So, what's your opinion on current healer jobs

[Hyperia]

I am happy with how WHM is played in the current game. I have been enjoying it since ShB release.

[Rasikko]

Okay holy nice.. but it doesnt help in savege :3 and in dugneon really does it matter?
I am not familiar with new savage tier but I do remember I had very hard time on e2s and e3s at pre-enrage phase if I dont have any lily available I will have hard time to deal with it.
However AST can handle it with ease (Heal check wave 1: Collective Unconscious Heal check wave 2: Earthly Star both skills instant cast and does not affect AST dps) I don't need to do any extra WHM healing I just DPS.

I think it was brilliant how you pulled the savage card once you got corrected about whm.

[Seraphor]

You're talking about variety of targets, we're referring to variety of buffs.
Thinking about who to use the card on is like saying choosing which mob to kill first in a pull is variety of choice.


On another note, everyone is just talking about savage and raiding. I'm talking about the general appeal of healers, you know, in solo mode, dungeons, normal trials, AST is just so tiring. WHM is like a walk in the park.
I don't like either, neither too easy nor too hard, that's why I enjoy big pulls, they are challenging but they shouldn't be straining.

You didn't have a variety of buffs.
You had Spire, Bole and Ewer, which you either Royal Roaded or Redrew.
Then you had Balance, Spear and Arrow, your dps cards.
Except you weren't the one receiving the buff, so how it dps wasn't an issue.

And no, Bole and Ewer were never critical. If they were ever needed, then what would you have done if you didn't draw them? Just go "oh well guys guess we wipe, sorry but RNG isn't on our side today"

[PharisHanasaki]

You didn't have a variety of buffs.
You had Spire, Bole and Ewer, which you either Royal Roaded or Redrew.
Then you had Balance, Spear and Arrow, your dps cards.
Except you weren't the one receiving the buff, so how it dps wasn't an issue.

And no, Bole and Ewer were never critical. If they were ever needed, then what would you have done if you didn't draw them? Just go "oh well guys guess we wipe, sorry but RNG isn't on our side today"

So, there is more than raiding to AST. You do MSQ, you play solo, in duns, in trials, in raids and savage.
You could extend the duration of the buffs. I could make much more than add damage to your parses.
I could recover MP, reduce recast and cast time, add another defense buff to a tb or raid wide aoe, or even myself to try and survive from a certain doom.
Was it RNG? Yes, but you had 2 chances, and with redraw you were sure you wouldn't get the same card. I've gotten the same card 5 times in a row with the new AST.

Everyone was just so worried about parses they always wanted the balance. It's not about numbers, it's about having fun and clearing.
Now it's honestly no fun at all. It's become literally a 'Job', buff your party to increase their beautiful numbers.

[elioaiko]

I am not happy with healers because even though the devs said that there would be more healing to do or "shift to more healing" prior to 5.0, it feels the same but they gutted their DPS kits so healing is even more boring.

My opinion on WHM is that while it was improved on in several ways, there's a lot to be desired. The lillies are moving in a better direction, but WHM in my opinion needs more than just "big healing and big damage." It needs more utility but the devs refuse to give them anything than more healing spells. As far as their utility is concerned in SB, they had none.

AST had cards, and time extenders and SCH had Chain and Fey Wind, Illumination, and Covenant. While some of those got combined or deleted (rip Time Mage AST), they still have more value than WHM's current utility. WHM got Temperance, a 10% mitigation with more healing and a Mantra add-on to Asylum. Both SCH and AST still have more value. But the unfortunate part is, that both SCH and AST aren't as fun to part anymore (at least for me) and were altered to match WHM's level rather than bring WHM up to their level.

Personally SCH and AST were in much better positions in SB just due to how fun they were (especially AST). But SE didn't want people bullying WHM players anymore and brought the other two down.

But as someone said, the change to rDPS made more selfish jobs more favorable so there isn't real bullying over job choices anymore.

While I do understand the card change, it's very unfortunate that they couldn't find a happy medium with the old system. And I agree, AST's opener is pure hell. It's funny that the devs wanted less RNG with the cards but fishing for seals is also pretty tedious so it's the same feeling honestly but now controller players suffer.

I really hope they truly fix healers or they'll just have another expansion of messy healer balance. Tbh, after raiding for a two expansions, I'd rather have fun raiding on healers with unique and rewarding job mechanics than perfect numbers.

[Insertusernamehere]

What is wrong with "savage card".. savage only challenge game offers. For dungeon clearing I don't play healer I just get instant queue with tank or solo it if its for glam / mount / khloe etc.
This is my personal opinion.. Not saying its suitable for everyone or every game style. but right now only healer with flexible utility kit AST they can even solo heal some savage challenges.

