AST changes for 6.0: Let's forget 5.0 happened, and just fix what was wrong with 4.0

[LariaKirin]

Can we think of something original, rather than "let's forget 5.0 and return to bad design"?

RNG utility is not utility.

[Bsrking5]

I would like if the cards didn't give a dps buff.
Something like
Balance: returns 1% damage to attacker
Bole: 10% damage resist
Spear: 20% physical damage resist
Arrow: 10% increased healing
Spire: 20% magical damage resist
Ewer: MP regen
And the minor Arcana changes
Lord: 200 pot damage
Lady: Diurnal Sect 250 pot heal and shield
Nocturnal Sect 100 pot heal and 100 regen for 15 seconds

[elioaiko]

Unless all of the cars become utility then AST's cards will never been "balanced" or potential utility will be entirely ignored.

I've been saying that Divination needs to be buffed and make all the cards utility-based. Because people will always be frustrated/complain about RNG buffs. The current system makes AST a consistant buffer.

There's no way to balance out dmg buff cards without making them all dmg which is what happened. As boring and dull the new system is, I can understand why. In a game where DPS is the main focus, that's what people will look to.

And while I dearly loved 4.0 AST because Sleeve Draw felt amazing and extending buffs was beautiful, it was ridiculously busted. Had SCH not been reigning during that era, AST would have been king (ironic since they reverse happened 5.0).

I don't see a return to 4.0 AST but I do feel that the current system isn't sticking around considering the severe negative reception to it (even to the point where SE openly apologized in a liveletter for it).

On top of that, whatever gimmick the new healer has will also determine how they feel healer balance will be.

[Gemina]

The RNG aspect of AST cards is what makes it a self-defeating mechanic. Because of this, we can never revert the cards back to 4.0. If we want to provide valuable feedback/suggestions, we need move forward, not backwards. This does not mean we cannot see the return of abilities like Royal Road and stun returned to CO, but RNG based utility is gone and not likely to return. For that previous mechanic to work, encounter design would need to be changed, and I don't see that happening.

That said, AST has the most interesting and engaging mechanic of all the healers. Despite how 'meh' it is, it remains the best example to improve the other healer gauges, and implement a new one with the 4th healer. I predicted that with 5.3 changes, AST high APM would be reduced. I was correct. My next prediction for AST is they are going to put the cards on the GCD to reduce the APM even further. This dev team is all about accessibility, and AST remains a job and a healer with a high skill ceiling. I wouldn't let this cause despair though, because the current track record for this dev team is that when they put abilities on the GCD, they are vastly improved. So it would be interesting to see what they would do with the cards in this case.

The biggest problem I have with AST right is how it is the catapult loader/damage buff turret I refer to it as. AST is the most selfless of all the healers because it gets the least amount of return for the work put in. Everyone else benefits from a skilled AST, while one of lesser skill will get more personal enjoyment out of it. Rectifying this issue should not come by reducing the benefit everyone receives from AST, but rather bring the enjoyment level up for the AST that plays with a high skill level while giving incentive to the lesser skilled player to improve. Until this changes, my AST will continue to be benched.

I would feel more comfortable making suggestions for this job if I ran relevant savage encounters. The job itself is a wildcard, anomaly, third wheel, red-headed step child, the new cat in the house already claimed by two other cats. I know what I would like to see with the job, but have no clue how to get there, and perhaps the savage encounters would broaden my perspective. Alas, I would only take a job I am comfortable playing inside savage, and AST is not one of them.

[ForteNightshade]

As much as I would like the old AST effects back, it'll only result in the job being an almost must-pick for raids, log runs and whatever else, so I don't think Yoshi wants it going back to that. More curious about the new healer and what they will bring rather than AST at the moment, can come back to that later

Astro won't have the same dominance it once did simply because FFlogs has changed its ranking system. Before, it was based exclusively on your personal DPS regardless of the source. This meant selfish jobs like Black Mage, Samurai or White Mage were a detriment to your logs. With rDPS and aDPS the two categories people focus on nowadays (rDPS being the new ranking category). It doesn't matter nearly as much what you play.

[Side-Eye]

The biggest problem I have with AST right is how it is the catapult loader/damage buff turret I refer to it as. AST is the most selfless of all the healers because it gets the least amount of return for the work put in. Everyone else benefits from a skilled AST, while one of lesser skill will get more personal enjoyment out of it. Rectifying this issue should not come by reducing the benefit everyone receives from AST, but rather bring the enjoyment level up for the AST that plays with a high skill level while giving incentive to the lesser skilled player to improve. Until this changes, my AST will continue to be benched.

This could be somewhat remedied by providing the AST a small personal DMG+ buff when playing a card to buff another person... and that personal buff would be a bit higher if played on the ideal role for the card drawn (e.g. "melee DPS or tank" Spear).

