We really need to talk about Living Dead

[Lucy_Pyre]

OK when 5.3 drop WAR can have LD and DRK will have Holmgang.

Okay? Am I supposed to react negatively to this comment? I play every tank actively and regularly, so don't let the fact that my profile says "Warrior" make you think that I don't have plenty of experience on DRK and using LD.

[cactuarzzzz]

Just say it, you want your main to be the best at everything, everyone does.

DRK already is the most OP MT atm, no need more buff.

Yeah, Ignore what healer said 2 post above and what other people say shall we?

[ItMe]

When I heal I hate LD.
When I tank LD often kills me when I try and use it to stay on top of a friggin huge pull in a dungeon.
When my FC heals they don't like it when I play DRK over the other tanks because of LD.

Honestly, if Walking Dead just buffed incoming heals I think it would all be groovy.

[cactuarzzzz]

Okay? Am I supposed to react negatively to this comment? I play every tank actively and regularly, so don't let the fact that my profile says "Warrior" make you think that I don't have plenty of experience on DRK and using LD.

Then you wouldn't have problem handling LD as WAR yeah? since it's
"the single best tank invuln" and "LD is extremely powerful" according to you. So if 5.3 drop and LD didn't change I would like to see you handling LD with another job.

[Seraphor]

Then you wouldn't have problem handling LD as WAR yeah? since it's
"the single best tank invuln" and "LD is extremely powerful" according to you. So if 5.3 drop and LD didn't change I would like to see you handling LD with another job.

What does this even mean?

[Lucy_Pyre]

What does this even mean?

It's a strawman, so it doesn't really mean anything.

Then you wouldn't have problem handling LD as WAR yeah? since it's
"the single best tank invuln" and "LD is extremely powerful" according to you. So if 5.3 drop and LD didn't change I would like to see you handling LD with another job.

Would I be pleased with it? Not necessarily, as arbitrarily swapping CD's between the tanks doesn't make a lot of sense. However, would I be bothered by having to use LD? Not really.

On another point, I said that can be the strongest invuln with proper play and coordination, and a WHM. In a general sense, Holmgang is the strongest invuln in a larger number of scenarios. That doesn't detract from LD's strength though. Try to come up with some legitimate points of contention next time.

Edit: WAR could even handle LD better than DRK can, since WAR has access to Thrill of Battle, Equilibrium, and Nascent Flash. So, sure, give me LD on WAR when I can heal a solid 50% of my own HP back minimum.

[Tranquilmelody7]

Then you wouldn't have problem handling LD as WAR yeah? since it's
"the single best tank invuln" and "LD is extremely powerful" according to you. So if 5.3 drop and LD didn't change I would like to see you handling LD with another job.

WAR would honestly work much better with Living Dead than DRK.

Nascent Flash alone would be enough to help purge the debuff, but the also have Equilibrium, and Thrill of Battle(Along with the baked in convalescence trait at level 80).

Meanwhile DRK has a pitiful GCD combo finisher, and Abyssal Drain which would have been a great help but was sadly nerfed to the ground this expansion.

[Quor]

LD really isn't as bad as it's made out to be. Even in ad hoc situations where it's unplanned for some reason. AST can Synastry > B2 > ED and thanks to the ED snapshotting the 1 HP it'll be at full potency. A crit on either of those full heals the DRK out of LD, and even if you don't crit you can just throw an AB or another B2 if need be. WHM of course can Bene. SCH needs a few more CD's for maximum effect, ideally wanting to combine it's fairy healing buff with Dissipate, Recitation and Excog, but even just Rec+Excog and a Lustrate is enough if at least one crits. Given that almost all invuln cooldown is planned nowadays, there's no excuse. Yes AST and SCH have to blow a few more CD's than WHM, but they are quite capable of pulling a DRK out of LD when needed.

[TheRealQuah]

Living Dead, whilst having the weakest effect of all the invuln's, is balanced by having the longest duration. It's effectively 20 seconds. There are also some circumstances where LD can be the best invuln of the lot for a certain situation. Conflag strike in E6S for example. It's great for multiple tankbuster's, like Titania's, Ravensclaw, Panto 2 etc..

Outside of savage it's pretty poor, but if you find yourself needing to use it as a panic button then you have worse problems to deal with anyway.

The simplest way to augment it is to either give the DRK lifesteal for those 10 seconds, or add the old effect of convalescence to it.

[Vyrerus]

Honestly, there's no problem with Living Dead. Healer mains are just whiny by nature. I play all tanks and all healers, and honestly I prefer Living Dead over Superbolide in a group setting, mainly because Superbolide makes you take damage and has a low duration. I remember so often in Ruby Weapon Ex, GNBs popping nothing other than Superbolide to catch that meteor with, meaning they dealt 150k damage to themselves to prevent 100k damage... lol.

What DRK should have, and did have somewhat at one point to make up for Living Dead being weaker in comparison to Holmgang/Hallowed is that it dealt high damage. As high as WAR's when WAR was king, depending on your luck with Low Blow procs, and if you had a Ninja to help you out with keeping hate while doing your DPS combos over Power Slash. Its DPS has only weakened since then, in relation to every other tank, and as awesome as The Blackest Night has been, that doesn't make up for it in my opinion. If it's going to have crappy situational tank cooldowns all around(Dark Mind, Living Dead), and then no self healing on the level of the other tanks(it matches GNB here, but GNB's got the highest damage), then it should have a leg up on dealing damage over PLD and WAR to be tied with GNB. It's not, and they just seem to not care about this poor design, as much as they pay lip service to saying that they do.

I thought it had a leg up with the AOE department, but Confiteor being at 1200 potency under Requiescat said otherwise.

Also, for commentary on about there being no ideas for them to make another invulnerability skill for tanks that would be unique. I say anyone who says that is unimaginative. It'd be quite easy or them to make an oGCD on a long cooldown that dealt damage at range, and then provided a heal with shield at 100x the amount healed for like 5 seconds. Or something that functioned like an all damage type version of Perfect Dodge that Rogue used to have. They could make one where you become invulnerable for the duration, but unable to deal damage for the duration as well. Lots of stuff they could do. They'll likely never get rid of invulns.