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  1. #1
    Player
    AnotherPerson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Posts
    1,208
    Character
    Cain Andleft
    World
    Malboro
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Gemina View Post

    Since it's been a bit difficult trying to think of that many, I split up the defense increase. What I came up with was:
    Physical def increase
    Magical def increase
    Positional requirements removed (only benefits jobs that require them)
    Increased HP regeneration
    Increased MP regeneration (only benefits mana users)
    Increased movement speed (Peloton can't be used during battle so I wonder if this is a strict no no)
    ============
    Cards that either physical def and magic def is a bad idea - you can't choose which one you'll get and if a boss you're fighting or in regular dungeons don't do that damage, it becomes a useless draw. We want to avoid having "useless" draw cards, so every card should work for any situation, but the difference is how cards can work better in some than in others. MP is a resource that will always be invaluable - no matter the composition and playstyle because [you] use that resource. Thus it will always have a place in the party as it's your third mana management tool.

    The problem with having DPS cards mixed in with other effects is fishing for only DPS cards. This can be addressed:
    1. Remove fishing ability and guarantee a level of certainty in drawing
    2. Adjust other card effects to be competitive enough to DPS without being a direct DPS buff (Essentially impossible unless other cards contribute to DPS or provides utility so powerful that forgoing DPS for powerful survival is a worthwhile trade, but you will have other healers complain about utility after)
    3. Remove DPS gain from cards entirely and DPS gain be an extension to the seal system - buffing all allies with divination/somewhere else

    So 6 unique card effects with a draw system:
    1. Less RNG 3 Draw piles, 2 cards to a pile - This means 3 hotkeys for drawing and still has a small element of RNG, but effectively takes away the problem of not getting a defense when you need it and mana when you don't.
    2. RNG Old Spread no redraw ( Unstable DPS, cards must be adjusted/removed)

    Effects I can think of that don't impact "DPS" with a flat statistic on single targets:
    1. Increasing max HP 20% for 15 secs - Spear
    2. Increase Defense by 20% for 15 secs - Bole
    3. Restoring Mana by X potency for 15 secs (Useful for you so it will always have a place in the party) - Ewer
    4. Giving instant cast and 50% mana cost for X uses for 15 secs (Can be always useful for you & casters, so it will have a place in the party) - Spire
    5. Grant a 10% to 30% Defense buff that scales depending on the HP of the character you give the buff to (like Essential Dignity) - 'Balance'

    I can't call something that's an arrow without giving DPS. There's 2 definitions with Arrow - speed and penetrative power.
    Movement speed is completely useless on a 30 second cd - with peloton and sprint/boss throwing undodgeable AoE.
    Maybe Haste for 15 seconds BUT weaponskill attack speed can screw up rotations, so maybe not. SkS is
    (1)

  2. #2
    Player
    Gemina's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Dravania
    Posts
    5,778
    Character
    Gemina Lunarian
    World
    Siren
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by AnotherPerson View Post
    Cards that either physical def and magic def is a bad idea - you can't choose which one you'll get and if a boss you're fighting or in regular dungeons don't do that damage, it becomes a useless draw. We want to avoid having "useless" draw cards, so every card should work for any situation, but the difference is how cards can work better in some than in others. MP is a resource that will always be invaluable - no matter the composition and playstyle because [you] use that resource. Thus it will always have a place in the party as it's your third mana management tool.
    In my last post, I already pointed out that tying any utility to a RNG based card system doesn't work. This doesn't just apply to splitting up a defense buff. Avoiding useless or unfavorable draws is also something I brought up. That is why I proposed eliminating RNG almost entirely. When you draw, you draw all six cards, and then use them as the situation calls for them. If you still have cards left when Draw is about to come off of cooldown, Royal Road can return to burn them, or perhaps consumed by Minor Arcana.

    The problem with having DPS cards mixed in with other effects is fishing for only DPS cards. This can be addressed:
    1. Remove fishing ability and guarantee a level of certainty in drawing
    Addressed in my statement

    2. Adjust other card effects to be competitive enough to DPS without being a direct DPS buff (Essentially impossible unless other cards contribute to DPS or provides utility so powerful that forgoing DPS for powerful survival is a worthwhile trade, but you will have other healers complain about utility after)[/b]
    This is probably one of the biggest conundrums with the whole system. The only way the card system works is if all the cards contribute to rDPS, or none of them.

    3. Remove DPS gain from cards entirely and DPS gain be an extension to the seal system - buffing all allies with divination/somewhere else
    I'm wondering if you read my post in its entirety..


    Effects I can think of that don't impact "DPS" with a flat statistic on single targets:
    1. Increasing max HP 20% for 15 secs - Spear
    2. Increase Defense by 20% for 15 secs - Bole
    3. Restoring Mana by X potency for 15 secs (Useful for you so it will always have a place in the party) - Ewer
    4. Giving instant cast and 50% mana cost for X uses for 15 secs (Can be always useful for you & casters, so it will have a place in the party) - Spire
    5. Grant a 10% to 30% Defense buff that scales depending on the HP of the character you give the buff to (like Essential Dignity) - 'Balance'
    It's tough isn't it? When encounter design favors DPS contribution, it is extremely difficult to come up with DPS-free utility that is not only useful, but desired. And we're trying to come up with six.

    I can't call something that's an arrow without giving DPS. There's 2 definitions with Arrow - speed and penetrative power.
    Movement speed is completely useless on a 30 second cd - with peloton and sprint/boss throwing undodgeable AoE.
    Maybe Haste for 15 seconds BUT weaponskill attack speed can screw up rotations, so maybe not. SkS is
    Considering that both Arrow and Spear still boosted DPS somewhat (just not a flat increase like with Balance); it would actually be much easier to think of six different ways to - or three additional ways to increase rDPS than coming up with favorable effects for each card that also bring substance to the encounter.
    (1)
    Last edited by Gemina; 04-19-2020 at 05:30 PM.