FFXIV and SqEnix vs WoW and Blizzard - My Perspective

[Deceptus]

It's unfortunate that a place for first impressions is on par with WoW for filthy talk, but that's also irrelevant to the point.
Where it happens doesn't give it any more or less weight in a flat comparison like this.
14 has a toxic novice network.
WoW has a toxic community.
In fact, that there is a big thread going on now about cleaning up the novice network (the one you referenced) just highlights the differences between these communities.

And in those threads it's one person creating multiple toons to harass people.

Just like a certain someone would use multiple toons to necro old threads here on the forums. Wouldn't surprise me at all if they were the same person (just an opinion, can't back it up)

The fact that a billion dollar company refuses to police either is insane to me.

The novice network is a unique situation because it allows trial accounts to participate. So, if you want to post nasty stuff you make a free account... If that account gets banned you make another one... and another one... and so on.

And you stop that with an IP ban. Should be a last resort but when you have a person constantly blatantly flaunting the rules (my limit would be more than 3 times with an egregious offense) something needs to be done.

[Reap00]

That’s one particular troll and in all honesty there’s a huge chance he came from WoW.

If you think final fantasy 14 has a similar problem with racism, sexism and homophobia to what WoW definetly had back when I played it, then you’re playing different games to me.

XIV community is better than WoW in ever conceivable way. I tried WoW recently. That game is in very sorry shape and the community is bottom of the barrel.

[Vahlnir]

Bull.

The FFXIV developers have had their moments of extreme stubbornness as well.

In 2.0 The Developers told us we were "playing warrior wrong" despite multiple points of feedback. It took an uproar to get them sorted out.
In 3.0 The Developers told us we were "Playing Bard (aka Bow Mage) wrong" despite multiple points of feedback showing casting made DPS WORSE.
In 4.0 tanks were a mess, especially [DARK ARTS] Dark [DARK ARTS] Knights [DARK ARTS]. They had the worst mitigation of any tank. outside of TBN. It was being used as a crutch.
In 5.0 Healers have been and are still an absolute disaster.

Meanwhile Monk has almost always been in a bad spot.

I'm probably forgetting a major thing or 3 over the years.

Lets not pretend that the FFXIV developers are infallible, white knight them, or keep rose colored glasses on.

Praise them when they do right, and call them out respectfully when they don't.

And you can't say that "Blizz does nothing" when you look at patch notes and see entire sheets of buffs and nerfs changing classes overnight. If anything, IMHO, Blizz listens to pressure too much. They definitely have their favorite specs they want to play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-4u6gn1r4U

For what it's worth I never said they were perfect. I'm also probably one of the first people to call them out on things I disagree with, and I'm very vocal about it. But if it's between the WoW devs and the FF XIV devs...I'd have to side with them any day of the week, even as I criticize what they do. You really don't know the situation in WoW, do you? They have their favorite specs, sure, but...that's just the tip of the iceberg. They "balance" the game and classes around what THEY want, not what the player wants. They don't really listen to anyone unless they are bleeding subs, and even then it's not a guarantee.

[ReynTime]

I haven't played WoW for longer than a month to compare, but XIV staff definitely doesn't listen to the playerbase outside Japan as often as people claim.
Between the healer, tank changes, state of bard, Bozja being a thing, MSQ-dungeon-only for patches, etc, I think the only complaints they really listen to are related to glamour and housing.

[Kes13a]

I haven't played WoW for longer than a month to compare, but XIV staff definitely doesn't listen to the playerbase outside Japan as often as people claim.
Between the healer, tank changes, state of bard, Bozja being a thing, MSQ-dungeon-only for patches, etc, I think the only complaints they really listen to are related to glamour and housing.

In all honesty, unless only 1 person is playing a game, the developers shouldnt be listening to everyone. Take suggestions, of course, see how those suggestions fit, definitely., but as for implementing changes from the player base... no. It would be a shortlived game that would be bleeding players and subscriptions like a severed artery. Listening to people in the forums is a good way to make a game for a select few. And those select few, while loyal, wont be enough to keep the lights on and the doors open. (Wildstar springs to mind about the dangers of listening to the "playerbase" for changes)

All that you can count on from a successful game company is that you agree generally with their direction and vision, and when you dont, move on. They are under zero obligation do listen, its their game and their money invested, we are just riding the bus. The WoW bus was going the wrong direction so I got off. This one is much more enjoyable

[eilhya]

my 2 cents...
I played WOW for 10 years, as a raider, and as a casual. ANd i played FF14 as a casual (3-4 months per year for 4 years). The problem is : in WOW, apart from raids and dungeons, and some daily quests/expeditions, there's nothing to do, really (crafting is now almost useless, the crafts are cheaper than the materials...). The leveling is just a mandatory step, that we have to get rid of (almost). The game is instance based (and it's ok, it's just good to know ^^). And competition. The dps and healing meters, the best timer (for dungeons), and the best ranking (Raider.io thank you !) and now the loots : in dungeons (M+), if the timer is good, you get more loots (it's a new rule since the last expansion 1 month ago). And now, it's more difficult to gear your toon, so to time you dungeon is really helpful. So it's worst than before ! And with the timers and everything, many players want to have the best class ( = meta) to finish the dungeon in time more easily. Not only in HL dungeons, but everywhere at every level. SOme players have to get rid of the class or specialization they like and have to take one of the meta specialization if they want to be picked. It's not fun at all, it's really stressful. SO the players are stressful, and become agressive and toxic.

