Remove melee throw weapon abilities?

[Akiudo]

I think the fact that they do disrupt combo makes it a little more interesting as well as satisfying when you manage to finish a combo right before having to move away. It also give more value to the Skill Speed substat. I believe melee should still mostly be melee, they'd be half ranged if those throwing abilities didn't break combo and had a combo of themselves, it imo removes some of the charm of being a melee and I think you can expect an overall dps nerf to compensate for their ability to have no downtime at all without sacrificing anything.

while i'm pretty sure square would just let this slide as "quality of life" just like a lot of other things that on paper shouldn't raise the potential of a class which in practice totally do buff a class at pretty much all percentiles this isn't so much about "losing nothing"

if you can do 100% damage in melee range or 50-75% of your damage while away from the boss you would still allways want to be close to the boss to maximize damage, that would not be "sacrificing nothing". problem is right now the ranged attacks melees (and tanks) have to offer are so weak, oftentimes its better to simply do nothing than to even use your ranged attack which is okay i guess, but at least as far as raids go it indeed makes them pretty redundant.

[Kuroka]

Could we just settle for, lets say, every job shoud have its ranged and aoe skill around 22 or smt?

[SpeckledBurd]

I don't think there's a need to remove thrown skills, they have their own niche uses. I agree with the sentiment that they shouldn't break combos or at the very least that there should be instances where they don't break combos, such as Enhanced Enpi.

On the AOE topic, every DPS job should have at least one AOE skill by level 15 so they can enter Sastasha and use it to learn the proper place for AOE, and whatever their basic AOE loop is should be in place by level ~50. A gauge's AOE uses should be in play as soon as you get your gauge, or near where you get your gauge.

It's insane that Dragoon for example has it's second and third AOE steps at level 62 and 72 respectively. On top of Doomspike at 15 it should have Sonic Thrust at level 40 where it gets Doom Spike, the effect should be changed to "Refreshes Disembowel" and Coerthan Torment should be earned at level 54 with Blood of the Dragon.

[Kabooa]

I think every non-caster job needs a roadmap revamp when it comes to their skills and when they learn them.

There are mostly minor ones, but a few major ones that largely don't make sense, or hamper the enjoyment of leveling a job. Some abilities, particularly those that are only useful in a party, or in very niche cases you will not run into until higher end content, feel pretty bad to get during dry spells.

[Kuroka]

I think every non-caster job needs a roadmap revamp when it comes to their skills and when they learn them.

There are mostly minor ones, but a few major ones that largely don't make sense, or hamper the enjoyment of leveling a job. Some abilities, particularly those that are only useful in a party, or in very niche cases you will not run into until higher end content, feel pretty bad to get during dry spells.

*looks at pala gabcloser*

[Awha]

Every class should get one AoE at level 15.

[Eliadil]

To be honest, I think that instead of removing them, because they can have a lot of use, making sure that it's not an ability that you can use only if you finish a combo would be better. As an example, there's no reason why there is so much emphasis on boosting Enpi with Enhanced Enpi (using backdash to proc e.Enpi) while still having this ability interrupt melee combo. Enhanced Enpi is not even dps neutral in the first place, you lose kenki/dps by using it even when you don't break combo. Throwing Daggers, Spear Throw and Enpi should not interrupt combo, just like Meditation for monk doesn't cancel the form you're in. (Because Meditation was and still is the primary "short disengage" tool for monk anyway)

As for AoE, I think that the level you earn them needs to be standardized too. I mean... Even tanks don't have "standard" leveling curves. Some tanks will have an AoE combo really, really early, others will not until level 72 as an example. It's a bit identical for melee too, but I also think that it's also due to how strong those aoes are it will likely stay like that. Dragoon base AoE is kinda strong at low level. It's 170 potency at level 40, compared to the 100 potency aoe earned at level 26 by sam. Giving access to "too strong" aoes too early is a bad idea imo.
One thing that could be changed is maybe the ninja one, which you earn kinda late. Later than your flame ninjutsu in fact. Imo you could get it way earlier without disrupting the overall leveling flow of the job too much.

[ForteNightshade]

I think the fact that they do disrupt combo makes it a little more interesting as well as satisfying when you manage to finish a combo right before having to move away. It also give more value to the Skill Speed substat. I believe melee should still mostly be melee, they'd be half ranged if those throwing abilities didn't break combo and had a combo of themselves, it imo removes some of the charm of being a melee and I think you can expect an overall dps nerf to compensate for their ability to have no downtime at all without sacrificing anything.

There is zero interest in Piercing Talon were it breaking your combo makes it functionally worthless. It takes four uses for Piercing Talon to beat Full Thrust. And that isn't including the damage lost for breaking your combo. This is why it's actually better for Dragoons to do literally nothing than ever touch Piercing Talon. Even in E8S, which is absolutely brutal for melee, Dragoon will resort to their AoE combo or just do nothing since combos last 15 seconds.

All that aside, why would any of the Melee need a nerf? Even if they buffed Piercing Talon to say, 300 potency. It's still a damage loss, thus something you'll avoid. Of course, I'm also in the camp Range DPS shouldn't be taxed nearly as much (or really, at all). So buff them and it's all a wash.

[Liam_Harper]

I think the fact that they do disrupt combo makes it a little more interesting as well as satisfying when you manage to finish a combo right before having to move away. It also give more value to the Skill Speed substat. I believe melee should still mostly be melee, they'd be half ranged if those throwing abilities didn't break combo and had a combo of themselves, it imo removes some of the charm of being a melee and I think you can expect an overall dps nerf to compensate for their ability to have no downtime at all without sacrificing anything.

You're being sarcastic right? Tell me you're just trolling...

[Kabooa]

You're being sarcastic right? Tell me you're just trolling...

The less conflict a kit has, the less interesting it is to make any choices within them.

Making something desirable to use is easy, but making it meaningful as well is where it gets difficult.