Quote Originally Posted by MikkoAkure View Post
One of the Warriors of Light from Ivalice straight up betrayed Hydaelyn.

Also Zenos and Fordola have artificial versions of the echo and are immune to tempering as well so you can’t say “WoL can’t be tempered bc they’re already tempered by Hydaelyn”.

I really don’t understand at all why people seem to think Hydaelyn is subversive and is using us and has us tempered. Sure, I don’t think Emet was lying about her being a primal and he has no reason to, but her whole schtick is free will. What is the point of enslaving our minds to do the right thing and save everyone? She does other things that aren’t like normal primal too, such as lack of religion/worshipers. Per Koji himself, Other than the Path of Twelve, the city leaders, and a few others, most of the world doesn’t know anything about the mothercrystal and they don’t even know the planet is called Hydaelyn.
We infer from the evidence we have that it is the Echo that prevents people from being tempered by Primals. But Fordola and Zenos have a manufactured Echo. However the evidence shows that this prevents Fordola from being tempered too. Nothing about any of those three statements demonstrates that the WoL hasn't been tempered so I'm confused how you are inferring that.

I'm not sure where the concept that Hydaelyn represents free will comes from. Hydaelyn represents a last ditch, desperate attempt by the 14th and (possibly) others to stop the rest of their people from sacrificing the new life Zodiark created. Her existence is predicated on opposing Zodiark and his followers. That's it. She certainly didn't offer Minfilia a choice when she had Minfilia run back into range of Y'shtola's Flow spell. It may be that Minfilia would have agreed, but she was never offered the option.

I have no idea whether the WoL has been tempered or not, I am just genuinely confused by the ardor with which people embrace the idea they haven't. Just as they embrace the idea that Zodiark is bad, Hydaelyn good. Personally I am waiting until I have something definitive to base my conclusions on.