The toxicity starting to happen.

[linayar]

Everything just comes down to communication, communication, communication.

Agreed, although sometimes people don't respond even when you do say something.

There could be several reasons why, but just in case they don't pay attention to chat, I sometimes wish there is an equivalent to raid warning in WoW to announce something in duty. (Although I guess it could be misused and probably overkill for a dungeon.)

[Hycinthus]

Agreed, although sometimes people don't respond even when you do say something.

There could be several reasons why, but just in case they don't pay attention to chat, I sometimes wish there is an equivalent to raid warning in WoW to announce something in duty. (Although I guess it could be misused and probably overkill for a dungeon.)

Even if they don’t respond, most likely they’ve read and they would be less likely to react to your actions in a toxic manner. In this way, everyone is helping each other to reduce toxicity borne out of misalignment of expectations. After all, the entire premise of this discussion is “you’re playing with others. Dont just play the way you want”. But how to do that properly if you guys dont communicate.

[Katie_Kitty]

So just because someone did it, discovered it and coined it. Now they're the only one to ever get that opportunity or to do it that way? FUCK THAT.

I mean, if you wanna make your own guides then by all means, but here's the thing: Your guide is probably gonna be bad unless it's exactly like the other guy's guide. Why do I say that? Because, until you can demonstrate higher ability on the job compared to the other guy, then there's zero reason to think your knowledge of the class surpasses theirs.

Hey, who knows? Maybe you're a gold-parsing god in training, maybe you'll discover all the secrets to playing your favorite class that nobody ever knew about. But you have to GET there first before anyone will take you seriously. And, honestly, every second it takes you to get there is another second where the people who are already masters of the job have a head start on you. And there's honestly no reason to even think there's anything for you to teach the world that it doesn't already know until the day it happens, sooo.. good luck, I guess?

[VenKitsune]

Ohh I don't know...let's see....

-new to dungeon
-new to role
-new to the game as a whole
-tanxiety
-undergeared
-getting used to new skills/rotation/keybinds
-'thin skin' aka, praying the other party members aren't jerks
-testing how the other party members perform

heck, even all of the above at once is an option. Tanking in itself may be mechanically easy, but clearly the great majority of players aren't willing to do it, more often than not, out of fear of the other players, not the content itself.



Point proven. This is exactly why tanking will always be, in every game ever, the least played role. Nothing encourages people more to try a role than being belittled and judged right from the get go.

While i cant say i disagree, being new to any given dungeon means diddly squat past level 50 - Dungeons are basically copy pastes of eachother and mob packs almost always do the same damage, there isnt patrols that can be avoided like in ARR dungeons, patrols that can also agro in to a current ongoing fight and screw you over and all manner of things. Every dungeon past level 50 is basically identical mechanically outside of bosses so going in to amaurot and saying "im new so i pull small" is a bit counterintuitive as you should know by then at every dungeon is the same damn thing.
Being new to the game or your role is also something that any given player shouldnt be past a certain point, if they still have no idea how to tank at lvl 80 because they used a jump potion, that's their problem and not their parties problem.

Being undergeared is generally not a big problem these days due to leveling dungeons having ilvl requirements and the fact that you can megapull with even the minimum ilvl gear for any given dungeon, provided the tank and healer know how to play their jobs decently.

Honestly i think it comes down to just...people need to learn to read their tooltips and be open to advice, but past level 50 they shouldnt expect to be coddled to or played around.

[Ursa_Vonfiebryd]

(Also, in terms of job performance, "your own play-style" just doesn't exist. There's a right way to play a class and then various degrees of "less right", a lot of which are perfectly viable if they're in the right ballpark. It's not particularly fun to hear, but it is also just a fact of the game's combat.)

There's an Optimized way to play and then there's everything else. I maintain that in standard content, the game is designed so that if you are the item level specified, and you do button-mash damage, you will likely clear in the allotted time, assuming you don't die to avoidable mechanics.

I also maintain that there's no 'official' way to play any job or class. Sure jobs are designed to work a certain way mechanics wise, but any 'rotations' are up to the player and indeed any rotations you learn are generally gotten from players who have done the math and thankfully shared the fruits of their labors. The game offers nothing save for mostly vague descriptions of what your skills do and nothing in the way of weaving those skills together.

This is a good description though, as I myself don't run fully optimized most of the time and willfully so. I feel there's a generally accepted way to play, which is a way that keeps your fellow players in mind, and a widely endured selfish way that is geared only to your own experience. I've seen this across the board from people using dungeons for a purely role-play experience to people who care only for their numbers and refuse to participate beyond that--even at the cost of the group or duty.

I think a lot of toxicity isn't over actual gameplay but rather expected gameplay. And some is just baffling (why be mean to lalafels? Honestly). I think the confusion is over finding the baseline between SJW defense and just blatant ridiculousness. XD

[Katie_Kitty]

(why be mean to lalafels? Honestly)

Never really understood this either. I think some people just do it to be cool, it's the "hip" thing right now.

[Haruka-Akemi]

FF 14 is like a group of friends playing DND in their moms basement. We all get along, for the most part, we all help each other out. Some of us get married in that basement to pixels, and some take that straight to the real altar.

But recently I have been seeing a lot of new players, I like new players. Shiny little creatures with that little tiny seedling. They come and announce "I am a new tank here" and that's amazing. I want to help you any way I can.

Then the healer states "Pull large, I got this." The tank continues to state they are uneasy pulling large amounts, they try, we wipe, I say slow down, take your time. The healer gets pissy, threatens to leave, I initiate the kick vote, it fails, he leaves.

Summary: Whats with the drama?

I come from ARR, when HW was new and shiny. I had my fair share of idiots, we all have. But when there's new people we should banding together to help them, not rush through because we can.

The other side of that coin is new players coming from other games "well this isn't so and so, so it sucks" Or you give them advice, I have little tanking experience, but one time the tank could not keep argo, I told him the particular skill to use (the one where spikes come up through the ground, spacing on the name) and he gets all snippy. "In wow this is how I played, it works more or less the same here, you just suck"

I'm sorry you entitled, spoiled little brat - but I am trying to help you be a better player.

Christ. What is happening? From the mass zerg (GW2 term) farms for hunts to the rampant attack against and from new players. Every day is a fight through either super silent dungeons aside from the intial: "o/" to the constant use of (in some cases) the N word or other racial slurs.

I get it, shadowbringers was awesome, we bout to get some good eggs, some bad eggs and some rotten eggs. But recently it seems the old guard attacking the newer generation and the newer generation assuming "this is like "x" game, shut up".

the problem here is that ppl is used to the game style of everyone everyone plays how their riends play , they follow the same trends and a healer expects any new tank to big pull and do whatever their friends do bc they think is a normal thing to do, sadly the problem with that is as mentioned before ppl is so used to the same trends as everyone else

i got kicked many times in dungeons because i dont follow the trends they expect me to follow.

i can big pull as much as they love to if they ask but if they dont say anything then sorry i will do what i know.


the issue here is that ppl is getting toxic because they have a playstyle set in stone and if ppl dont follow their demands they get angry because they think everyone is made the same

[RTX3080]

Again, you just got unlucky. Not everyone is like that in game.