It's time (Option to Hide other players Glamour)

[Sairys]

It's a Japanese game operating on a global scale, it isn't going to commit to one political stance over the other - especially when it's going to operate differently in specific regions. You know, like any business.

Personally as a gay guy I don't want Square Enix to take a stance one way or another. I want them to give players the tools to tweak the game to their personal tastes so that they can decide, within reason, how they want to explore it. They already do that on multiple fronts so this is really just a case of some people having an odd hangup about strangers not wanting to fawn over their character's design/glamour.

As also a gay guy (apparently that's relevant lol?) implementing a feature like this is actually taking a stance on some complex political issues, especially given the particular complaints that a significant portion of those requesting this option are basing their support for it on.

[Cithaerias_pyropina]

I want them to give players the tools to tweak the game to their personal tastes so that they can decide, within reason, how they want to explore it. They already do that on multiple fronts

Please do explain this, you bring this "tweaking" up constantly and never completely describe it, in fact you never describe it. Are these tweaks muting the master-volume? Muting voices? Muting music? Muting sounds? Muting system sounds? Muting Bard performance? Muting ambient sounds? All of which can be incredibly intrusive because hearing something is unlike seeing something? You can choose not to look at something you do not like, you cannot choose to not hear something you do not like. Auditory cues are far more powerful and intrusive than sight cues.

You hear that police car siren wailing down the street? You're immediately alert to its presence and will continue to be until its out of hearing distance or turned off. You see that police car going down the street with its sirens off? Doubt you'll even give it more than one glance. You hear those fireworks going off 5 miles away? Immediately alert. You see those fireworks going off 5 miles away that look like circles on the horizon? Your brain isn't going to have you look over there more than once once it analyzes they aren't a threat to your body, unless you choose to do so. Same deal with thunder and lightning. Thunder will startle you and grab your attention to a SIGNIFICANTLY greater extent than flashes of lightning ever will.

Disabling player battle effects? Disabling your own battle effects?

Those are there because they can physically obstruct your ability to see mechanics, or if you're playing on a low end PC they serve as a purpose to increase its performance by cutting out clutter. Being distracted by glamour can psychologically obstruct your ability to see mechanics, and that's a YOU problem. Learn how to free yourself from visual distractions. Because if you're too busy being offended by someone's glamour than you are paying attention to the dungeon, and not doing your job of dpsing, tanking or healing because you can't be da%#@$ to not be, then you may have some actual serious problems that you need to get sorted out.

I am neither for or against this idea, but I suppose you could say I am firmly against it because it wastes dev time. And if the devs never add this option I highly, and I mean HIGHLY, doubt any of you desperately wanting this option would unsubscribe from the game. And if the devs did add it none of the people vehemently against it would unsubscribe either.

So think of it this way, are the devs really going to spend any amount of time, even if it's so meager of time, to add this option when they don't need to because everything will just goes back to the way it was? They aren't going to lose money either way. So why even add it in the first place.

And with that, I'm done with this thread. It's the worlds biggest waste of time to argue for or against this when you're all addicted to the game and won't unsubscribe over something as trivial as being offended by that one Hrothgar in the wedding dress that you'll only ever see once in your expert dungeon and then never again.

[Theodric]

I've explained a number of times throughout the thread. The block function can be used for any reason whatsoever. Players have the luxury of freedom on that front. If someone is spamming chat with emotes or random nonsense they can toggle the block function on for that player. On the other hand, they could also opt to do it for no reason whatsoever and block players who they have never even interacted with.

Should the block function be removed because it supposedly infringes upon the rights of the players who are blocked for no discernible reason? No, it shouldn't. The people against this idea are mostly overthinking it. Client side tweaks are client side tweaks. It really has no bearing on other players as they're highly likely to never be aware that their glamour is being blocked and even if they are, they have no business dictating how other players tweak the game to their liking unless it involves third party tools which are illegal.

That aside, many people want the function to be implemented for various reasons as stated throughout the thread. As such, the hyper focus on specific glamour options is a bit odd when the function is requested for a broad purpose.

