I dont think ishgard restoration was thought out very well...

[Alleo]

That's part of a living game that is an MMO.
Sometimes you miss out, but there'll always be more.

This is all a good thing, imo.

A good thing for those that enjoy it and dont care if they miss it. For someone like me that wants to see as much as possible especially if its part of the lore and story such a changing game would be horrible. Its one of the reason why I wont play WoW.

And its not like you cant do a living game at all. Just fix it to each person and thus the person will see their own living game that changes thanks to how they acted.

[Jojoya]

A good thing for those that enjoy it and dont care if they miss it. For someone like me that wants to see as much as possible especially if its part of the lore and story such a changing game would be horrible. Its one of the reason why I wont play WoW.

And its not like you cant do a living game at all. Just fix it to each person and thus the person will see their own living game that changes thanks to how they acted.

Living game definition - A video game that is constantly being updated with fresh new content on a regular basis.

It doesn't state that content has to be retained indefinitely. It doesn't state the content has to be customized to the individual player.

A true "living" game would be constantly filled with one time events just like life is. Either you're there to experience them when they happen or you have to rely on the recordings of others who were.

I'm like Canadane. I enjoy that there can be things I'll miss out on if I'm not there. Things can get stale and boring if you're guaranteed to never miss out.

[MsQi]

Living game definition - A video game that is constantly being updated with fresh new content on a regular basis.

It doesn't state that content has to be retained indefinitely. It doesn't state the content has to be customized to the individual player.

A true "living" game would be constantly filled with one time events just like life is. Either you're there to experience them when they happen or you have to rely on the recordings of others who were.

I'm like Canadane. I enjoy that there can be things I'll miss out on if I'm not there. Things can get stale and boring if you're guaranteed to never miss out.

The definition says nothing about the content being temporary either. One can say "A true living game constantly has new permanent content." and still be in line with the definition you provide. Just saying

[LaylaTsarra]

Personally I'm not crazy with how Doman Restoration was done. It's fine for those who want to experience the rebuilding and I did that on my main and an alt or two. On the other hand a number of my alts are all shut out of the completed restoration and I'm not about to personally redo it on them. I'll live with it but I would also like to see an option to have that completed for them without having to REDO the process.

I have no problem with how Ishgard Restoration is being handled and I don't see it as something that people who join the game late as being something they need to experience.

[MsQi]

Personally I'm not crazy with how Doman Restoration was done. It's fine for those who want to experience the rebuilding and I did that on my main and an alt or two. On the other hand a number of my alts are all shut out of the completed restoration and I'm not about to personally redo it on them. I'll live with it but I would also like to see an option to have that completed for them without having to REDO the process.

I have no problem with how Ishgard Restoration is being handled and I don't see it as something that people who join the game late as being something they need to experience.

Imo opinion having doma completed is the boring part. It's an ok RP area. It's just a big place where not much seems to happen, unless there is something I'm missing. There are a couple items from the vender. Doing it was the best part, IMO.

[Alleo]

The definition says nothing about the content being temporary either. One can say "A true living game constantly has new permanent content." and still be in line with the definition you provide. Just saying

Exactly. I mean if the definition is the one that Jojoya posted then any MMO who gets updates is a living game.

[wereotter]

Is there any doubt it is becoming a housing ward?

Well that would be a big slap in the face to have it gated; so when you finish you find there are no houses left. That is assuming it would be using the current housing system, any newcomer would be SOL.

I would be all for a gated system if at the end you were guaranteed a house, perhaps using a new fully instanced system.

It absolutely looks like a housing ward... but then again there are several quests in the Foundation where you meet the people who are actually living in these houses. So I'm going to laugh SO hard if Square is just trolling us all into making what looks like a housing ward, but then doesn't turn out to be that.

[Deceptus]

Living game definition - A video game that is constantly being updated with fresh new content on a regular basis.

It doesn't state that content has to be retained indefinitely. It doesn't state the content has to be customized to the individual player.

A true "living" game would be constantly filled with one time events just like life is. Either you're there to experience them when they happen or you have to rely on the recordings of others who were.

I'm like Canadane. I enjoy that there can be things I'll miss out on if I'm not there. Things can get stale and boring if you're guaranteed to never miss out.

Many of these Restoration "events" happened at 2 AM. . . Let's not pretend anything about them was really thought out.

[Shougun]

That's part of a living game that is an MMO.
Sometimes you miss out, but there'll always be more.

This is all a good thing, imo.

I don't think it being an MMO necessitates that things must be missed out on, as I'm sure you could find an MMO that has nothing to miss out on and is still an MMO.

