What exactly do we know as of 5.3 about the sound that was heard before Amaurot fell?

[Kesey]

My personal theory is Sharlayan is one of cities of the Ancients. The side quests of Amarout mention a sister city. Numerous Sharlayan ruins near Idyllshire and Sharlayan type dungeons name things after Greek routed words. But the dungeons surrounding Amoarout also have Greek routed names. I think the ground work has been setup for Sharalayan to be the Ancients that followed and summoned Hydaelyn. Their isolationist tendency is probably to hide this history from the rest of the world. And makes a pretty exciting turn of plot when all of the scions are either from Sharlayan or have a Sharlayan education.

I think the untied up plot thread of Shadowbringers revolves around Venat, the Ancient who lead Hydaelyn fraction of the Ancients. Notice in the scene following Anamnesis Anyder, he is speaking to 12 others which could easily be recognized as Hydaelyn's Ancient Convocation--furthermore, they claim the act of summoning Hydaelyn is a permenant solution and Zodiark's summoning will just extend the time before the disastrous end (assuming here this is sound). They also say they have had trouble recruiting the "defector" who I'm guessing is us as Azem. Venat does set about sacrificing himself to be the heart of Hydaelyn because he feels he is the ideal candidate, but does say that he won't be gone from the world and his form will be his choice. Given what we've been shown regarding Elidibus, we can guess that Venat is probably a primal and still potentially alive.

Then given that Hydaelyn was successful in sundering the world and sealing Zodiark, putting the Ascians in a bad situation, its not a stretch for the winning Ancients to go on living peacefully. Furthermore, (and I couldn't find the source of this interview) there was an interview with Yoshi-P and one of the writers shortly following Shadowbringers where they were asked what the Ancients looked like under their robes and it was said that its a significant lore reason and can't be revealed at this point. I'm assuming that because the Ancients look like the races of Final Fantasy 14, who are also (partly) the citizens of Sharlayan. Finally, the 12 gods of humaniod races are most likey the 12 remaining members of Hydaelyn's Ancient Convocation.

And if we want to go deeper here (because at this point its pure speculation), I'm going out on a limb and say that Louisoix was Venat. Although this would require a slight retcon of the Phoenix scene from coils, all it will be is a reinterpretation that Venat the primal/Louisoix who summons his old friends (the 12) to empower him which is already the Phoenix to defeat Bahamut (instead of it happening in reverse which is the current interpretation--the 12 made him into a primal). The lore surrounding our character and Battle of Carteneau is we were in 1.0 and Louisoix sent us to the beginning of ARR before becoming Phoenix (which is pretty heavy handed when you realize that you wake up on a ship/carriage that is also carrying the twins who are the direct inheritors of Lousioix's legacy) but we just don't remember the past (regardless if you are legacy or not, the 1.0 players only get a few dialogue nods from npcs). Only Venat, the heart of Hydaelyn would have the knowledge of who we are to recognize saving us over anyone else on the battlefield. While Emet had children that eventually gave us Emperor Varis and Zenos, it stands to reason Venat can have the twin's father and then the twins. The only fault I find with this theory is this means maybe the Twin's destiny will have them preform the sealing spell with Tupsimati (and has been missing since 3.5), which have managed to kill a primal Phoenix and Papalymo (supposedly the best student of Louisoix), seal something stronger than Bahamut or Shinryu/Nidhogg--frankly Zodiark.

Sorry, longer than expected. Tl;dr: Sharlayan is an Ancient's city on the source that followed Hydaelyn. Venat the leader of the Hydaelyn faction is like Elidibus and could be a primal and still alive. Further speculation says Venat was Louisoix, making the Twins more important previously realized.

[RyuDragnier]

Furthermore, (and I couldn't find the source of this interview) there was an interview with Yoshi-P and one of the writers shortly following Shadowbringers where they were asked what the Ancients looked like under their robes and it was said that its a significant lore reason and can't be revealed at this point. I'm assuming that because the Ancients look like the races of Final Fantasy 14, who are also (partly) the citizens of Sharlayan. Finally, the 12 gods of humaniod races are most likey the 12 remaining members of Hydaelyn's Ancient Convocation.

No, seeing that they were the normal races wouldn't be a lore reason why it couldn't be shown, since seeing that wouldn't really change anything. However...imagine if they in fact looked more like the various "Beast Tribes" we've encountered. Amaljaa, Kobolds, Sahagin, Sylphs, Kojin, etc. That would be a true lore twist, now wouldn't it? That the current playable races are in fact the ones created to be sacrificed, and the beast tribes were the original inhabitants of the planet before the Calamity.