Or introduce "Major Arcana" and each time a card is played to buff another person, it produces a King or Queen of Crowns, either a free nuke or free heal, similar to how the old lord/lady did.

Or each time a card is played to buff another person, the next heal cast causes X amount of damage to the heal recipient's target.

[Aomine1992]

Can we think of something original, rather than "let's forget 5.0 and return to bad design"?

RNG utility is not utility.

Agreed I did not like the old card system, felt like I was fishing for my utility all cards besides balance was useless because that’s what people wanted or you would rarely have a spread bole for mitigation at the right time...no thanks they can forget about 5.0 on their own.

[Gemina]

This could be somewhat remedied by providing the AST a small personal DMG+ buff when playing a card to buff another person... and that personal buff would be a bit higher if played on the ideal role for the card drawn (e.g. "melee DPS or tank" Spear).

Or introduce "Major Arcana" and each time a card is played to buff another person, it produces a King or Queen of Crowns, either a free nuke or free heal, similar to how the old lord/lady did.

Or each time a card is played to buff another person, the next heal cast causes X amount of damage to the heal recipient's target.

The idea rolling around in my head is through Divination, and making it a nuke and buff extender. I've been playing a lot of jobs lately, and something common among them is they have their own personal damage buff that they will squeeze their strongest attacks into; sometimes even multiple windows such as MCH heat blast + wildfire wombo combo. While I am not asking for anything this complex, what I would like to see with AST's card game is they would want to get up as many damage buffs as possible in preparation for Divination, that way when it goes off not only does the AST cause a certain amount of damage to the enemies, it also adds a time extender depending on the seals the AST has acquired for a maximum of 15 seconds extended to the buffs they applied prior to using Divination.

Well, that's what my brain cooked up after taking my AST into Shiva unreal. Not a relevant savage encounter, but the best I could do^^

[KDSilver]

Can we think of something original, rather than "let's forget 5.0 and return to bad design"?

RNG utility is not utility.

As much as I never had any issue with the RNG and enjoyed it, I can understand that feeling.
But that's indeed a valid point.
You couldn't for example make The Bole part of your strategy (except if you kept Spread for that, but the end results was a less damage buff, and it mean that if you drastically needeed it, either something's wrong or bringing a WHM would be a better answer - OR really rare specific scenario).

I would like if the cards didn't give a dps buff.
Something like
Balance: returns 1% damage to attacker
Bole: 10% damage resist
Spear: 20% physical damage resist
Arrow: 10% increased healing
Spire: 20% magical damage resist
Ewer: MP regen
And the minor Arcana changes
Lord: 200 pot damage
Lady: Diurnal Sect 250 pot heal and shield
Nocturnal Sect 100 pot heal and 100 regen for 15 seconds

It would be even worse.
Cause if you don't need any form of mitigation or extra healing (which already happen), you'd fish for Balance again or just minor arcana into Lord everything.
I'd be 4.0 with even less option.

Because of this, we can never revert the cards back to 4.0. If we want to provide valuable feedback/suggestions, we need move forward, not backwards.

I agree. I prefered the old card system. But if 5.0 AST is the way it is, this is because devs got feedback to do so.
So just going back wouldn't be the answer.

We need to take the best of both world and indeed, move forward.

I wonder if it wouldn't be possible for both damaging and support card to works together without having to sacrifice the other part to use them.
Or maybe removing the RNG part and getting a set sequence of card such as Balance - Ewer - Bole - Spire - Spear - Arrow, and minor arcana granting the opposite effect.
But I guess it could kill the fun of the old system and it might not work well for the current fishing seal system.

[Side-Eye]

The idea rolling around in my head is through Divination, and making it a nuke and buff extender. I've been playing a lot of jobs lately, and something common among them is they have their own personal damage buff that they will squeeze their strongest attacks into; sometimes even multiple windows such as MCH heat blast + wildfire wombo combo. While I am not asking for anything this complex, what I would like to see with AST's card game is they would want to get up as many damage buffs as possible in preparation for Divination, that way when it goes off not only does the AST cause a certain amount of damage to the enemies, it also adds a time extender depending on the seals the AST has acquired for a maximum of 15 seconds extended to the buffs they applied prior to using Divination.

Well, that's what my brain cooked up after taking my AST into Shiva unreal. Not a relevant savage encounter, but the best I could do^^

Honestly I wouldn't fight against anything that gave AST a bit more complexity back. It's like I said before, there *is* a heal job for those who need a softer initiation, but there should be at least one choice for those who crave a steeper learning curve.

Maybe if we toss enough ideas around, try to see the good in each idea, and support those doing the same, Squeenix will be willing to test out some of those ideas. As far as the card system and job gauge are concerned, almost anything would be better than what we have.