Geomancer

[BasicBlake]

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You're right, I have to read what you write multiple times usually before I can attempt to respond.

1. Okay the 1 or 2 in there cannot heal. But not only that, Knights of the Round is technically an ability. Can you go through every conjurer in the game otherwise in dungeon or not and tell me what others cannot heal. I KNOW you are only saying it because I said if something is a class, they act like the class in dungeons. You're playing devils advocate. And feel free to list out every dancer as well since you said you would. I have a hard time believing you will find them as anything other than support. This isn't about them using chakrams this is about them being a support character. But then you will use your trademark "You say that is this, but I don't personally see it as that".

2. The devs don't care how you see the classes as similar or not. The lore book calls them similar, the game calls them similar. Because Mirron on the forums doesn't see them as similar doesn't erase the printed words. And of course red mage uses the same elements, they are a red mage. They have access to both white and black magic. Your argument would be better if red mage was summoning something. Which they aren't.

[MirronTulaxia]

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1. I'm talking about the Minstrels Ballad version. Where you actually fight the knights. They don't do healing. And in terms of the only explicit Conjurers we have, Edda doesn't do healing either when you fight her. Feel free to point at explicitly Conjurers that do heal, but what I'm seeing there aren't any.

2. Devil's Advocate is arguing an opposing position even if you don't agree with it. You're misusing the term.

3. FFIV Dance casts random White Magic, so healer fits. FFV Dancers have Sword Dance (hit four times), Drain HP, Drain MP, Confuse, and Charm. Most of their moves are offensive in nature, and Sword Dance is at its most effective at an appropriate range, which in FFV is melee for them. FFVI Mog is mostly a Caster or Healer with his Dance skills, not a ranged DPS. FFX-2 Dancer doesn't do any sort of ranged DPS elements, focusing mostly on debuffs with a couple of buffs. XI Dancers have Waltzes for curing, and in terms of weapons again the only weapon they have of note is Daggers, so a melee job. FFXII Penelo has Dance of Rapture, which is a healing spell, not listed as just Curaga, so again a healing dance. Otherwise she has buffs and debuffs. FFT Dancer is a full on debuff the entire team thing, to me mostly reads as a Caster DPS. Again in terms of weapons they only have melee weapons. Dimensions Dancers having healing, debuffs, and straight damage, again being stuck at melee range.

I've gone through every instance of Dancer. Of them, FFIV, FFVI, FFXI, FFXII RW, FFD all have some degree of healing. None of the jobs have ranged physical capabilities (again, some of them have what can only be described as supernatural effects given how broad they are) though. I don't know why "Dancer could have been a healer, it wouldn't be out of the ordinary with past instances" is such a big deal. Oh, forgot TA2 Penelo. Who goes an entirely different route than her XII RW version (so ostensibly same job but completely different effects) with mostly caster-like dances and a strong melee hit/debuffs. Again, Dancers could very easily have been healers.

4. The devs don't care if I see them as similar or not, certainly. But the devs have yet to say anything on the matter. Lore book saying they're similar to Conjurers (not White Mages) is kind of irrelevant because the bulk of the game you play a White Mage, not a Conjurer, and they've changed how the jobs work, along with the fact that lore carries zero weight on anything.

5. You're shifting to something entirely aside from the point. The point was about job fantasy, something that the developers have said zero times. Job fantasy is not dictated by elements to me. That's why I cited White Mages who use Fire, Water, and Earth, while Black Mages use Wind, Earth, and Water. To hear you talk about it these represent entirely different job fantasies.