relic (drop rates within Bozja sure) rather than people complaining that after the initial steps, people thought they were mislead and being forced to do TOO MUCh Bojza. But guess you can't ever satisfy everyone...

[Arkevorkhat]

Honestly, I've seen the 'rare' drops of one form or another in Delubrum more often than I have seen the mount drop in EmEx. I have won the hairstyle and three orchestrion rolls in Delubrum; I've seen the mount drop once in EmEx. Total.

(I rolled a 97. Someone else won it with a 98. I'm not salty, noooo, why do you ask?)

Doesn't meant the drop rate is good, mind you, but I'm not sure contrasting it with EmEx and saying EmEx has better loot tables is the direction I'd go with this one.

The issue with that is that in EmEX, a single drop is only being shared by 8 people at most. In contrast, DR is sharing a comparably rare drop with 24 people, giving any single person a 3x lower chance of getting the item.

[Arkevorkhat]

First of all: You must be new here, so welcome. Apparently you never did a Heavensward or ARR relic if you're complaining that you have to do old, dead content in order to get your relic weapon completed. This was a lot of what earlier relic weapons were about.

Second: This is by design. It should be better now that they buffed drop rates within Bozja, but feedback from Stormblood's relic was people hated being forced to do Eureka as the only option to complete their relic weapons. So they took that feedback and allowed people who don't like exploratory content an option to still complete a weapon. You have choices, you have the choice for every step except for one (that's more of a side quest to the relic as opposed to an actual relic quest) being able to be completed within Bozja.

Ironically this is the first thread I've seen that there's not ENOUGH Bozja for the relic (drop rates within Bozja sure) rather than people complaining that after the initial steps, people thought they were mislead and being forced to do TOO MUCh Bojza. But guess you can't ever satisfy everyone...

First, cut the condescension, I don't care that you suffered through a Zodiac/Anima weapon, one would expect that the dev team would learn from their past mistakes.
Second, how selfish can you be that you think "people hated eureka" is a valid response to "Drop rates between Bozja and old content should be such that there is a comparable time investment between the two methods"?
Third, yes, we were mislead, all available first-party resources talked about the various methods of attaining progression with this relic as though they were basically comparable, when in reality, Bozja was far and away the worse method for attaining these items. People complained about wanting to be able to do Eureka weapons outside of Eureka, and so what we got was a situation where we've got the ShB equivalent to the Eureka weapons, where it's better to only ever touch Bozja to get rank 10 and clear Castrum and DR once, then go do the entire weapon without Bozja.

People who like the old content are being told "oh precious, you didn't like Eureka, here, you can do this in half the time by only doing the bare minimum possible amount of Bozja."

[Packetdancer]

The issue with that is that in EmEX, a single drop is only being shared by 8 people at most. In contrast, DR is sharing a comparably rare drop with 24 people, giving any single person a 3x lower chance of getting the item.

While you're correct on EmEx, I actually don't think the loot table is shared in Delubrum; since the chests are personal spoils you don't need to roll on, I suspect the contents of the chest are determined without regards to the contents of someone else's chest.