Battle Command Design -PLEASE FIX IT

[Elexia]

A controller makes you slower. Even though you say you have 'no problem', using a controller is quite a bit slower than hitting keys.

Actually it takes quicker reflexes to use a controller..both takes some sort of dexerity to use properly. If anything you could say using a keyboard and mouse makes you slower, since it depends on the person in general.

Macro system with a PS2/3/360 controller = hit triggers/shoulder buttons hit your confirm key, bam macro fires.

[Rhomagus]

To be honest I always used a controller for XI.

I also never tried to cast a spell through the menu system as there were too many to choose from.

I used macros because they were easier to manipulate.

In XIV I never use macros because the basic UI structure operates in the same way. I'm okay with giving players the option to go through a layered menu system, but I wouldn't see the rationality in taking the current easier to use one away.

In the current system there are fewer button presses involved when using a controller. Even less if they'd allow you to go into active mode just by confirming a selection on an attackable mob. I don't agree with the Select target > Select target to bring up action bar > select target again to start attacking method they currently have. I understand it's implementation but give us the option to skip one of those steps. To this day it still trips me up when I'm facing a mob but I'm hovered over an ability I don't want to use yet, and I'm still not attacking the mob even though I'm in active mode. It's annoying.

The basic structure of the system is great for controllers in my opinion. Just give us the option to change it.

[Zezlar]

I would love a more menu based battle system. I too am not a fan of this action bar stuff.

[TypeZ]

I'm having trouble understanding why no steps have been taken to adjust the UI (if that's what it would be considered) for Battle Commands, such as weapon skills, engaging in battle, initiating a ranged attack, choosing and casting spells, etc.

From the day FFs were released, they've ALWAYS been "console-based" games (maybe a handheld here and there too). And as far as I know, they've ALL clung to the same basic layout of the "Attack; Magic; Ability; Item" categorial design. So, why would they embrace a design that makes it so difficult for controller-using players (future console players) to access and use their battle commands.

I understand that developer's like "change," but this icon/slot crap is just awful. At the very least, I want to see the choice* to go back to the traditional "Attack; Magic; Ability; Item" design. I want a simple, categorized design of my battle commands, not some ridiculous, "oooo pretty," 40-mile-long bar of icons that rely, solely, on picture association to determine what command I would like to access or execute.

Does anyone else feel this way? or even know what I'm talking about? lol

Yeah man, am with u all the way. if this doesn't change am quitting. I know nobody really care. but eventually the game will die if they keep this UI.

[Rydin]

Correct.... Final Fantasy has always been fairly menu based....
However...
In an offline game you only have to worry about 1 players perspective.
You can completely pause combat
Eden or Knights of the Round can take forever and thats ok....
Menu based combat works for slower combat or combat that can be paused
But in a game like this... i don't know that it would be the best option
The current UI doesn't really work either.

The main problem (and every other problem this game has) can be attributed to the fact that the game was rushed
2 different UI's should have been made to accommodate both keyboard and mouse and also Gamepads
Instead we have one that pleases neither crowd

Keyboard and mouse users:
-tend to like hot keys
-Like doing most or all keyboard commands with their left hand so the right hand doesn't constantly have to alternate between the mouse and the keyboard
-Dont like to scroll through rows of actions yet want to see all cooldown timers

Controller users:
-Have less buttons to work with
-Don't want to have to "D-pad" through tons of abilities
-want to have all abilities be as few buttons presses away as possible
-Want no reasons to have to touch the mouse OR the keyboard

I don't know what a Keyboard and mouse user interface should be

But as far as gamepads.... (Which I use)
A cool interface idea would be 3D radials stacked so you could see them all.....
and each radial being a different category.. Magic, Abilities, Weaponskills
Weaponskills that would come next in a combo have that purple outline glow.. and conditional abilities (like War Drum, Feint or Haymaker) have a Yellow outline glow when the can be used
the radials could even encircle the character and each icon would look like a floating glyph

I don't know... just an idea...

