Patch 5.10 Current state of physical range jobs' balance is unfair.

[Doozer]

I don't know what game you're playing, but in the average content as a MCH I out-DPS everyone I encounter. And I seriously doubt SE would make specific jobs impossible to clear content with.

[CKNovel]

I don't know what game you're playing, but in the average content as a MCH I out-DPS everyone I encounter. And I seriously doubt SE would make specific jobs impossible to clear content with.

I don't know what game you're playing but average content would mean Leveling Dungeon. Endgame normal content would be normal raid where DPS doesn't matter. DPS only matters in savage and ultimate content.

MCH is the best of the worst, like the best competitor among kids.
BRD is shining against multiple targets.
DNC is shining against multiple targets aswell but performs better than the BRD against a lone target.
I should almost includes RDM because it's so low here and can easily be replaced with the extremely mobile/high damage SMN.

It's not fair, indeed, to be so far behind the SMN (1K DPS behind for the MCH on a lone target), a job as mobile as a ranged but with extra support.

MCH could have a very slight buff, the only thing, in my opinion would be to halve Wildfire's cooldown, that would be around 400-500 dps increase. I would love to see a small buff on Bio Blaster, it's our only alternative for AoE but is a very small gain against 2 targets. Half of Alexander Ultimate is against 2 targets.
BRD and DNC needs a straight potency buff, the dot nerf was not a nerf for the BRD overrall but balancing for its rDPS. However, it was absolutely not needed.

There is one reason as to why you should bring a ranged DPS in your group.
Is it the mobility? Hell no.
Is it the refresh, palisade, dismantle, tp song? That's gone.
Is it the Tactician/Troubadour/Samba? Unmend salutes you, despite the Cooldown reduction, mitigation is never the reason.
Is it for its DPS? They're at the bottoms.

It's the 1% stats brought to the group because you exist. That's the whole reason why you should always have a ranged DPS.
The ranged DPS spot is forced upon groups, that's the only reason why you should get a ranged and that's why it feels unfair. Obviously a ranged should never reach the same damages as a melee for obvious reasons, but we're so shitty SE forces people to get a ranged DPS.

[Akiudo]

I don't know what game you're playing but average content would mean Leveling Dungeon. Endgame normal content would be normal raid where DPS doesn't matter. DPS only matters in savage and ultimate content.

MCH is the best of the worst, like the best competitor among kids.
BRD is shining against multiple targets.
DNC is shining against multiple targets aswell but performs better than the BRD against a lone target.
I should almost includes RDM because it's so low here and can easily be replaced with the extremely mobile/high damage SMN.

It's not fair, indeed, to be so far behind the SMN (1K DPS behind for the MCH on a lone target), a job as mobile as a ranged but with extra support.

MCH could have a very slight buff, the only thing, in my opinion would be to halve Wildfire's cooldown, that would be around 400-500 dps increase. I would love to see a small buff on Bio Blaster, it's our only alternative for AoE but is a very small gain against 2 targets. Half of Alexander Ultimate is against 2 targets.
BRD and DNC needs a straight potency buff, the dot nerf was not a nerf for the BRD overrall but balancing for its rDPS. However, it was absolutely not needed.

There is one reason as to why you should bring a ranged DPS in your group.
Is it the mobility? Hell no.
Is it the refresh, palisade, dismantle, tp song? That's gone.
Is it the Tactician/Troubadour/Samba? Unmend salutes you, despite the Cooldown reduction, mitigation is never the reason.
Is it for its DPS? They're at the bottoms.

It's the 1% stats brought to the group because you exist. That's the whole reason why you should always have a ranged DPS.
The ranged DPS spot is forced upon groups, that's the only reason why you should get a ranged and that's why it feels unfair. Obviously a ranged should never reach the same damages as a melee for obvious reasons, but we're so shitty SE forces people to get a ranged DPS.

but you have to see, the moment the physical ranged come into the range of but 300 dps to the top every single group would instantly drop all their melees aswell as casters to run with 4 physical ranged so we cant have that.

World first groups would do it (which is totally terrible and WAY worse than bringing a single physical ranged for the buff and never in a 100 years a second one, they would never still at least bring 1 caster+1melee for the buffs+lb) and every single not progress group would of course do the same.

I mean, Statics struggling to recruit of course would also pass up that one totally awesome and chill melee that does better then the rest of the group because it doesn't fit into their 4 phys ranged meta just as partyfinder would never in a 100 years take a caster because it offers a 1% buff and they don't really give a flying fuck if the mechanics are handled by a caster or a phys ranged, just how much dps is done at the end of it, never ever would this happen.

and taking a melee ? get real, melee lb is for sissys, and uptime strats are incredibly demanding on the group, most of the time you even have to think for 5 seconds which 2 spots for a mechanic are closest to the boss, no way in hell people will ever do this if its not worth at least 5% dps .

if not for melees dragging everyone down the all ranged meta would just allways split up and dance around the arena like ninjas, i mean who needs to split up stack markers or maybe stay in generally the same location to get hit by healing or because its the only place from which to safely do mechanics anyways ? with 4 ranged you could do such fun things as do black smokers 5 meters farther away from the tank, or just drop half the arena full with the panto puddle marks, its way easier if everyone just runs around like a headless chicken instead of moving in a group.

[CKNovel]

Snip

My healers would kill me if I did not stacked at max melee or close enough for their heals. That's also the irony, the ability to attack from very far is in fact a problem for aoe healing.
90% of the time, ranged are at melee ranged for stars, PLD wings, defensive buff and else. So no, 4 ranged would not run like headless chicken.
Of course I never pointed out that rangeds DPS should do the same damage as melees, there should be a 500 DPS gap maximum, because it's what you're loosing if you fail all your positionnals as a DRG. And let's get real, if you're hitting the boss frontside all the time, you ask to be replaced for a ranged DPS.

