One dungeon per patch!?

[AmeliaVerves]

Just bc I dislike it and decide not to participate doesn't negate it's existance and the work it took.

idk dude, if you don't like most of the content thats fair, me neither, but ranting about how bad everything is and not being constructive is just not helpful.
This thread was especially about loosing one dungeon and imo it's not a great loss, because we have dozens of dungeons already and they're all the same and so will the future ones (probably) be. Does it suck? Ye sure, but at the end of the day there is just so much we can do.
Bring up your ideas and what you would like to see in the game in an adult manner instead of "you added this and that but I DO NOT LIKE THAT SO IT'S BAD".

Do we really need BLU in this game? Or niche fishing stuff? Maybe for someone, but at least dont take things from people who are not interested in this "content"

Apparently we need BLU bc a whole lot of ppl are participating and playing BLU. We literally have discords designated to build BLU statics to do raids and PF is (at least kinda) alive again with ppl doing BLU content.
As I said, if you dislike it thats fair and all, but others want and like it and I would argue that BLU is not niche at this point. So many ppl are enjoying it, from HC raiders to casual players, so I guess it's a success?

[Mansion]

Apparently we need BLU bc a whole lot of ppl are participating and playing BLU. We literally have discords designated to build BLU statics to do raids and PF is (at least kinda) alive again with ppl doing BLU content.
As I said, if you dislike it thats fair and all, but others want and like it and I would argue that BLU is not niche at this point. So many ppl are enjoying it, from HC raiders to casual players, so I guess it's a success?

I don't know if that's enough to make it a success. While people do run BLU content, it does not mean that it still has flaws and there's still a lot of negative feedback coming on the forums. They can't say "people played it thus enjoyed it", I guess it's more about the long run, achievement check, that kind of stuff. And BLU starts relying a bit too much on preexisting content rather than original creation (in my opinion at least) so it's getting its nice little spot in the cycle of patches like all content we've had since 3.X

There is some truth in what yukiiyuki says though. Essentially, we have very little original content content per expansion, but more of the same thing with a different wrapping. It's a safe route to get content in the patch cycle, but it can be underwhelming for players that have been around for a while.
Personally, I don't mind same iterations of stuff like Raids / Trials as long as the fights themselves are good enough to keep me entertained. But I'm pretty sure it would be the same if instead of Heaven on High and potentially the 5.3 deep dungeon we had some kind of expansion updates to the Palace of the Dead itself, adding level cap, new maps and new stuff there, same for the treasure map dungeons. And it could potentially add up on resource economy to focus on real new content... or actually improving on what already exists. The perfect example for me really is PotD and HoH. HoH does not improve anything on PotD at all.

[AmeliaVerves]

"people played it thus enjoyed it"

This is exactly a companies point of view, tho. They check their logs and see "ok, ppl are participating in large numbers so we did good", same with Eureka back then. Even tho ppl were unhappy, a lot still participated.

In the end we do get a lot of re-used content and I am not happy about that either, but I just generally disagree with the way some ppl voice their opinion, like "i dont like, so dis bad". Since I am mostly raiding in this game, ofc I was highly unhappy and lowkey upset about getting old primal fights re-done as raids (Leviathan and Titan) and the community spoke up about it, which was fair but should also be done in a constructive manner imo.

I'm absolutely in the same boat of asking for better job balancing, more diverse difficulties in the game (including more game modes to achieve this) and an actually existing learning/improving experience, but we gotta admit that a lot of ppl are asking for this side content of BLU, GPose improvements, performance and 'RP housing stuff idk' and therefore SE is adding all of this. So maybe ask for the things you want/like without diminishing the types of content other ppl want/like? Bc obv there is a need for all these things otherwise SE wouldn't put the money and work to add this.

[Mansion]

This is exactly a companies point of view, tho. They check their logs and see "ok, ppl are participating in large numbers so we did good", same with Eureka back then. Even tho ppl were unhappy, a lot still participated.

Yes but Eureka is a good example of how they did more than just look at the numbers. They did listen to feedback, and they tried something new with either Logos or Baldesion, and were quite surprised with the latter's success. I'm pretty sure that by the figures alone, they would have seen something was wrong during Pagos. I know a lot of players that were okay with Anemos but dropped in Pagos. And we came after the buffs to catch Pyros, and it was smooth sailing from here...
And despite its bad reputation on the forum, Eureka was popular, always full when it was relevant, a lot of people got their weapon, and some people even went through it just for baldesion.
I wouldn't say the same for BLU between 4.5 and 5.1 for instance.