Ultimately I'm all about player choice. That means I'm fine with people asking for glamour options to be expanded. Though it also means that I'm all for people having the choice to opt out. I don't think there's anything particularly unfair or hypocritical about it. Yet for some reason many of those seeking to have the development team expand glamour options seem to want to 'get back' at players who do not like such things themselves. Which is all very strange to me!

[Sairys]

I've explained a number of times throughout the thread. The block function can be used for any reason whatsoever. Players have the luxury of freedom on that front. If someone is spamming chat with emotes or random nonsense they can toggle the block function on for that player. On the other hand, they could also opt to do it for no reason whatsoever and block players who they have never even interacted with.

Should the block function be removed because it supposedly infringes upon the rights of the players who are blocked for no discernible reason? No, it shouldn't. The people against this idea are mostly overthinking it. Client side tweaks are client side tweaks. It really has no bearing on other players as they're highly likely to never be aware that their glamour is being blocked and even if they are, they have no business dictating how other players tweak the game to their liking unless it involves third party tools which are illegal.

As has been raised to counter this attempt at a point, that a tool can be misused does not justify the creation of another tool based on that misuse.
Also, the examples generally brought up for blacklisting are ToS violations that you could file a report about, so the blacklist serves a functional purpose of letting you filter out the chats that are in violation while waiting for a GM to handle things, which is an argument that doesn't apply to glamours.

This also isn't a "client-side tweak" this is a request for the devs to invest time, which could be spent on say... content, to create a function which it appears there is less demand for than it actually would seem, given so many people on the "pro" side of this are claiming they wouldn't actually use it and are just arguing the point.

That aside, many people want the function to be implemented for various reasons as stated throughout the thread. As such, the hyper focus on specific glamour options is a bit odd when the function is requested for a broad purpose.

Ultimately I'm all about player choice. That means I'm fine with people asking for glamour options to be expanded. Though it also means that I'm all for people having the choice to opt out. I don't think there's anything particularly unfair or hypocritical about it. Yet for some reason many of those seeking to have the development team expand glamour options seem to want to 'get back' at players who do not like such things themselves. Which is all very strange to me!

A bunch of people have thrown out a bunch of different random suggestions to try to cover that the reason this thread started in the first place is those "specific glamour options". And from what I've seen most of those reasons haven't really held up.

Probably my favourite for the laughs is the complaints about maintaining the aesthetic and immersion of FFXIV by not dealing with people wearing inappropriate gearinto battle while Ryne is a trust character and the Crystal Exarch tanks in caster robes.

[DumdogsWorld]

This also isn't a "client-side tweak" this is a request for the devs to invest time

If their engine was designed in any sane manner, a programmer with basic skills could whip up a working version of the feature within hours.

If spaghetti code and poor engine design are really that bad in this game, then neither umbrellas, dungeons, nor this feature should be the priority of the developers - it should be making a new engine ASAP.

[Theodric]

Just because you don't accept those particular reasons it doesn't mean that they're not valid for anybody else's experience to be made more enjoyable. You're really not missing out by someone having a client side option added to the game for their benefit. Players already have the right and ability to decline interaction with somebody else for absolutely any reason they so please. They don't even need to explain their reasons, so long as they remain civil. If I make a party finder, I have no obligation to allow any player to join. Just as someone else has the same freedom to decline me for whatever reason they so please. Nobody is owed somebody else's time or attention. It's a game.

Just chalk it up to different interests or some such instead of assuming the worst about a person.

[Cithaerias_pyropina]

I've explained a number of times throughout the thread. The block function can be used for any reason whatsoever. Players have the luxury of freedom on that front. If someone is spamming chat with emotes or random nonsense they can toggle the block function on for that player. On the other hand, they could also opt to do it for no reason whatsoever and block players who they have never even interacted with.

Last and final post in this thread.