I don't know how it is in FFXIV in raids, but as a casual player, i feel much more relaxed !

[Vahlnir]

I don't know how it is in FFXIV in raids, but as a casual player, i feel much more relaxed !

I spent my first few years of WoW raiding pretty regularly. At first with randoms, but eventually with a regular group. I'm a bit older now and not really seeking that rush. I stopped raiding in WoW with the Mists of Pandaria expansion because my guild fell apart (I got along with my guild leader pretty well, to this day I wonder what happened to them), and picked up Normal raiding a bit again with Legion. They went and made them less accessible again in BfA, so I went back to doing other things. BfA killed a lot of my love for the game. Shadowlands didn't do it any favors either, so I quit not even 2 weeks into the latest expansion so I could focus on FF XIV. It's nice being able to progress my character and make some gil mostly at my own pace. It truly is a more relaxing experience. As far as raids go, Normal is enough for me, though I will return to do past Savage content when the level cap is raised again to get some things. It's not that I'm incapable of Savage raiding when it's current. It's that i don't want to. lol

[Puremallace]

XIV community is better than WoW in ever conceivable way. I tried WoW recently. That game is in very sorry shape and the community is bottom of the barrel.

The WoW community is constantly angry because of Blizzard. There are very few decisions coming from Blizzard that even resemble common sense. From loot being extremely rare screwing casuals with no alternatives paths...classes just being in a horrible spot with no attempts to fix them....aoe caps.....last minute nerfs/buffs...systems on top of systems combined with RNG...RNG loot with secondary and tertiary stats that make no sense.... crafting professions that serve no purpose

In WoW the content is chasing the gear and not overcoming the content but in FF14 the gear is not heavily gated so people try other classes and raid content is actually a choice you choose to do for fun.

No matter how much time passes I will NEVER understand why Blizzard spends two years fixing something just to smash it to pieces in the next expansion or make it completely irrelevant. I could not imagine being a developer at that company.

[Reyketi]

And you stop that with an IP ban.

It takes me 5 seconds to change my IP, and start playing again.

Best Wishes

-Reyketi

[Ayuhra]

The WoW community is constantly angry because of Blizzard. There are very few decisions coming from Blizzard that even resemble common sense. From loot being extremely rare screwing casuals with no alternatives paths...classes just being in a horrible spot with no attempts to fix them....aoe caps.....last minute nerfs/buffs...systems on top of systems combined with RNG...RNG loot with secondary and tertiary stats that make no sense.... crafting professions that serve no purpose

In WoW the content is chasing the gear and not overcoming the content but in FF14 the gear is not heavily gated so people try other classes and raid content is actually a choice you choose to do for fun.

No matter how much time passes I will NEVER understand why Blizzard spends two years fixing something just to smash it to pieces in the next expansion or make it completely irrelevant. I could not imagine being a developer at that company.

Blizzard's current problem in regards to WoW is Ion Hazzikostas.

I am not on the Ion hate train anywhere NEAR as much as most people who frequent forums seem to be but his problem is he really only caters the game to hardcore players.

That doesn't mean there is no easy content, mind you, or that things are inaccessible... It means that if you really want to get the most out of your experience you are going to feel yourself get pushed towards raiding. Everything you do in that game gives something that grants power, too, which means you feel you do things because the game wants you to instead of YOU wanting to do them... And you get stronger with the ultimate end goal of raiding.

Vanilla WoW was a bit "raid or die" but the raids were very easy. Getting a group was the only hard part. In Legion we got Mythic Dungeons but they mostly boil down to doing speed runs in order to get the best gear in a week which mostly people do for, you guessed it, raids.

Ion was the guild leader of the Elitist Jerks back when the game came out. Basically, he was the community's top theorycrafter and he made guides for builds and boss fights. Then he was recruited as a lead raid designer in late Burning Crusade. So the guy's whole WoW experience has been raid-centric. That he is particularly focused on the endgame progression systems and less interested things people might want to do just for fun isn't very surprising.

(To his credit though, he is a VERY GOOD raid designer. We can dunk on WoW all day but that is definitely an area it continues to be strong in)