[Lambdafish]

I don't know if that's enough to make it a success. While people do run BLU content, it does not mean that it still has flaws and there's still a lot of negative feedback coming on the forums. They can't say "people played it thus enjoyed it", I guess it's more about the long run, achievement check, that kind of stuff. And BLU starts relying a bit too much on preexisting content rather than original creation (in my opinion at least) so it's getting its nice little spot in the cycle of patches like all content we've had since 3.X

From what I have seen, the majority of BLU complaints and BLU "meming" is coming from people who either have not levelled the job, or have a vendetta against what BLU is in this game based on a fixed idea of what they want it to be (mostly a full job). IMO, BLUs true failing in its implementation is its designation as a "limited" job. What SE should have done is designated it as a separate kind of job, much like DoH and DoL (maybe calling it a disciple of collection?). Naming it limited job put them in a lose lose situation where all people would see is a job that is restricted, rather than a whole new way to play the game (which people who are actually playing BLU, particularly in 5.15, are recognising and thoroughly enjoying).

[yukiiyuki]

"you added this and that but I DO NOT LIKE THAT SO IT'S BAD".

Its not bad, that they added it. Its bad, that they took chunk of battle content, while repeating same old stuff in new wrapping.
Hands down I would be happy if they just make one dungeon with different diffucultes, making 4 person content more entertaning, but we all know that it wont happen.

[Lambdafish]

Its not bad, that they added it. Its bad, that they took chunk of battle content, while repeating same old stuff in new wrapping.
Hands down I would be happy if they just make one dungeon with different diffucultes, making 4 person content more entertaning, but we all know that it wont happen.

Why wouldn't that happen? Mythic dungeons are an idea that the community has been keen on for a while, and if the devs did it right they could be a very cost effective piece of content, much like ultimate.

[Shurrikhan]

Why wouldn't that happen? Mythic dungeons are an idea that the community has been keen on for a while, and if the devs did it right they could be a very cost effective piece of content, much like ultimate.

Probably far more efficient, even, past the initial costs for the system.

Though, personally, I hope they might wait just the bit longer to develop something not only unique, but also cohesive. (Granted, I'll admit the devs here have a poor record for sort of thing.) I'd rather see where XIV components can lead that might do as Mythic dungeons did for WoW, and reap that potential among other areas, than just see what XIV components can best create a knockoff Mythic+ experience.

I do of course think the devs need to really think about how to put in efficient design, especially in the areas it's most lacking (e.g. PuG-friendly midcore content that rewards awareness, competence, and/or strategy rather than almost solely memorization), and something like Mythic design would be a perfect target for backwards design. But, sometimes I feel like the game really lacks for a cohesion of its own.

It's often like they're just throwing out darts almost randomly and hoping they'll learn at least some small part of a lesson later -- in roughly equal portion between targeting grind value (one might say, the lowest form of efficiency), imitation of other game's systems, and defensively applied malicious compliance ("well, you complained about getting too much, so how about too little?!"). Until they can more consistently and obviously build towards more ambitious long-term plans, prototyping parts relatively smoothly into the common experience before stepping it up a little more each major patch or so, even the best systems and targets aren't going to keep the game from stagnating or further showing its cracks. I don't know what to do about it, but it does make me concerned for short-term solutions over longer-minded approaches, wherever the two might come into conflict.

[linay]

Its bad, that they took chunk of battle content, while repeating same old stuff in new wrapping.

A dungeon is the typical example of "same old stuff in new wrapping," especially the Hard mode versions. It's still enjoyable to me, but don't complain about a decrease in dungeon content while complaining about "same old stuff in new wrapping."

[reivaxe]

"you added this and that but I DO NOT LIKE THAT SO IT'S BAD".

Pretty much.

It's foolish to think that regardless of how big this game is they would just never trim fat to reallocate resources and man power.
Why mindlessly keep hiring new people to make new things as you pump tons of men power and time into dngs then you KNOW you have a stupid ton already and they're not very different now (because shocker, most people don't like having to spend 40+ mins in a dng cause they forgot how to get through it. They make them basically the same tunnel over and over now cause it's what people wanted and needed with the number of possible dngs have now)? Why not make fewer new dngs so you can make Eureka and HoH and so on with this creative team of modelers, animators and so on?
Hell, I am 100% sure they're not gonna make the genders to the latest races but the only thing that gives me even a dot of hope is that they now decided to do one of the things I figured they would have to do to free up the men power needed to do it (make fewer dngs).

Seems like no matter what they add some people here wont make the connection.

(also fyi to some people in this thread, Eureka is a glowing success. It's still very active, even more so in these down time months. I was able to go back and smash out 3 more relics recently. Sure, it's not as popping as it was in it's prime ... but there are STILL people doing BA runs and starting their relic journey and it's not uncommon to see 140ish people doing trains on my casual af DC. On the flip side it was almost impossible for me to get a SB 24 men raid to pop today ... so yeah, I see the appeal to leaning into that)