The block function is here to prevent someone from harassing someone to no end, which can drive the person being harassed to leave the game entirely or worse. It is the quintessential equivalent to getting a restraining order.

Should the block function be removed because it supposedly infringes upon the rights of the players who are blocked for no discernible reason?

All I can do is laugh at this, really? This is the probably the most inane thing I have ever read in these forums. Does getting a restraining order against someone harassing you in real life infringe upon their rights? If so then I guess getting restraining orders shouldn't be possible. Imagine the ramifications of that, someone being harassed and being unable to do anything about it legally would then turn to illegal solutions or worse. Would be a fantastic world to live in right?

Hence why the blacklist and restraining orders exist: to prevent bad scenarios from ever having the chance to occur.

Client side tweaks are client side tweaks. It really has no bearing on other players as they're highly likely to never be aware that their glamour is being blocked and even if they are, they have no business dictating how other players tweak the game to their liking.

This option is the same as telling people what they can and cannot wear, even if this is just client-side the fact remains, and you have no business doing that.

Ultimately I'm all about player choice. That means I'm fine with people asking for glamour options to be expanded. Though it also means that I'm all for people having the choice to opt out. I don't think there's anything particularly unfair or hypocritical about it. Yet for some reason many of those seeking to have the development team expand glamour options seem to want to 'get back' at players who do not like such things themselves. Which is all very strange to me!

Expanding glamour options increases the likelihood for people to come back to the game thus increasing profit and revenue.

This is in totality, especially from a business standpoint, a waste of dev time and money. Dev time and money which could be better spent creating new emotes, glamours or content in general which drives further profit and revenue. Or fixing the shoddy net-code holding the game back from massive QoL changes like being able to use glamour plates anywhere, increasing inventory space, using items while crafting or being able to accept party invites while talking to your retainers.

This option won't do anything, direct or indirect, to increase profits or revenue. It doesn't need to be added. Can it be added? Probably. Is it a total waste of time for something, that doesn't do anything for the greater good of the game, like this to be added? Yes.

It's not some emote people can buy or subscribe back to the game to get and play around with. It's not new content for people to subscribe back to the game for. It's not even a QoL feature that would physically, physically as in more inventory space or being able to accept invites while talking to your retainers, increase the experience of the game for anyone but those complaining about "offensive" glamour.

[Theodric]

Expanding glamour options increases the likelihood for people to come back to the game thus increasing profit and revenue.

So, too, does expanding the quality of life functions of the game. Which is very much what this change would qualify as. Not necessarily for you, specifically, but for other players? Most certainly.

We'll agree to disagree on everything else.

[Lambdafish]

snip

Before anyone else takes you seriously with your bullying train of thought, let me just remind everyone that the scenario is of the person being screenshotted wearing the default SCH AF gear. The one used in promotional material, the one that nobody would even bat an eyelid if they saw.

Get over yourself please, nobody is going to bully you because you look like a default SCH on one particular persons screen. On top of that, you would be surrounded by other people also in default AF gear, and let me say this for the millionth time, only on the screen of someone who chose that setting.

Harassment is way easier with the tools we currently have. Shall we just remove gpose because someone can edit what you are doing? Should be ban screenshots entirely because you can't handle being in a public space? Should we ban chat because it allows strangers to talk to you?

We have report tools for a reason, and you always run the risk of negativity in a public space whether it be in game or outside of that game. Where do you draw the line? You draw the line at something that doesn't impact you but might impact someone else's play experience.

[DumdogsWorld]

This option is the same as telling people what they can and cannot wear, even if this is just client-side the fact remains, and you have no business doing that.

As has been ruthlessly debating about throughout this thread, this is also a completely subjective viewpoint. It's moot to keep going on about it. Instead, why don't we discuss another issue that has been mentioned throughout this thread, albeit indirectly?

People keep saying dev time this and dev resources that, but it remains that Square Enix is, contrary to what the memes might indicate, an enormous company with lots of money and resources. Why must we have to sacrifice one potential feature in favor of another, when we could have both?

Let's discuss that, please.