[ShadowMeowth]

My personal theory is Sharlayan is one of cities of the Ancients. The side quests of Amarout mention a sister city. Numerous Sharlayan ruins near Idyllshire and Sharlayan type dungeons name things after Greek routed words. But the dungeons surrounding Amoarout also have Greek routed names. I think the ground work has been setup for Sharalayan to be the Ancients that followed and summoned Hydaelyn. Their isolationist tendency is probably to hide this history from the rest of the world. And makes a pretty exciting turn of plot when all of the scions are either from Sharlayan or have a Sharlayan education.

I think the untied up plot thread of Shadowbringers revolves around Venat, the Ancient who lead Hydaelyn fraction of the Ancients. Notice in the scene following Anamnesis Anyder, he is speaking to 12 others which could easily be recognized as Hydaelyn's Ancient Convocation--furthermore, they claim the act of summoning Hydaelyn is a permenant solution and Zodiark's summoning will just extend the time before the disastrous end (assuming here this is sound). They also say they have had trouble recruiting the "defector" who I'm guessing is us as Azem. Venat does set about sacrificing himself to be the heart of Hydaelyn because he feels he is the ideal candidate, but does say that he won't be gone from the world and his form will be his choice. Given what we've been shown regarding Elidibus, we can guess that Venat is probably a primal and still potentially alive.

While I agree with a large part of this, I feel compelled to point out that Venat is a woman —besides the obvious symbolism of having a goddess and a god and male and female and the whole thing, it stands to reason that Hydaelyn being distinctively female is due to having a female core. Venat's voice is also /very/ similar to Hydaelyn's Japanese voice. While in FFXII the Occuria are genderless, there is a predominance of male / female notes in their voices, with Gerun being more male-like and Venat being female-like. We could argue what exactly entails the concept of gender to the Ancients —my personal take is that their philosophy was akin to the Dotharl: flesh is momentary and susceptible to change, while the soul is unique and eternal— but in this particular case I feel it is relevant for Venat to be a woman. Any other Ancient may have no issue being reborn as the opposite sex (I wonder if in one of his many, many lives, Emet-Selch lived as a woman?, stray thought) but having the Heart of a female goddess take on a male form sounds... incoherent to me. So I would say yes to your theory except for the Louisoix part. He was a very fervent follower of Hydaelyn, that very much is true.

[Kesey]

I did not know of the play (I will not claim I know much of Shakespeare's work, here you would only study it if you course a degree on English Literature) but to have a general idea I checked the Wikipedia and dear Lord. The Tempest-area-of-Norvrandt is brimming to references to The Tempest-Shakespeare-play. Not just because of Prospero and Ferdinand (great catch on the name's meaning) as you mentioned, but there are zones of the Tempest named after characters in the play. Specifically, the Caliban Gap / Gorge and the Trinculo Shelf. This incidentally makes the Tempest being a combination of two great English classics: The Tempest by William Shakespeare in the seabed part, and Utopia by Thomas Moore in Amaurot's part. Very theatrical. Then again, it is Emet we are talking about. Of course he would be theatrical.

As a literature scholar, this meaning wasn't lost on me. Furthermore, The Tempest has a few unique qualities that set it apart from other Shakespearean plays. First its the only Shakespeare play set in the new world--which at the time of Shakespeare's writing was full of possibles and misunderstood (and the supernatural was a significant thing in that time period too, because it predates the Enlightenment and the reliance of science). It was generally thought that new world was the source of the supernatural (mirroring the Ancients and their creation magic as the source of final fantasy world's fantastical things).

Prospero, a character from the play, was one of the few roles we know Shakespeare played himself. Prospero it should be noted intends to orchestrate the entire plot of the play, much like the author of a play, so it works out how he intends it. The parallel here is Emet, who as recreated a puppet Amarout to have things go how he intends.

The symbolism continues when we find out that this play was popular at the end of the Shakespeare's acting career--at career that allowed him to retire (a new concept for that time period). Prospero as Shakespeare and by extention through Final Fantasy Emet, give their farewell speech (or retirement speech) in this play where they echo the significance of what has come before to inform the present. Shakespeare does this a send off to his career, but Emet does it for his civilization which he has struggled for all of recorded time.

Although the reference was very heavy handed, it still very fitting in the context of the revelations Shadowbringers has brought to the plot of the game. I would also argue this reference is what makes Emet have depth of character and likable, even though he is kind of a jerk. But that is an argument for another time and place.