We need to get real, ranged tax exist to avoid the 1 melee scenario. But currently it's way too high, especially with the existence of the unbalanced SMN.

[Akiudo]

My healers would kill me if I did not stacked at max melee or close enough for their heals. That's also the irony, the ability to attack from very far is in fact a problem for aoe healing.
90% of the time, ranged are at melee ranged for stars, PLD wings, defensive buff and else. So no, 4 ranged would not run like headless chicken.
Of course I never pointed out that rangeds DPS should do the same damage as melees, there should be a 500 DPS gap maximum, because it's what you're loosing if you fail all your positionnals as a DRG. And let's get real, if you're hitting the boss frontside all the time, you ask to be replaced for a ranged DPS.

We need to get real, ranged tax exist to avoid the 1 melee scenario. But currently it's way too high, especially with the existence of the unbalanced SMN.

gotta admit, i thought my sarcasm was strong enough, reading your post i'm not sure that is actually true, though that may aswell be on my reading comprehension here.

though i might also add to your comment just as a little cherry on top that even taking 1 melee invalidates most "uptime strat" concerns, because thats the literally latest point at which a group will do them either way, and the difference between 1 and 2 melees at this point can be boiled down to "do we put 1 person in the circle/square closest to the boss or 2 people in the 2 closest circles/squares. if this is different in any place that would potentially be ultimate but in that case so what ? these groups are gonna take whats best anyways, as long as 1 per role is set and the last spot is generally "free" thats perfectly fine. (and half the fight is designed incredibly friendly to bard and this group still took 2 casters, not 2 physicals)

[Doozer]

I don't know what game you're playing but average content would mean Leveling Dungeon. Endgame normal content would be normal raid where DPS doesn't matter. DPS only matters in savage and ultimate content.

Clearly there was a miscommunication. When I said 'average' content, I meant everything from trials, dungeons, alliance raids, and normal raids. Everything except savage and ultimate. Not just 'leveling dungeon'. How is that considered the only 'average content'?

[CKNovel]

Clearly there was a miscommunication. When I said 'average' content, I meant everything from trials, dungeons, alliance raids, and normal raids. Everything except savage and ultimate. Not just 'leveling dungeon'. How is that considered the only 'average content'?

Not the subject here but if you exclude savage and ultimate, you fall in the context where DPS doesn't matter and people barely try to push numbers.
Leveling dungeon and normal trials would be average as they have no enrage and near impossible to fail with people knowing the basics.

Alliance raid are mechanically harder but it stops here, there's really nothing difficult as long as you pay half attention to what's going on and can't technically loose.

As for TEA discussion:
There's currently one (or two if it was done) clear with MCH
BRD and DNC are popular for reasons I can't list because I can only assume those.

For BRD, I would say that the healing buff really helps the MT on the slaps the tanks take, but also works better as a "proc based" job and not resource based such as the MCH. I'm not exactly sure about the DNC, though, maybe because it works crazy well with the top DPS, SMN/MNK/BLM/SAM ?
I'm honestly convinced that MCH is not the most popular as it's harder to prog with it due to the lack of support.

Also, even on multiple targets, BRD will still be outshined, DNC will never reach a MNK numbers on TEA two first phase. The gap is simply too large.

[Akiudo]

Not the subject here but if you exclude savage and ultimate, you fall in the context where DPS doesn't matter and people barely try to push numbers.
Leveling dungeon and normal trials would be average as they have no enrage and near impossible to fail with people knowing the basics.

Alliance raid are mechanically harder but it stops here, there's really nothing difficult as long as you pay half attention to what's going on and can't technically loose.

As for TEA discussion:
There's currently one (or two if it was done) clear with MCH
BRD and DNC are popular for reasons I can't list because I can only assume those.

For BRD, I would say that the healing buff really helps the MT on the slaps the tanks take, but also works better as a "proc based" job and not resource based such as the MCH. I'm not exactly sure about the DNC, though, maybe because it works crazy well with the top DPS, SMN/MNK/BLM/SAM ?
I'm honestly convinced that MCH is not the most popular as it's harder to prog with it due to the lack of support.

Also, even on multiple targets, BRD will still be outshined, DNC will never reach a MNK numbers on TEA two first phase. The gap is simply too large.

brd (i assume dancer for the same reason, no idea really) is popular because its gain form having 2 enemies is gigantic compared to most other classes,

going form 1 to 2 enemies you gain
the capability to multidot, both dots are strong enough on their own to be our strongest skills sans apex arrow
extra reportoire proccs do to having more dots up (extra pitch perfect/blodletter proccs)
more apex arrows, which also hits multiple targets even though its a single target finisher (also do to more reportoire proccs as thats what fills the apex arrow gauge)
you can change blodletter (150 potency, 15 second cooldown) with bloodletter (130 potency, so 260 at 2 targets, shared cooldown with bloodletter)
you can exchange our filler from burst shot/refulgant arrow (dunno, 265~ potency? feel free to do the math, 230+35% chance for a procc allowing you a 330 attack instead once) with quick nock (150 potencyx2 so 300 potency total+30% chance for a reset of rain of death (so an extra 260 potency) on every quick knock.)

Basically our very literal filler skill gets a boost of 120~ potency when we change from 1 targets to 2 targets aswell as extra proccs for our reportoire skills and extra chances to dot which offer even more potency