Revelations from Patch 5.3

[Alleluia]

I dunno if anyone's brought this up b/c spoiler tags might have led me to skip it, but do we need to rethink the Echo now?

Previously, it was assumed that the Echo was a sign of an Ancient's soul. But now Alisaie, who does not apparently have the Echo since she didn't hear Hydaelyn, claims that she feels loss when looking at the starshower, implying she has the soul of an Ancient who saw the Final Days. Unless she's just feeling like that cus she actually knows the true story and is empathizing?

But Ali is of course not the only one to feel that way while simultaneously not hearing Hydaelyn, as there are two nameless NPCs in Eulmore near the balcony that say much the same thing if you talk to them once the sky turns star showery.

This kind of effects previous speculation on Zodiark and whether the new life he created was the new races/new souls that people have, too. Since the Echo was considered an Ancient watermark, lack of it could have been considered to be a sign that that soul was descended from the new life. Now, not so much. Basically, is everyone an Ancient soul now???

[YianKutku]

I dunno if anyone's brought this up b/c spoiler tags might have led me to skip it, but do we need to rethink the Echo now?

Previously, it was assumed that the Echo was a sign of an Ancient's soul. But now Alisaie, who does not apparently have the Echo since she didn't hear Hydaelyn, claims that she feels loss when looking at the starshower, implying she has the soul of an Ancient who saw the Final Days. Unless she's just feeling like that cus she actually knows the true story and is empathizing?

But Ali is of course not the only one to feel that way while simultaneously not hearing Hydaelyn, as there are two nameless NPCs in Eulmore near the balcony that say much the same thing if you talk to them once the sky turns star showery.

This kind of effects previous speculation on Zodiark and whether the new life he created was the new races/new souls that people have, too. Since the Echo was considered an Ancient watermark, lack of it could have been considered to be a sign that that soul was descended from the new life. Now, not so much. Basically, is everyone an Ancient soul now???

The current lore is that everyone has the soul of an Ancient, albeit sundered. The source is a Letter From The Producer (non-Live) archived somewhere on the forum, I believe.

Of course, this kind of causes issues with previous text, where we learn souls can be formed/developed, eg with Alpha. Also we don't know if by "everyone" they mean "every Spoken", or "every living thing", or "every sapient being", or "every player character race. (Obviously we'll leave extraterrestrials like dragons and Omega aside.) For example, would our Chocobo have the soul of an Ancient? Would Seto?

So apparently what Elidibus did with the starshower was attempt to awaken another part of this Ancient soul-ness, namely what we know of as the Echo. Some people got it, some people did not, and we don't know what the criteria is, or even if it's just random chance. But everyone (on-scene, conveniently) somehow managed to pull from ancestral memory of Amaurot and Amaurot-like architecture as something that was lost.

I don't know if this "everyone has the soul of an Ancient" thing is leading somewhere, or if it's one of those "it sounded nice and dramatic in storyboarding, don't think too hard about it.

Ten Character Jin

[RicaRuin]

The current lore is that everyone has the soul of an Ancient, albeit sundered. The source is a Letter From The Producer (non-Live) archived somewhere on the forum, I believe.

Of course, this kind of causes issues with previous text, where we learn souls can be formed/developed, eg with Alpha. Also we don't know if by "everyone" they mean "every Spoken", or "every living thing", or "every sapient being", or "every player character race. (Obviously we'll leave extraterrestrials like dragons and Omega aside.) For example, would our Chocobo have the soul of an Ancient? Would Seto?

So apparently what Elidibus did with the starshower was attempt to awaken another part of this Ancient soul-ness, namely what we know of as the Echo. Some people got it, some people did not, and we don't know what the criteria is, or even if it's just random chance. But everyone (on-scene, conveniently) somehow managed to pull from ancestral memory of Amaurot and Amaurot-like architecture as something that was lost.

I don't know if this "everyone has the soul of an Ancient" thing is leading somewhere, or if it's one of those "it sounded nice and dramatic in storyboarding, don't think too hard about it.

Ten Character Jin

I'm not too sure about that...

I mean, they wanted to sacrifice the new life on the planet to restore Amaurotines, and that was before the Sundering. So not every soul is a sundered Amaurotine, going by the all creation had been sundered, some must have a sundered soul of a sundered non-Amaurotine.

[Crushnight]

I'm not too sure about that...

I mean, they wanted to sacrifice the new life on the planet to restore Amaurotines, and that was before the Sundering. So not every soul is a sundered Amaurotine, going by the all creation had been sundered, some must have a sundered soul of a sundered non-Amaurotine.

Remember Amaurotine is the name given to Amaurot's populace not a race name, think like Americans and British rather than Human/Homo Sapien.

So might be possible other sundered people inherited soul fragments from people from other cultures of the same race as Amaurotines who also witnessed the final days and may have been in the Underworld at time of the Sundering.

There is still a lot we don't know about what happened prior to Zodiark but also the Sundering itself.(like how did Emet-Selch and Lahabrea escape it? etc)

Now that I think on it Emet/Lahabrea/Elidibus didn't want to bring back the entire planet just 1 city's worth of people, kinda nasty that they only viewed their culture as the only one significant enough to warrant the destruction of 13 shards and the Source to bring back.

[RicaRuin]

Remember Amaurotine is the name given to Amaurot's populace not a race name, think like Americans and British rather than Human/Homo Sapien.

So might be possible other sundered people inherited soul fragments from people from other cultures of the same race as Amaurotines who also witnessed the final days and may have been in the Underworld at time of the Sundering.