[SpiralMask]

my 2 gil for the thread: most of my experience is with SCH (mained through SB, dropped after ShB initial story), but the continual lamentations of my FC mates (a previous WHM main and a previous SCH main, respectively) at least seemingly supports it my thoughts on the others.
they're all very samey with SE very overtly trying to bring everyone into line at the cost of any soul remaining to the classes--all the AST card lore is entirely untrue now along with the complete removal to all mentions of time-based skills outside of lightspeed (because they still needed a class-specific means to conserve mana with the rework), WHM's entire repertoire is just "small holy" now after discarding the entirety of it's CNJ nature roots, and so on.

on top of that they're incredibly boring, with every class having far more healing options than they need (and all fairly powerful, so there's a lot of redundancy) and nothing to do when everyone is topped up and no healing is required. no, spamming broil for an hour while refreshing a universal DoT doesn't count. previously AST had it's card mechanics for moment-to-moment decisions and downtime activity so only having one offensive and dot spell was relatively painless, and SCH had it's suite of DoTs to keep track of. WHM had very little to do, which was a sad case for the class that folks wanted changed, to which SE replied "let's just remove the other two's downtime activity instead of giving WHM something to do", and then gave AST and SCH weird "must be in-combat" limitations for their mechanics (seals and aetherflow respectively) that they have to hit something to actually count as "in combat", it doesn't count even if they're healing an ally in combat.

I'd be fine accepting these changes if going forward meant that new skills could be added onto this generic "base" kit across them to help branch back out into unique classes again, except we're at the button limit already, so next expansion will have to gut them all again to spread out their skills from 1-90 and make room for the additional 1-2 skills given to 'sell' the new content, or require yet another complete rework.

[PharisHanasaki]

What is wrong with "savage card".. savage only challenge game offers. For dungeon clearing I don't play healer I just get instant queue with tank or solo it if its for glam / mount / khloe etc.
This is my personal opinion.. Not saying its suitable for everyone or every game style. but right now only healer with flexible utility kit AST they can even solo heal some savage challenges.

You need to read your previous posts in order to understand what they meant about the "savage card".

No one is saying anything about you having your own opinion. Just corrected some misinformation. But if you don't play healer outside of savage, I feel your opinion is biased. Running different content, including dungeons, is common for us healer mains, and it feels nothing like it did before.

[LaylaTsarra]

I am happy with how WHM is played in the current game. I have been enjoying it since ShB release.

I love it too. So much better than it was before for me at least and I enjoy healing. I don't find it boring at all. I don't do savage and reading stuff in threads like this I'm frankly glad I don't.

[rachcouture]

As someone that mained healer from ARR but now only plays PLD: all three are in awful shape, albeit at different spots on the scale.

WHM fairs the best, but it isn't good, either. Lilies are arguably more useless than before; Clones of Cure II and Medica without a cast time are extremely unnecessary for anyone that knows how to precast properly, and having both of these Afflatus Skills still adhere to the GCD makes for an extremely awkward flow when they are used. Afflatus Misery is nice, I guess, but I don't get to see it often unless I intentionally waste Afflatus Solace casts JUST to get three lily stacks. Either way, I'd rather having Aero III back instead, and exchange Divine Benison for Stoneskin at its original level 34 slot. Temperance—offering much needed support—serves as the only real solid step forward outside of not completely butchering the class.

SCH... while I appreciate merging Bio and Miasma into a single spell, as well as finally having an AoE attack after losing Blizzard II as a cross class years ago, the lack of Miasma II and/or Shadow Flare as AoE DoT options hurts greatly. Removing Selene in all but name and image—the more useful of the two fairies, particularly in two healer setups—severely guts the tactician aspect of Scholar's identity. Alternating between both Eos and Selene made for arguably the most complex, but rewarding healer of the three, and Seraph, while visually adorable, doesn't make up for the loss when I almost never need (if at all) the extra healing/shield output.

AST is a joke. Outside of its hybrid nature, the entire identity of AST hinged on the flexible wabi sabi of its original card system. The "I only fish for Balance" complaints were a manufactured issue at best; all six cards were extremely useful if you knew the when, why, and how of using them. Never once was it cumbersome to use, even on controller. Reducing the gameplay down into what's essentially one card (no, having one for melee and ranged doesn't make them unique) with a needlessly abstract single target-only deployment method is as insulting as it is infantilizing, trampling over the lore of the class while also treating the playerbase like they're incapable of any agency. Celestial Intersection and Neutral Sect may be nice additions, even if they're limited level 80 content only, but neither make up for what may be THE worst design decision in the history of FFXIV.