Although I feel a bit Karen like for that, but I think it's an important point to split hairs on because it merely being an MMO does not mean it must have changes brought by the community. Though it certainly means it can! Can doesn't mean must, but it might suggest a potential unique opportunity that you'll obviously not have in an sRPG.

Ultimately I agree in the sense that I believe diversity is important and that while this is a themepark mmo and so the general concept should be "buy ticket, ride rides" that sometimes rides change or you've got special occasions that come and go.

While I generally really want to dissuade thinking of SE's money I tend of to think of it like-

If it never changes, if nothing is ever developed, then people who stick around for a long time might think more often to themselves "why play this so much when I could just sub for like a month and bounce" or "nothing amounts to anything". If nothing changes, for some people, that might solidify and anchor the feeling it's just an endless treadmill and then feelings of engagement might start to wane (the feeling nothing means anything).

While on the other hand because this game is theme park and generally caters to a much larger casual audience that'll have an insanely diverse desire and play it means locking content out forever just dissuades people from coming in if they come in too late or are unable to invest the time needed within a limited time frame, a number of people can easily sink in an hour to ten a day- some of us can only get 30 minutes a day if we're lucky. If the game has many points of interest permanently barred, or if the game requires too much dedicated resources in order to stay afloat.. then that also pushes people away.

Finally locking away content also means you've invested into something that'll be one and done, so it better be worth it because it clearly could have had a much longer shelf life if you didn't do that. One and dones being a way to easily lower the amount of available content you can offer new players, since it'll have a timed life.

A person who mentioned that how the personal driven changes to the world haven't been done well but I would suggest how incredibly common they are and how rare community driven world changes are, across all the theme park mmos. Either nearly every developer out there is bonkers or there is clearly a connection between a well packed theme park and not consistently doing regular (majority) permanent changes. As well one of the biggest changes, not community driven per say, was cataclysm, and that angered many people- which isn't an example that it shouldn't be done (like 1.0 to 2.0 it can leave a huge impact on those who got to transition and lets devs reinvent themselves, hopefully for the better), but that not only are community/non-controllable changes few and far between (in comparison to personal driven) they're also not always well received. Which is not to ignore the many smaller events that while interesting usually also have much flak too, often for the server stress issues - like pretty much anything with the word "gates" and WoW lol, or how GW2 quickly abandoned much of miss-able aspects of living world after season 1. Not an argument that they can't be done, just an argument that just like if phasing has some people who don't like it so too obviously on the other side, including an apparent reluctance from devs themselves (of the theme park genre at least), and ultimately just an argument that there seems to be a strong relationship between theme parks being regularly filled with rides over having rides being taken out on the regular.

If nothing changes that'll bum out a number of people, but the majority of change, imo, for the betterment of what it means to be a theme park, a description Yoshida used on the game himself, I think is best left changing strictly on the player's own terms. Which is honestly currently the situation anyways, the vast majority of what moves this game is done via yourself. MSQ, tribes, courier, even Ishgard has a single player variant called Doma Reconstruction. If anything we might just see Ishgard as an attempt to improve what has already happened in the past with Mor Dhona or Idyllshire (an evolution of previous features). Personally I think it would have been more interesting to see players all working together in the hub that we visit as a hub, so like taking the Ishgard system and using it back when Mor Dhona was being worked on- just so then it's a stronger reminder of growth over time and something to play in consistently as it grows as a living unit. Rather than 'i might visit and see changes, sometimes- maybe' that is Ishgard, but perhaps better to test the system first and see what is going to be a problem and not (so not really a strong criticism, smart to see how it'll do first). Perhaps next time, maybe the personal can be an important town, and the community the hub, or vice versa. With a personal selfish note that I'm entirely biased towards personal driven systems, such that I might suggest hybrid concepts for the community driven part (or at least a magical picture/history book), but... it's a selfish thing and may take away from it's diversity value if that's done.. so pinch of salt there lol.

Not even saying no or saying they shouldn't exist at all lol, just more like I really want to put up the caution sign, big yellow lights, drive slow, so in some ways probably not even disagreeing- diversity of content types being important, as much just trying to hold the accelerator steady, improve the content yes, but also not to shift the paradigm- none is not a good thing, but also there can be too much being a bad, at least given the type of game this is (strong imo with correlation to pretty much all the other huge theme park mmos out there).

[DrWho2010]

Many of these Restoration "events" happened at 2 AM. . . Let's not pretend anything about them was really thought out.

that's more the fault of people continually contributing at all hours of the day. if turn ins were restricted to daytime hours only maybe it would be different but people from all around the world play on every server so... not much you can do.