[Brigandier]

Keyboard and mouse users:
-tend to like hot keys
-Like doing most or all keyboard commands with their left hand so the right hand doesn't constantly have to alternate between the mouse and the keyboard
-Dont like to scroll through rows of actions yet want to see all cooldown timers

Bolded what needs emphasis above. While keyboard/mouse players want this, it's very important for gamepad users. Since gamepads can be inherently slower to changing situations, gamepad players have to preempt a lot of actions. Flipping between 3 pages of icons to monitor cooldowns is a constant hassle I deal with, and my resolution is high enough to easily have all 3 visible at one time. Also as a gamepad user it's not uncommon for me to have my macro bar open and ready to go, so having it cover critical information is just retarded.

[Rydin]

Bolded what needs emphasis above. While keyboard/mouse players want this, it's very important for gamepad users. Since gamepads can be inherently slower to changing situations, gamepad players have to preempt a lot of actions. Flipping between 3 pages of icons to monitor cooldowns is a constant hassle I deal with, and my resolution is high enough to easily have all 3 visible at one time. Also as a gamepad user it's not uncommon for me to have my macro bar open and ready to go, so having it cover critical information is just retarded.

I agree... Although I don't use battle macros... Its a personal preference but they make me feel detached from combat
Perhaps one long bar going across the bottom that shows all of your actions and cooldowns

OR... how about is:
a bar somewhere that only shows abilities that are on a cooldown and their timers... so once an ability is able to be used, it is no longer there

I really just dont want to get to a point where screens look like this:

or this


I want to see the beautiful game... not a bunch of Icons...
I want to feel like Im in Eorzea (not in an RP kind of way though)
and not have my screen look like a game of Magic: the Gathering

[Maxthunder]

I myself rather have the FFXI UI or drop down menus vs this bar crap. Now players say well FFXIV combat is faster, well in that respect it is, but in another respect there is also no strategy involved while level a job/class to 50 Even the end game (if it should even be called that at this point) has some strategy, but not enough. FFXIV combat needs to slow down a tad so that players have to use strategy to kill mobs instead of always zerging everything to death. Now along with the combat system the targeting system needs fixing as well. I myself have tried different things to get the targeting system to target the next mob after 1 has been killed but so far no luck, and it is very annoying.

[Rydin]

I myself rather have the FFXI UI or drop down menus vs this bar crap. Now players say well FFXIV combat is faster, well in that respect it is, but in another respect there is also no strategy involved while level a job/class to 50 Even the end game (if it should even be called that at this point) has some strategy, but not enough. FFXIV combat needs to slow down a tad so that players have to use strategy to kill mobs instead of always zerging everything to death. Now along with the combat system the targeting system needs fixing as well. I myself have tried different things to get the targeting system to target the next mob after 1 has been killed but so far no luck, and it is very annoying.

Slow isn't "synonymous" with "strategic"
Slow this game down and it becomes a slow Zerg as opposed to a fast zerg
For ways to actually add strategy.... there are a ton of threads in the forum on making Incaps and battle Regimen necessary parts of combat and making me yawn during battle isn't one of them.

[Brigandier]

I agree... Although I don't use battle macros... Its a personal preference but they make me feel detached from combat
Perhaps one long bar going across the bottom that shows all of your actions and cooldowns

OR... how about is:
a bar somewhere that only shows abilities that are on a cooldown and their timers... so once an ability is able to be used, it is no longer there

I really just dont want to get to a point where screens look like this:

or this


I want to see the beautiful game... not a bunch of Icons...
I want to feel like Im in Eorzea (not in an RP kind of way though)
and not have my screen look like a game of Magic: the Gathering

I lol'd. I think the current setup with cooldown timers being integrated into the icon works well and they should stay with that, or the small list of things on cooldown works as well (though might be problematic for people with little screen real estate). It occurs to me that if they do the 3 row icon w/cooldowns, that it might be a bit better for PS3 users as well (since some users may be using 720p or less, and text is kinda shoddy at lower resolutions).