There is still a lot we don't know about what happened prior to Zodiark but also the Sundering itself.(like how did Emet-Selch and Lahabrea escape it? etc)

Now that I think on it Emet/Lahabrea/Elidibus didn't want to bring back the entire planet just 1 city's worth of people, kinda nasty that they only viewed their culture as the only one significant enough to warrant the destruction of 13 shards and the Source to bring back.

Ah, yes, my bad. However...

I think that it's because of how Zodiark came to be. They never talk about how to bring back the dead, but rather those that sacrificed themselves for Zodiark. And those were only Amaurotines (correct use!).

Or it's because of the tempering. The Amaurotines prayed to Zodiark to save them, so His purpose is to save Amaurotines, going by what we know about Primals.

In general, Zodiark seems to be a made in Amaurot thing, without input from the other cities.

However, I still stand by there are sundered souls that don't originated from Ancients. Since there was new, non-Ancient life pre-Sundering

[Iscah]

Two thoughts - one serious, one somewhat flippant (but still explaining something nicely).


On the Exarch's decision:

In deciding to merge with his younger self... It occurs to me (going from memory) that there's always an undercurrent of inadequacy to G'raha's feelings - he's trying to live up to ideals but never feels like he's doing it right. But what a confidence boost it could be to know that your future self did such things!

On food as aetherial energy:

Raha's comments about being constantly hungry after too much spellcasting are amusing, but also a neat detail. It makes sense that food = aether = basically MP and your body does try to recharge it. Does this mean ether is an energy drink?

That got me thinking on what seemed to be an inconsistency with the Exarch's state, where on the one hand Emet remarks at one time that the Exarch never seems to rest (implying that he's not human enough any more to need it, and is just awake 24/7) but other scenes suggest he does still need to eat and sleep... so I rather like the idea that actually he's just been getting away with not eating or sleeping properly because the tower's been providing whatever energy he's failing to take in, keeping him just above the threshold of being too exhausted to continue.

Come to think of it, the one time we do find him sleeping is in Kholusia where he's further from the tower and his connection to it is weakened. Evidently he's not getting enough recharge signal.

I need to replay the Crystal Tower quests sometime.

[Alleluia]

Two thoughts - one serious, one somewhat flippant (but still explaining something nicely).


On the Exarch's decision:

In deciding to merge with his younger self... It occurs to me (going from memory) that there's always an undercurrent of inadequacy to G'raha's feelings - he's trying to live up to ideals but never feels like he's doing it right. But what a confidence boost it could be to know that your future self did such things!

On food as aetherial energy:

Raha's comments about being constantly hungry after too much spellcasting are amusing, but also a neat detail. It makes sense that food = aether = basically MP and your body does try to recharge it. Does this mean ether is an energy drink?

That got me thinking on what seemed to be an inconsistency with the Exarch's state, where on the one hand Emet remarks at one time that the Exarch never seems to rest (implying that he's not human enough any more to need it, and is just awake 24/7) but other scenes suggest he does still need to eat and sleep... so I rather like the idea that actually he's just been getting away with not eating or sleeping properly because the tower's been providing whatever energy he's failing to take in, keeping him just above the threshold of being too exhausted to continue.

Come to think of it, the one time we do find him sleeping is in Kholusia where he's further from the tower and his connection to it is weakened. Evidently he's not getting enough recharge signal.

I need to replay the Crystal Tower quests sometime.

I mean... *does* it mean that ether is an energy drink? Or Mountain Dew?

On a more serious note, I have been assuming he didn't sleep or technically need to eat for the reasons you stated above. I thought that was canon, but maybe I should put it int he crazy headcanons thread?

[Iscah]

I mean... *does* it mean that ether is an energy drink? Or Mountain Dew?

On a more serious note, I have been assuming he didn't sleep or technically need to eat for the reasons you stated above. I thought that was canon, but maybe I should put it int he crazy headcanons thread?

I guess it's not so much about him requiring food and sleep as whether he's still physically able to do so - especially since the visible crystallisation suggests he could be more crystal than flesh under his robes. I'd assumed that the fact he didn't meant he couldn't, but now it's making more sense that he can and probably functions better when he does.

Scenario A: Draws all energy from the tower; doesn't get tired or hungry any more

Scenario B: Gets just enough energy to not collapse from exhaustion; still needs food/sleep to get above this threshold functioning level

Scenario C: Can draw energy at will to make up for the fact that he hasn't slept in days but really can't afford to right now.

I'd assumed A but now realising it's probably B/C.

[ShinShimon]

Ah, yes, my bad. However...

I think that it's because of how Zodiark came to be. They never talk about how to bring back the dead, but rather those that sacrificed themselves for Zodiark. And those were only Amaurotines (correct use!).

Or it's because of the tempering. The Amaurotines prayed to Zodiark to save them, so His purpose is to save Amaurotines, going by what we know about Primals.

In general, Zodiark seems to be a made in Amaurot thing, without input from the other cities.

However, I still stand by there are sundered souls that don't originated from Ancients. Since there was new, non-Ancient life pre-Sundering

Anything pre-Sundering is still an Ancient (probably?). New life post-Zodiark should have still been of the same fundamental nature as pre-Zodiark Ancients like the Amaurotines.

[Vyrerus]

I was thinking today on how when you login, if you pan your camera around the character selection scene, the light source is The Sun. They really had a solid tie in with this whole Shepherd plot thread hehe.