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  1. #1
    Player
    Zabuza's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    724
    Character
    Zefis Shadowsea
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 60
    Quote Originally Posted by Sebazy View Post
    All I'm seeing is buzzwords.

    Where's the content in this sandwich?
    You cannot see what I am trying to convey, even with the quotes? Fine, I'll lay it out. Many of the people here preach tolerance, while practicing intolerance.

    Quote Originally Posted by Penthea View Post
    It is so funny that some are trying to equate removing glams to a blacklist.

    You cannot harass someone with only clothes from a game. If you feel harassed by someone else's wardrobe, you need to do some serious self reflection. No one in this game can wear a t-shirt that says "lalafells suck" or "<player name> is a noob". You literally cannot harass by just wearing clothes in this game.

    A person could stand on top of you and emote spam or follow you around, but this would be annoying regardless of their wardrobe. The person's actions would be the harassment, not their clothing. SE may take a report of being consistently followed seriously, but the added detail of "they were in a pig suit" wouldn't matter in the slightest to them.
    I'm glad you can speak for everyone. Perhaps to some, especially someone who is quite religious, seeing a big Roe in a dress is more offensive than all the verbal blasphemies one could muster. Before you ask, no, I'm not deeply religious and think you can wear whatever you want. However, my mind is at least open enough to acknowledge that different people can have different preferences and things that offend them. Why is it okay for you to be offended by certain things but not okay for these people to have things they are offended by? Who are you to be the arbiter of what other people are allowed to be offended by?
    (9)
    Last edited by Zabuza; 02-18-2020 at 09:05 AM.

  2. #2
    Player
    Sebazy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    3,468
    Character
    Sebazy Spiritwalker
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Zabuza View Post
    You cannot see what I am trying to convey, even with the quotes? Fine, I'll lay it out. Many of the people here preach tolerance, while practicing intolerance.
    And it still feels like you're banding it around like a buzzword when there's no meaning behind it.

    You could say that I'm intolerant towards two things within this thread.

    1) I'm firmly against something that will diminish the breadth and variety of people that one will 'experience' within this game

    2) And in turn the root of my objection here, I'm very firmly against anything that further encourages the dehumanisation and devaluation of other players where it is explicitly not warranted (aka /blist for spam or abuse reasons).

    If that makes me intolerant then that's a flag I'll proudly fly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zabuza View Post
    Seeing a big Roe in a dress is more offensive than all the verbal blasphemies one could muster.
    Ok yeah, this is getting a bit silly now. GLHF =(
    (11)
    Last edited by Sebazy; 02-18-2020 at 09:13 AM.
    ~ WHM / badSCH / Snob ~ http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/character/871132/ ~

  3. #3
    Player
    Zabuza's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    724
    Character
    Zefis Shadowsea
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 60
    Quote Originally Posted by Sebazy View Post
    Ok yeah, this is getting a bit silly now. GLHF =(
    You really copy pasted just that part of my sentence without the full context? Talk about deceptive. You also proved my point, that people aren't allowed to dislike Roes in dresses but apparently they are allowed to dislike profanity. Who are you to be the judge of that?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sairys View Post
    Not happy with someone else editing how you represented yourself?
    They aren't just seeing it on their screen, now are they? They purposely cut out just that section to make me look like a bigot when I've been arguing for consistent tolerance across the board. I bet you think you're very clever. I finally reached my post limit so I'm done for the day.

    Quote Originally Posted by Penthea View Post
    Cuchulainn is one of the most celebrated heroes of my country's folklore, and probably the most disgusting looking creature in the whole game has his name. Furthermore other figures from my county's folklore are names of voidsent. On top of that, the fuath in Il Mheg, their name is the irish for "hate".

    If I was an overly sensitive person I would have been insulted to see something important to my country be displayed as evil misshapen monsters, and to see my language to be used as a way to name evil creatures.

    But I'm not upset by this. Why? Because I understand that it isn't a deliberate attempt to offend irish or scottish people (we share folklore and our gaelic languages have similarities). Just the same as how my muslim friends in the game understand that a male character in a dress isn't necessarily a deliberate attempt to offend them. Sometimes it is simply a person who likes to wear a dress.

    Do not pull the religion card. I know people who have faiths that are typically seen as very intolerant, to not be bothered by anything they have seen in the game.

    It is actually disgusting how you try to use religion to push your glam removal agenda.
    Lol. I was giving you an example of where someone might be offended by clothing choices. No surprise you got offended by that, too. Do you still deny that some people put on absurd outfits and follow people around for the sole purpose of harassment? If you do not deny it then ask yourself, why would they do that if they didn't think it irritated anyone? If you do deny it you must be oblivious, for I have seen several times with my own eyes large, animal-suited individuals circling around people and following them, me included once.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sebazy View Post
    I'll admit that I chuckled at it. Am I allowed to say big oof?:
    You can say big oof all you like. It's not equivalent. Everyone browsing this thread now has seen the public misrepresentation. Not the same thing as one person seeing it on their screen and sharing it with no one.
    (5)
    Last edited by Zabuza; 02-18-2020 at 09:33 AM.

  4. #4
    Player
    Sairys's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Posts
    184
    Character
    Senu'a Retkha
    World
    Ravana
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Zabuza View Post
    You really copy pasted just that part of my sentence without the full context? Talk about deceptive.
    Not happy with someone else editing how you represented yourself?
    (14)

  5. #5
    Player
    Sebazy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    3,468
    Character
    Sebazy Spiritwalker
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Zabuza View Post
    They aren't just seeing it on their screen, now are they? I bet you think you're very clever. I finally reached my post limit so I'm done for the day.
    I'll admit that I chuckled at it. Am I allowed to say big oof?

    I'm not going to bite on your other points if you can't debate back, genuine shame about the post limit and I mean that sincerely, it's been entertaining even if not very productive
    (4)
    ~ WHM / badSCH / Snob ~ http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/character/871132/ ~

  6. #6
    Player
    Penthea's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    3,664
    Character
    Nettle Creidne
    World
    Moogle
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Zabuza View Post
    I'm glad you can speak for everyone. Perhaps to some, especially someone who is quite religious, seeing a big Roe in a dress is more offensive than all the verbal blasphemies one could muster.
    Cúchulainn is one of the most celebrated heroes of my country's folklore, and probably the most disgusting looking creature in the whole game has his name. Furthermore other figures from my county's folklore are names of voidsent. On top of that, the fuath in Il Mheg, their name is the irish for "hate".

    If I was an overly sensitive person I would have been insulted to see something important to my country be displayed as evil misshapen monsters, and to see my language be used as a way to name evil creatures.

    But I'm not upset by this. Why? Because I understand that it isn't a deliberate attempt to offend irish or scottish people (we share folklore and our gaelic languages have similarities). Just the same as how my muslim friends in the game understand that a male character in a dress isn't necessarily a deliberate attempt to offend them. Sometimes it is simply a person who likes to wear a dress.

    Do not pull the religion card. I know people who have faiths that are typically seen as very intolerant, to not be bothered by anything they have seen in the game.

    It is actually disgusting how you try to use religion to push your glam removal agenda.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zabuza View Post
    Do you still deny that some people put on absurd outfits and follow people around for the sole purpose of harassment?
    I would get annoyed by this because someone is following me. Not because they're wearing any specific sort of outfit. If I were to report them I would report that they are following me, and I would say nothing about the outfit that they're wearing. The act of wearing an outfit someone dislikes is not a punishable offence, even if they are committing other offences while wearing it.
    (12)
    Last edited by Penthea; 02-18-2020 at 10:12 AM. Reason: a few typos