[Morningstar1337]

I can see Sharlayan as being loosely related to the Venat faction or Azem, but not as directly, especially considering that the people that hail form there don't really tower over highlanders (let not forget that the Scions that went to Aumarot were mostly Sharlayan and they were also refered to as kids bu the Aumarotine shades). It would explain their isolationist tendencies and their desire to keep knowledge away from the world at all cost (as evedenced by the hits on Leveva) as some but not all of them would likely be among the few that is aware of the true nature of the Source.

[Kesey]

While I agree with a large part of this, I feel compelled to point out that Venat is a woman —besides the obvious symbolism of having a goddess and a god and male and female and the whole thing, it stands to reason that Hydaelyn being distinctively female is due to having a female core. Venat's voice is also /very/ similar to Hydaelyn's Japanese voice. While in FFXII the Occuria are genderless, there is a predominance of male / female notes in their voices, with Gerun being more male-like and Venat being female-like. We could argue what exactly entails the concept of gender to the Ancients —my personal take is that their philosophy was akin to the Dotharl: flesh is momentary and susceptible to change, while the soul is unique and eternal— but in this particular case I feel it is relevant for Venat to be a woman. Any other Ancient may have no issue being reborn as the opposite sex (I wonder if in one of his many, many lives, Emet-Selch lived as a woman?, stray thought) but having the Heart of a female goddess take on a male form sounds... incoherent to me. So I would say yes to your theory except for the Louisoix part. He was a very fervent follower of Hydaelyn, that very much is true.

I rewatched the Venat Anemesis Anyder scenes again. Venat is not referred to as either gender. Only Zodiark and Hydaelyn have genders. But when we talk of the Ancients as having creation magic, I'm sure they can change genders on whim. Furthermore, Venat claims they can take whatever form they want. So Venat can be a woman, make a female primal-demi-god, then change to a man.

This also extends to us as Azem, obviously we can be reincarnated as either gender. So even though it hasn't been touched upon very heavily, the choice of gender isn't significant unless its to through us off the trail of the plot.

[Kesey]

I can see Sharlayan as being loosely related to the Venat faction or Azem, but not as directly, especially considering that the people that hail form there don't really tower over highlanders (let not forget that the Scions that went to Aumarot were mostly Sharlayan and they were also refered to as kids bu the Aumarotine shades). It would explain their isolationist tendencies and their desire to keep knowledge away from the world at all cost (as evedenced by the hits on Leveva) as some but not all of them would likely be among the few that is aware of the true nature of the Source.

I think the Ancients being tall are part of the creation of Emet, not a direct reflection of their true height, in the sense he feels they were larger than life. If this was true all of the Ascians would tower over us when they reveal themselves in their black robes and masks. The argument can also be made Amarout was made larger to symbolize our infant understanding of their culture--in other words, we're intended to look at it through a child's eyes.

[Kesey]

No, seeing that they were the normal races wouldn't be a lore reason why it couldn't be shown, since seeing that wouldn't really change anything. However...imagine if they in fact looked more like the various "Beast Tribes" we've encountered. Amaljaa, Kobolds, Sahagin, Sylphs, Kojin, etc. That would be a true lore twist, now wouldn't it? That the current playable races are in fact the ones created to be sacrificed, and the beast tribes were the original inhabitants of the planet before the Calamity.

But they won't be the beast tribes, as a few were intentionally created by the Allagans, and the rest were creations of the Ancients. Furthermore, Ascians body hop a lot and yet none have taken the form a member of a beast tribe, always as one of the humaniod races.

[JeanneOrnitier]

I think the Ancients being tall are part of the creation of Emet, not a direct reflection of their true height, in the sense he feels they were larger than life. If this was true all of the Ascians would tower over us when they reveal themselves in their black robes and masks. The argument can also be made Amarout was made larger to symbolize our infant understanding of their culture--in other words, we're intended to look at it through a child's eyes.

Venat and her companions were just as large and they were actual hologram recordings, not creations of Emet.

[Cilia]

I rewatched the Venat Anemesis Anyder scenes again. Venat is not referred to as either gender. Only Zodiark and Hydaelyn have genders. But when we talk of the Ancients as having creation magic, I'm sure they can change genders on whim. Furthermore, Venat claims they can take whatever form they want. So Venat can be a woman, make a female primal-demi-god, then change to a man.

This also extends to us as Azem, obviously we can be reincarnated as either gender. So even though it hasn't been touched upon very heavily, the choice of gender isn't significant unless its to through us off the trail of the plot.

While Venat isn't referred to with gendered pronouns in EN, most other languages lack English's unusual gender neutrality as a language. Every other language uses gendered pronouns, and those refer to Venat as a woman.

Reincarnation is quite a different thing to using magicks to alter one's sex.